Why Do Pharmacists Earn So Much $$?

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<p>"Why are so many pharmacists earning 6 figs directly out of college, which is more than a ****ing engineer?! All they do is hand over a dang bottle of pills and, if I'm not mistaken, mix chemicals to make them?"</p>

<p>I was about to become a pharmacist (both of my parents were pharmacists, so you can see where the influence came from), and I've spent a lot of time volunteering in the pharmacy, so I can tell you firsthand that pharmacy is probably one of the more complicated fields. Personally, I've never understood the hype about engineering. It seems to me that they get to do a job where everything is of their own design, a freedom that most people don't get to have. </p>

<p>"1. Why do they make so much? And will it continue through year 2012 when I graduate college?"</p>

<p>The short answers are because they do a whole lot, and yes, it will continue. Pharmacists, especially in the hospital setting, become much more than pill-pushers. They become mini-doctors and nurses, monitoring patient's vital signs, designing drug regimens, evaluating patient's conditions, etc. Of course they're not allowed to diagnose conditions, but rather treat the ailment(s). Pharmacy requires one to have an EXTENSIVE background in chemistry, phyisiology, and biochemistry. The pharmacist must know how a drug will interact with a patient (based on existing conditions and ailments), how much to give, and how long it should be recieved. If it is a very specific ailment, the pharmacist and pharm techs must know how to create the drug needed, or dilute/concentrate another drug to a desired strength. It's not just randomly mixing chemicals in a lab, but rather a painstakingly calculated process. </p>

<p>Pharmacists hold the lives of the people they treat in their hands - a drug they give may have an interaction with another a patient is already taking, they may have a reaction, they may have a wrong dosage. They have control over all sort of harmless and also very harmful drugs (morphine, xanax, etc.) that they must monitor the intake and release of. That responsibility falls on the head of the pharmacist. Give them credit, it takes a lot. </p>

<p>"2. People say that pharmacists' role will evolve. What do they mean by this as in will their routine change or what?"</p>

<p>As I said before, they don't just stay behind a counter, they're at patient's bedsides - just like the nurses and doctors. They're an integral part of the healthcare team. They also have more expansive administrative duties, moving into the business sector. The pharmacist is more intergral and expanded - evolving in that sense. </p>

<p>"3. How long does it take after high school to become one?"</p>

<p>Typically, if you go directly out of high school, 6 years. 2 in undergrad (completing prereqs), 4 in pharmacy school. You recieve a Pharm.D. Many people go for other degrees as well - MBAs are common, Ph.Ds are becoming more popular. There are some dual pharmacy programs in which you can recieve a Pharm.D/Ph.D. Most of the people that I know who are in pharmacy school right say it isn't worth the stress, and that they'd rather take the extra 5-6 years.</p>

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<p>PharmD's make a higher salary than engineers because they are much more valuable. Engineers are a dime a dozen and all it takes is a BS. There are very few pharmD programs in the country. Try to get in and see what happens.</p>

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<p>
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Most retail pharmacists are not "doctors." In my community, most are Masters level pharmacists.

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This is just wrong. The degree to be a dispensing pharmacist used to be a five-year bachelors degree. Now the entry level degree is a PharmD. There was never a masters level degree for clinical practice. In fact, if memory serves me, Florida was one of the first states to switch over to the PharmD from the BSPharm.</p>

<p>The other route a person can take to work in R&D for a pharmaceutical company is to get the PharmD or the BS in chemistry, and then pursue a doctoral degree (PhD) in some aspect of pharmacy, such as pharmacology, medicinal chemistry, etc.</p>

<p>Why do they get paid so well? Salary takes into account:
1. Years of education (6>4)
2. Hours worked (which can be substantially over 40 in retail, as well as evenings, weekends, nights and holidays)
3. Precident (the salaries are never going to go down)
4. Geographic location (salaries are higher in places with high cost of living and in rural areas with a lack of pharmacy services)
5. Expanding professional duties (increased responsibilities and wider areas of practice specialties)
6. Supply and demand (at the current rate of licensure, there will be a shortage of 157,000 pharmacists in the US by 2020.)</p>

<p>At this time, pharmacist salaries are increasing 22.3% faster than the average for other professions. Like it or not, that's the fact. </p>

<p>(FWIW, I think engineers should be paid more than they are. They are also highly educated and carry a lot of liability).</p>

