<p>Harvard sent me an application because of the PSAT, too. I mean yes, I’m doing National Merit, but on the PSAT I indicated that I was graduating early and majoring in Social Work… This is no longer the case, but if Harvard paid any attention to this, then maybe they would have realized (1) it would be too late for me to apply this application season and (2) they don’t have a social work major. But hey, my plans have since changed, and I’ll probably apply (hello, Celtic Languages and Literature). So maybe that was the point?</p>
<p>hahah apply anyway.</p>
<p>Re: post 17. Let’s just fool with the numbers here. There are 16,000 NMSM - which , I think may be the source of the list. From my modest knowledge of such things, each mailing probably cost around $4.00 (that’s a low figure). So , that’s $64,000 to find one kid. That’s not a very effective use of funds. I would have rather seen that money go to scholarships - it’s a full ride and a good-sized partial. Or how about a serious outreach program to the underclass in Cambridge?</p>
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<p>I don’t think that it is that straightforward.</p>
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<p>I expect that it is more than one, perhaps a couple dozen.</p>
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<p>Arguing for a net detriment is different from your original claim:</p>
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<p>"So , that’s $64,000 to find one kid. That’s not a very effective use of funds. I would have rather seen that money go to scholarships - it’s a full ride and a good-sized partial. Or how about a serious outreach program to the underclass in Cambridge? "</p>
<p>Harvard’s surveys of their students have indicated that the large majority were contacted as high school seniors by one of Harvard’s outreach efforts. This included tens of thousands of students who weren’t National Merit finalists. I’m fairly sure that Harvard buys lists of students taking the ACT, SAT, and SAT II scores as well as PSAT, and Harvard doesn’t just contact students in the 95th percentile or so on those tests.</p>
<p>Harvard’s methods seem to be working for Harvard. If Harvard didn’t find what they were doing to be an effective use of their funds, they’d do something else. What they are doing its into its mission. </p>
<p>Meanwhile, they have a variety of outreach programs to low income people and students. Their financial aid packages are the country’s most generous. They have no reason to provide full rides, etc. to students who can afford to pay and will come to Harvard anyway.</p>
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Well, they send out more than that, and likely get more than one student for their efforts. But hey, let’s run with you worst case scenario numbers. What if they spent $64,000 to recruit one student? Assuming that student wasn’t in deep financial need, then that student would be paying a good amount of tuition for 4 years. Let’s say they get 50% covered by financial aid. That’s still $26,000 a year. Over 4 years, our hypothetical student has spent $104,000. That’s a profit of $40,000 for Harvard, which is likely more than the direct expenditures caused by one student. If the student had no need, then they’d have paid $208,000, and Harvard would have made $144,000. Economically, it makes sense for Harvard. They can put that extra cash away for financial aid, if they want.</p>
<p>Of course, that’s assuming they spend that much money on it, and assuming they only get one student. Given that it is extremely unlikely that only one student was yielded from these efforts, multiply that profit by a large number. And then there’s also the profit of having another brilliant student on campus, and another alumni member, who may even donate in the future.</p>
<p>Also, they get application fees from most who apply (unless they get a fee waiver), which helps offset the cost of recruiting potential students.</p>
<p>[Harvard’s methods seem to be working for Harvard. If Harvard didn’t find what they were doing to be an effective use of their funds, they’d do something else. What they are doing its into its mission. ]</p>
<p>Yes, the GIANT system is doing their job well. But you, as an individual who has limit of mental, time, and funding capitals, protect YOURSELF. You dont have to fall into their advertising net; wasting your money, time, and energy.</p>
<p>"Yes, the GIANT system is doing their job well. But you, as an individual who has limit of mental, time, and funding capitals, protect YOURSELF. You dont have to fall into their advertising net; wasting your money, time, and energy. "</p>
<p>What you say is true of any business. Its efforts are on behalf of itself and its mission. The individual always should take care of their own needs. I don’t know why anyone seems to think that colleges act differently than do any other business. Just because I get a brochure in the mail telling me the wonders of a Mercedes doesn’t mean that I qualify to buy one or that’s the best car for me.</p>
<p>Harvard sends about 50,000 of those letters to rising Seniors around the country every year.</p>
<p>Okay, to be somewhat more clear - I think that sending an entire paper copy of the common app with the Harvard supplement in a big, glossy, heavy mailing to all the highest scoring PSAT takers (probably SM, maybe commended - I don’t know fore sure) is not very effective at all. It seems unlikely to me that any kids who applied and were accepted at Harvard only did so after getting a huge mailing. Certainly the kids I know of - smart middle/upper class kids in the MA suburbs, attending private schools - didn’t need this package to turn their eyes toward Harvard.
