<p>As wumanizer established in a previous thread, his name is actually a clever pun on his own name. Once you understand that, you should take no offense.</p>
<p>I’ve always thought of WashU as Case Western with a better PR department. Neither is located in cities attractive to outsiders, though both are nice enough once you get there - neither one is Detroit. I also think it’s a good example of a school that can be ranked as low as #37 and still be a school that doesn’t seem all that much different from schools ranked 20 positions higher. In terms of actual education experience, we’re talking differences of inches, not miles. Virtually anyone good enough to get into Case would be assured of a great education.</p>
<p>For those who do want a decent backup, as established on another thread, you can apply to Case with no supplemental essay and no application fee - you basically just have to click the button on the Common App. D wasn’t planning on applying, but when she saw that it was free with no additional work, she figured why not, since she was ready for her ED school anyway and she could still apply EA as of Saturday. A nice one to have in reserve, should higher ranked picks fall through.</p>
<p>I didn’t go to Case, so I don’t know much about it, but I don’t understand what’s with all the ragging on Cleveland. It’s actually a great city, and the part of the city that Case is in is amazing, with one of the best orchestras in the world, and an art museum that can rival the Met. We have an amazing theater district, a burgeoning Downtown, hip artsy neighborhoods. Yes, there is a lot of ghetto still, but Cleveland is on the up and up. Upwards of 10 Billion dollars have been invested in the city in the past decade, and the momentum is continuing. They just built a brand new museum of contemporary art near Case, a new mixed use apartment-restaurant-retail development called Uptown (the second phase which they’re building now will have an urban bowling alley/bar), a new BRT line, new Rapid (heavy rail) stations, and that’s all essentially on Case’s campus. I guess I should understand the hate, given Cleveland’s past, but I just can’t stand to hear the town I love so much, one of the only places I would choose to live, derided so much by outsiders.</p>
<p>case is a top notch school in all fields…
cleveland is a dump but, case western is there just like penn, u of chicago, columbia,usc etc are in terrible areas but they have no problem getting students to apply and attend.</p>
<p>And yet year after year Case graduates shoulder debt loads much heavier than graduates of comparable universities. In 2011, 59% of students took out loans to attend Case Western, with the average borrower owing almost $40,000 at graduation (around $10,000 higher than the mean debt load for private universities). That being said, Case has a very low default rate, suggesting its graduates are getting jobs which are sufficient to pay off the loans.</p>
<p>Have you ever been to the part of Cleveland that Case is in? University Circle is NOT a dump, nor is Little Italy next door, or downtown, or many areas in Cleveland. </p>
<p>As for Columbia…I’m thinking you haven’t spent much time in Morningside Heights either…? You won’t find a 1BR apartment on the west side of Morningside Park for less than half a million, and those will be tiny…</p>
<p>That said, I’ve always understood Case to be pricey compared to public in-state options, with not a lot of aid to make any difference.</p>
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<p>That’s interesting, how do you find this info for Case or other schools?</p>
<p>I have been to both Case and Columbia.
Cleveland is beyond repair.
and I always get a kick out of the nyc apologists bragging about a run down 1br apartment in nyc is 500,000. people love to say how small and expensive/ crappy their nyc digs are. BTW …just because some hipsters have displaced the previous residents with gentrification
in a small area around the university does not make it safe.</p>
<p>My daughter went to Oberlin and we usually stayed in Westlake or near University Circle. Loved Little Italy, parks on the lake, tremont, vintage shops.</p>
<p>oh momof2, if you read I strongly endorsed case western, I have a very close connection to the school ( I did not go there) but to say Cleveland is not a dying/troubled city is disingenuous.</p>
<p>I suppose I take issue with blanket pronouncements like “Cleveland is a dump” and “Cleveland is beyond repair” or Columbia is in “a terrible area” To say you don’t like it or think it’s decaying or whatever is a different thing.</p>
<p>I have no connection to CWU at all. My only connection to Cleveland is as an every-couple-of-months visitor to several friends who live there. I think Little Italy is a great place to hang out, and downtown is looking pretty rejuvenated to me…the Rock Hall, the sports stadiums, the restaurants and bars downtown, heck even the lakefront is getting attention. “Dying” isn’t the word I’d use. But this is my opinion and others may disagree.</p>