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<p>Well, I hate to admit it, but sometimes they make errors - either by forgetting to fill a refilled prescription or by giving out the incorrect drug to the patient - and both of these incidents have happened to me personally, but I was able to call them on it right away, so there definitely needs to be more quality control - especially at the big drug store chains. There are pharmaceutical students working/interning at these chain stores, and if they make an error, the pharmacist on duty is still responsible for making the correction, but I found from my own personal experience that the students that I was dealing with were not detail oriented enough and should be more on the ball.</p>

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<p>As a result of these experiences, I don't have anything to do with the large drug store chains.</p>

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<p>It is true, nyumom, that the pharmacist on duty is responsible for the student interns and technicians, errors and all. Both the employer and the pharmacist carry malpractice insurance because frankly people make mistakes and pharmaceutical mistakes can be catastrophic. Maybe this is one more reason their salaries are as high as they are...liability.</p>

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<p>Well you want to know why pharmacists make so much money? Im a second year pharmacy student at ferris state univeristy. I did 4 years undergrad and got my chemistry and biology degree. Now i have 2 more years (out of 4) of pharmacy school. I will have a title of Dr., what will you have? Im going to be in school for a total of 8 years, you did 4. I have to know everything about pharmacokinetics and pharmacodynamics. If your in the hospital one day, guess who makes sure you get the best medicinal care possible...yes..me, because its me that makes your IV's, IM's and dispenses your drugs while checking for adverse drug reactions, and allergy reactions. So before you blow your top, get your facts straight. </p>

<p>PharmD. Canidate</p>

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<p>take an econ course: supply, demand, human capital, signaling</p>

<p>look up these 4 and they should give u a little idea...</p>

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<p>
[quote]
As for the need; that is because not everyone can be a Pharmacist. School is tedious and if everyone could do it then we would not have a shortage.

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</p>

<p>A LOT of people can be pharmacists. Universities just artificially create a shortage of them. Duh. There's tons of people applying with degrees that have 4.0s and they don't get in. Not to mention, that is insane and retarded. Why do we want the smartest people to be pharmacists when they could be engineers or scientists? That degree that they get isn't really a doctorates degree and most people would agree to that. One year out of three or 4 is devoted to experience at different pharmacy jobs. You can get a PharmD in 5 years or even 4 1/2 if you rush the first 2 undergraduate years.</p>

<p>Remember C = PharmD</p>

<p>
[quote]
Pharmacist more than deserve the money they make. They a lot of responsibility and they have to be on top of their game. YOUR LIFE is in their hand!!! Your doctor can slip up with your medications but it is the pharmacist that cannot let it pass them by!!! Consider chemotherapy agents and mixes are prepared by pharmacist according to individual patient needs. Consider what their true job is.

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</p>

<p>Are you kidding me? They already make as much as a senior engineer or senior software engineer out of college. With over time they make 150000-200000. There's like absolutely no more compounding pharmacists because all the drugs are already made. Of course a pharmacist also doesn't need to know all of the drugs because it would be impossible, and they just look at the drug info on their computer or bottle anyways. Do you have to keep up with the times as much as an engineer or software engineer? Not even close.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
Why do we want the smartest people to be pharmacists when they could be engineers or scientists?

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</p>

<p>That's assuming, of course, that the people with the highest GPAs necessarily are flocking to pharmacy and are in fact the "smartest" people.</p>

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With over time they make 150000-200000.

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</p>

<p>This is unlikely and unusual at best. Most pharmacists make six-figures, but never that sort of money.</p>

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Do you have to keep up with the times as much as an engineer or software engineer? Not even close.

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</p>

<p>This statement is inherently meaningless, because it assumes that any particular profession has more to "keep up with" than another. Pharmacists are probably keeping up with just as much new information as anyone else.</p>

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<p>Probably have to keep up even more. There are constantly new drugs and new uses for old drugs, new information on disease and treatment, as well as changing laws. Pharmacists have to complete a designated number of continuing education credits to be eligible to renew their licenses every two years. So I can guarantee you that working pharmacists are forced to "keep up".</p>

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<p>
[quote]
That's assuming, of course, that the people with the highest GPAs necessarily are flocking to pharmacy and are in fact the "smartest" people.

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</p>

<p>I'm pretty sure they're almost all over the 80th percentile of all college people. A masters degree is fine for a pharmacist. Don't know why they need all that education in California.</p>

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This is unlikely and unusual at best. Most pharmacists make six-figures, but never that sort of money.

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</p>

<p>Job</a> Search Results on CareerBuilder.com</p>

<p>This is base pay for pharmacist (90000+). A lot of them have the option of more hours which equals a ton more money. Not to mention, they're making these salaries in places where 40000 is tops.</p>

<p>
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This statement is inherently meaningless, because it assumes that any particular profession has more to "keep up with" than another. Pharmacists are probably keeping up with just as much new information as anyone else.