This very large mailing seems to be new - none of the kids I know who were recent (past one to three years) NM commended/semi-finalists got one. All these kids have very similar profiles to the kids I know who got one this year. So , it may be an experiment.</p>
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<p>Harvard apparently disagrees and likely has data to back it up.</p>
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<p>I personally know someone who applied because of receiving something from Harvard when they didn’t expect to. They were eventually waitlisted. Because this is the only person from my school who even came close to being accepted, I imagine that there are many, many more cases around the country each year. To say that no one falls under that category is absurd.</p>
<p>There are quite a few people, even competitive applicants, who are under the false impression that their scores don’t even make them eligible to apply.</p>
<p>Mmm, how did I miss this thread for so long?</p>
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<p>Although I considered applying to Harvard in the beginning of my junior year, I never thought I would have a chance or took the idea seriously until one day, out of nowhere, I received a very kindly phrased letter from Harvard encouraging me to apply. Nemom, maybe your family lives in an environment where it is commonplace for students to be applying to the most selective schools like HYPS etc., but at my high school it is rather unusual for anyone to be looking at these schools seriously because the idea that one may be accepted and still afford to attend is so out of ordinary, so out of reach. I don’t know how much difference that letter or that common application and supplement sent by the Harvard admissions office made a difference in my decision to apply, but I remember clearly that my parents were amused by the idea that I would ever one day be accepted.</p>
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<p>There lies part of the problem, nemom— you’re so familiar with the private school, competitive and academically rigorous atmosphere that you neglected to take into account the majoritiy of the U.S. high school population who do not attend private schools geared towards getting students into top colleges. The almost $80 application fee is considered to be a lot of money for many people, and most parents I know encouraged their kids to apply to local colleges because top schools seem unaffordable, not understanding that the financial aid at Harvard is actually extremely generous. </p>
<p>Harvard may send out thousands of these common apps out to all the students that the adcoms think may benefit from their education, and if only a few of those students applied because of it, got in, and later benefited from being a part of the academic institution, then I think the whole effort is worthwhile.</p>
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<p>Well, it was definitely there last year. Actually, it’s interesting how people criticize Harvard for sending out the common app when, in my own experience, Harvard was absolutely the school that sent out the least amount of mailing (in comparison to Yale, MIT, Caltech, etc.).</p>
<p>Y’all seem to be assuming that Harvard is spending this marketing money in order to “find” additional applicants to admit. Harvard already has too many applicants to admit. In the admissions arms race, however, every elite college–including Harvard–is always seeking new ways to increase the number of applicants, and thus the number of applicants to reject. The greater the percentage of applicants rejected, the better.</p>
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<p>First of all, you’re assuming that the admission office has access to all the information you have provided on the PSAT, which may not be the case. Secondly, as you said, students’ choice of major can change dramatically from one year to another. And thirdly, having to hire someone to shift through all the PSAT profiles to filter out the ones that won’t be interested in the school may cost more than the postage and common app fee, so it may be more monetarily efficient to simply send out mailings to everyone on the list. And lastly, isn’t possible to pursue a career in social work if you don’t major in social work? Your college choices may be severely limited if you’re only looking for places with that specific major.</p>
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<p>Perhaps that would make the college seem more selective, but is there any additional benefit to it? After all, they’ll have to hire additional admission officers to read through the applications, etc.</p>
<p>pbr, Harvard isn’t looking for more applicants to admit, they’re looking for better applicants to admit.</p>
<p>"This very large mailing seems to be new - none of the kids I know who were recent (past one to three years) NM commended/semi-finalists got one. All these kids have very similar profiles to the kids I know who got one this year. So , it may be an experiment. "</p>
<p>For decades, Harvard has been sending mailings to tens of thousands of students encouraging them to consider applying to Harvard. Both of my sons – age 26, 22, got such mailings, and as I mentioned before, most Harvard students got at least one mailing from Harvard encouraging them to apply.</p>
<p>I bet that Harvard sends more mailings to students outside of the Boston/ New England top public/prep schools than to students who go to such schools. That’s because the type of students whom you referred to are very familiar with Harvard, and also can get lots of help from informed guidance counselors. After all, there are some public schools in the Boston area that send 30 students to Harvard each year.</p>
<p>The mailings particularly are effective with top students who don’t come from prep schools and elite private high schools in New England and urban areas in the Northeast. Such students may not realize that Harvard may be attainable and affordable for them. They also may not know what Harvard offers.</p>
<p>I agree with pbr. Harvard sends the mailings in order to improve the quality of its student body including attracting applicants from low socioeconomic groups, URMs, students from rural areas, underrepresented states, and high schools that never have sent someone to Harvard. It want to continue to improve the diversity, depth, and talents of its student body.</p>
<p>Regarding the mailing out of letters from Harvard-</p>
<p>I come from an area where, in the past 20 years, one person has gone on to an Ivy League school. It’s a poor area that is incredibly underrepresented at top schools - our valedictorian of last year’s graduating class was beyond ecstatic when he got into Tulane.</p>
<p>A year ago, I would have laughed at the notion that I was eligible to apply to Harvard. For me, the name itself carries something of a mystic quality. For those who live in the Northeast and/or attend strong high schools, the mailing out of letters may be unnecessary. But getting a packet from Harvard that encouraged me to apply was, for me, a huge wake up call. A year ago, I was a low-income URM clueless about how good of a chance I had at top schools. My 2180 SAT score at the end of sophomore year woke me up a bit, but all the packets I received really got me interested in the process. So I wouldn’t say that these packets/letters/etc. are useless, especially for kids like me from areas with almost no one who goes on to a top-50 school.</p>
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<p>QFT.</p>
<p>The mailings I received from some elite schools after taking some standardized exams made them vague application possibilities. Prior to that, my life plan was to go to a local school for nursing, as that was the most lucrative job I could think of.</p>
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<p>I had hoped to land a 9-5 shift at the local 7-Eleven. Oh, how times have changed! :)</p>
<p>Like many others have said, Harvard is not the only school to do this. It does seem, however, that harvard is one of the main schools that seems to truly benefit from this.</p>