<p>Now Columbia…I grew up in that neighborhood when it actually had some crime to speak of - over the 70’s and 80’s when NYC in general was falling apart. I would say it’s one of the safest urban-university areas there is, now (and honestly as a kid-teen wandering around that neighborhood I never had any trouble at all).</p>
<p>In terms of objective measures, Cleveland does, of course, have a lot more crime than NYC.</p>
<p>Boy are you wrong about Morningside Heights, Mr. Z.</p>
<p>Both Riverside Drive and West End Avenue that far uptown have always been comfy (Babe Ruth, Harry Belafonte lived there, LOL), but in the last 15 or so years both Broadway and Amsterdam Avenue near Columbia are nearing Luxury status. The entire Upper West Side of Manhattan has little resemblance to the neighborhood of the 1980s or even the 1990s. I can’t imagine anyone turning down Columbia today because they didn’t want to live in the area. People DEFINITELY want to live near Columbia, including families with children.</p>
<p>You’re right about downtown Cleveland looking much better than in the past, but this masks larger demographic and economic trends that are not favorable. The City of Cleveland lost 17% of its population between 2000 and 2010, falling to a population of just 396,815, down from a peak of 914,808 in 1950. This is, proportionally, about as big a population loss as that suffered by the City of Detroit. And it’s not as if these people are just moving to the suburbs. The entire Cleveland metro area is losing population. Cuyahoga County (Cleveland and most of its suburbs) lost 8.2% of its population over the same period. There’s a reason people are fleeing: the manufacturing sector in and around Cleveland, once the backbone of the area’s economy, has been decimated, and no one thinks it’s coming back any time in the foreseeable future. So yes, Cleveland on the whole is in pretty bad shape and on a downward trajectory, though there are some nice pockets around the university/cultural center, Little Italy, and downtown.</p>
<p>Morningside Heights, on the other hand, has never looked better. Statistically, it is one of the lowest-crime neighborhoods in all of New York City, and since New York City’s crime rate is much lower than most other major American cities, that makes it one of the safest urban neighborhoods in the country. The only reason someone would fear living in Morningside Heights is irrational anti-urban bias.</p>
<p>If one is considering Case Western as a school in the next few years, the long-term prospects for Cleveland are irrelevant - it’s unlikely to burn to the ground in the next 4-5 years and will in all likelihood continue it’s resurgence in the areas around the school.</p>
<p>As for Columbia, we toured Barnard and were told the the surrounding neighborhood is the lowest crime area in all of Manhattan, outside of some non-residential areas in the financial district. Personally, I’d be more worried about the new mayor of New York relaxing policing to an extent that the city as a whole loses its gains against crime in the last 20 years, but again, that’s a long term thing. It’s not like prospective students at either school are buying real estate there.</p>
<p>Zobroward, how long since you’ve been there?
Because I agree it used to be horrible… but now there’s a huge chunk that’s regenerated and really cool. It may be troubled but it’s definitely not dying. Not quite where Pittsburgh is, but not quite Youngstown either.</p>
<p>As for Morningside Heights, it’s become <em>very</em>gentrified. So sure if you leave the neighborhood and go East into the public housing projects it’s dangerous, but the neighbordhood itself is dynamic and really nice. (And the 1br are the opposite of crappy.)</p>
<p>I actually find the new mayor really cool. Never cared about stop-and-frisk, I don’t think that’s how you fix crime and it uses valuable time&resources that could be better used in my opinion. So I’m not really worried. And as you said, college students wouldn’t worry about either town’s long-term development, crime rate, etc. The college neighborhoods are both really nice.</p>
<p>University Circle, the area that Case Western is located, is fantastic. It is a center of museums, Cleveland Orchestra, Cleveland Institute of Music, Cleveland Institute of Art, etc. Little Italy and University Hospitals surround the area. However, just west of University Circle there is East Clevleand - which is not a nice neighborhood. But you don’t have to go to that neighborhood. Stay in University Circle/Little Italy/Cedar Hill/Coventry areas or go downtown to the West 4th Street area or to the flats or Ohio City or Lakewood, etc. There are great venues for theater and music downtown. The House of Blues gets great groups performing, and its easy to get tickets and they are cheap. The touring broadway shows at Play House Square are half the price of broadway tickets. </p>
<p>The posters who are saying that Cleveland is a “dump” or “beyond repair” are just wrong.</p>
<p>Greater Cleveland is actually seeing a lot of young start up companies, some high tech manufacturing coming back, as well as having one of the largest and best hospitals in the country. I believe that in the next 10 years Cleveland will have come back to a level similar to where Pittsburgh is at today.</p>