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</p>

<p>Like I said, a pharmacist doesn't need to memorize 10% of the drugs in the world. Hell, you don't even have to know any. It's all checked on the computer, and a lot of places have you wait 20 minutes so they can figure it out. lol. You can do mail order pharmacy and live like a king. The only thing that's difficult in pharmacy is reading what the doctor wrote on the prescription. lol You can get a D on the licensing exam and still be a pharmacist.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Probably have to keep up even more. There are constantly new drugs and new uses for old drugs, new information on disease and treatment, as well as changing laws. Pharmacists have to complete a designated number of continuing education credits to be eligible to renew their licenses every two years. So I can guarantee you that working pharmacists are forced to "keep up".

[/quote]
</p>

<p>It was about 20 hours every year. An IT professional has waaay more keeping up than that. Even then, pharmacists don't have to KNOW IT to be SUCCESSFUL so your point is moot.</p>

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<p>Wow, you are both rude and uninformed. Coupled with general arrogance and bitterness about the pharmacy profession, it is quite something to read. Maybe the next time you need pharmacy services, you can just get the nearest uneducated person to answer your questions at all hours of the day and night, fill your prescriptions, hassle with your insurance carrier, prepare your sterile IV's, monitor your labs, prepare your radioactive pharmaceuticals, attend your CPR, check your drug interactions, recommend therapy to your doctor, immunize you, monitor your health problems, advise you on OTC products, make sure your child is dosed properly and make sure your elderly mother in the nursing home isn't chemically restrained into a stupor. Oh, and make sure that random person doesn't mind doing it at 3am and on Christmas Day. And make that quick please.</p>

<p>Oh, and please don't consider suing us if we make a mistake, because we don't have to be all that smart.</p>

<p>If pharmacy is so lucrative and easy, why don't YOU do it? Seriously, I don't understand your venomous attitude.</p>

<p>(end of rant)</p>

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<p>My doctor diagnoses and treats me, but I rely on my pharmacist for a lot of valuable input. He is amazing in how much he knows, he always checks on what other medications I am taking, makes sure there are no drug interactions, cautions me about certains foods, and just seems to be not only knowledgeable and up-to-date , but caring too.</p>

<p>In fact, I believe that pharmacists may have an edge over doctors, as far as understanding medication (as opposed to disease)</p>

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<p>Program1,</p>

<p>
[quote]
This is base pay for pharmacist (90000+). A lot of them have the option of more hours which equals a ton more money. Not to mention, they're making these salaries in places where 40000 is tops.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Right, but you're forgetting that pharmacists have fewer options to "move up" and earn more past the base salary. Base salary is not necessarily an accurate indicator of future potential.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Like I said, a pharmacist doesn't need to memorize 10% of the drugs in the world. Hell, you don't even have to know any. It's all checked on the computer, and a lot of places have you wait 20 minutes so they can figure it out. lol. You can do mail order pharmacy and live like a king. The only thing that's difficult in pharmacy is reading what the doctor wrote on the prescription. lol You can get a D on the licensing exam and still be a pharmacist.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>This is fallacious at best and untrue at worst. Pharmacists need to have a good understanding of how drugs interact. There's a lot more to it than just dishing out pills.</p>

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<p>My SIL is a pharmacist. She took four semesters of pharmacology -- med students take one semester. She's also saved my dad's life twice by recognizing extremely unusual allergic reactions to medications (and their ingredients). </p>

<p>I'm on some pretty serious medications and SIL knows how they interact and what I should look out for MUCH better than my oncologist. Even my internist tells me to check with the pharmacist for interactions when she gives me something new.</p>

<p>In many parts of the country, pharmacists are in seriously short supply -- which means that employers are willing to pay more. SIL gets recruited by competitors all the time!</p>

<p>But I bet the folks complaining about pharmacists are the same ones who begrudge my SIL getting off her feet for 10 minutes out of a 10+ hour shift to wolf down a sandwich (since part of the Corporate America that runs pharmacies also seem to believe that pharmacists are just pill pushers) rather than jumping to fill their script.</p>

<p>The reason scripts take 20 minutes to fill is that the pharmacist is often on the phone with your insurance company trying to convince the non-health care professional on the other end of the line to get your drugs authorized. And woe to the pharmacist who can't account for every freakin' pill in the building. Drug audits are a special form of H%$#.</p>

37

<p>
[quote]
Wow, you are both rude and uninformed. Coupled with general arrogance and bitterness about the pharmacy profession, it is quite something to read. Maybe the next time you need pharmacy services, you can just get the nearest uneducated person to answer your questions at all hours of the day and night, fill your prescriptions, hassle with your insurance carrier, prepare your sterile IV's, monitor your labs, prepare your radioactive pharmaceuticals, attend your CPR, check your drug interactions, recommend therapy to your doctor, immunize you, monitor your health problems, advise you on OTC products, make sure your child is dosed properly and make sure your elderly mother in the nursing home isn't chemically restrained into a stupor. Oh, and make sure that random person doesn't mind doing it at 3am and on Christmas Day. And make that quick please.

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</p>

<p>You're giving me examples of responsibilities of different pharmacy fields. No pharmacist does all that. Why do nuclear pharmacist even need a Pharm.D? The Pharm.D is waaaay too broad. </p>

<p>
[quote]
Oh, and please don't consider suing us if we make a mistake, because we don't have to be all that smart.

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</p>

<p>When does a pharmacist ever get sued? Their insurance is much cheaper than a doctor's.</p>

<p>
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If pharmacy is so lucrative and easy, why don't YOU do it? Seriously, I don't understand your venomous attitude.

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</p>

<p>Maybe because I wasn't fortunate enough to have the money to even pursue it. I was also held back in preschool so I don't want to do 8+ years of schooling in California. I'm at the 80 percentile I guess because I can get a 1200 SAT. The hard part is getting in. It's a cake walk to get the Pharm.D.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Right, but you're forgetting that pharmacists have fewer options to "move up" and earn more past the base salary. Base salary is not necessarily an accurate indicator of future potential.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>An engineer or a software engineer have little room to move up too. The highest position most will get is senior engineer. They make roughly the same as a pharmacist. In California, an engineering degree takes 5 years. </p>

<p>My point is obviously pharmacists are making more than what they should because it's one of the few degrees where the colleges purposely create a shortage. 99.9999% of people who apply get turned away and it makes no sense to me. I'm not sure, but I think Europe values pharmacists much less than the U.S. I'd have to look it up again.</p>

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<p>Pharmacists are educated extensively in many areas, and then some specialty areas beyond that. It can be difficult work with long undesirable hours, heavy work load and a lot of responsibility to be accurate (both academically and physically). Pharmacists are fired and sued for mistakes, btw. They do constant CE (requirements vary by state). </p>

<p>Several new pharmacy schools have sprung up in recent years, but there is still a shortage. Part of the reason is limited resources of colleges. They can only really train a certain number of people at a time (the same as other professional schools and restricted majors at some colleges). The other reason for a shortage is that people are living longer and this spawned a great increase in long term care pharmacy and home infusion services. </p>

<p>Frankly, I don't think I am paid nearly enough (nowhere near 6 figures). There's really nothing else I can say....</p>

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<p>
[quote]
My point is obviously pharmacists are making more than what they should because it's one of the few degrees where the colleges purposely create a shortage.

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</p>

<p>One of the few?</p>

<p>How about almost every field? Every professional field is purposely set up to create a shortage to an extent. You think it's a mistake that medical schools admit so few students and there have been so few new medical schools in recent years?</p>

<p>Engineering undergrad degrees do not take 5 years in CA. They take 4. </p>

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It's a cake walk to get the Pharm.D.

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</p>

<p>Source?</p>

<p>
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An engineer or a software engineer have little room to move up too. The highest position most will get is senior engineer. They make roughly the same as a pharmacist. In California, an engineering degree takes 5 years.

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</p>

<p>You missed the point. Pharmacists aren't making, on average, the figures you quoted before. Plus, factoring in the sunk and opportunity costs, they make arguably make less in NPV terms than engineers.</p>

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<p>You know, this bothers me:

[quote]
Maybe because I wasn't fortunate enough to have the money to even pursue it. I was also held back in preschool so I don't want to do 8+ years of schooling in California. I'm at the 80 percentile I guess because I can get a 1200 SAT.

[/quote]

Discounting your nasty attitude, I just have some advice:
1. Pharmacy school takes 6 years, not 8.
2. Don't blame a year of preschool for problems 15 years later.
3. Most pharmacy students I know have big loans and work part time as well, so you would have lots of company there. In fact, I know kids who borrowed every dollar beyond their paychecks.
4. I can't really comment on you grades, but I agree with you that it might be tough to get admitted with those stats, at least where I live.</p>

<p>Where there is a will, there is a way. Whether in pharmacy or engineering or w/e, you will be more successful if you have a positive attitude and look for ways to overcome obstacles, rather than wallowing in negative thoughts.</p>