<p>I read so many threads that tell the posters that they should only talk to their parents about how much the PARENT will pay for education.</p>
<p>Sorry to say, but I don't know many parents that paid for their child's college. Guess what there are loans if you want.</p>
<p>Can the debt be difficult? Yes But also could the benefits of the right education. </p>
<p>I am not saying someone should go and borrow 200,000 for a college, but I also don't see why someone should not even look at schools just because their parent isn't going to be able to pay.</p>
<p>I know I am going to get killed on this very right wing forum, but I know of many people that had to borrow over 100,000 for school. Guess what they ALL are making over 100,000 a year and have been able to pay off those loans and now are happy they decided not to go the low cost college route.</p>
<p>You all need to understand not everyone has the ability to save the kind of money it will take for their children to attend selective schools. And if the parent couldn't save doesn't mean you should just start looking at all safety and community schools. </p>
<p>I guess this forum thinks anyone not making 200,000 should just go to community college and work at McDonalds. Maybe even one day be a manager. Hey someone has to flip their burgers.</p>
<p>Do you have any data other than annecdotes? That is much more persuasive than that you happen to know successful people with 6 figure debt. It is insulting to call this forum right wing–there are many different political viewpoints represented among us parents and other posters.</p>
<p>But your blanket advice isn’t sound either. Not everyone can expect to graduate with a degree that allows them a 100K salary. Should those people take out a 100K loan if they have a lower cost option?</p>
<p>
And hopefully you’re not looking down on someone who goes to the nearby public uni and only accrues $10K in debt over four years. Having a degree from a uni whose MSRP degree is $250K isn’t for everyone and isn’t worth it for many people.</p>
<p>By the way, who will co-sign for the loans? Not all students have anyone who will be able to GET or co-sign loans of $100-250K. There really is a LOT to consider in deciding where to go, including going to inexpensive U and transferring to get degree from dream U as a way to cut costs a bit.</p>
<p>What other options??? Who is borrowing this money for you? No one will lend an 18-year-old $200k. And if someone (like your parents) cosigns for you, then they are borrowing the money, not you, since they need the credit to prove to the bank or the government that they can pay it back.</p>
<p>Just because someone co-signs doesn’t mean THEY borrowed the money.</p>
<p>Do you really believe that if you co-sign for your child’s car that YOU borrowed it? </p>
<p>It is their debt. You might have an interest in that debt being paid, but it isn’t yours. </p>
<p>I have learned a ton on this forum, but sometimes it is so blind that if you are not making a certain amount of money, don’t have 15 ec activities or score higher then 2200 on the sat then you belong in a community college.</p>
<p>OP, do you know that the total undergraduate federal loan amount is capped at $31K for a dependent student and $57K for an independent student? Beyond this amount, you are really going to the dark side.</p>
<p>Edit - have a question about cosigner, OP. Suppose that your parents co-sign $100K loan for you. You get your first job. One year into it, you get layoff. You couldn’t find another job for nine months. Do you think the bank won’t go after your parents for payments if you can’t make it? Both of you are jointly and severally liable for that debt.</p>
<p>Ah… if someone co-signs the loan with you, it IS their debt. If the student drops out or does not pay up, that person is on the hook for the payment. Which generally cannot be discharged, even in bankruptcy (making it just about the worst kind of debt you can possibly take on). And that happens far too often. There are plenty of state universities and directionals that are relatively inexpensive to attend compared to out of state public or private colleges. </p>
<p>If you don’t understand that fact about co-signing, you really need an education yourself… I would suggest a few basic business classes, and include business law in that so you understand contracts a bit better.</p>
<p>If the student defaults on the loan, the cosigner will have to pay. It could happen because a student is irresponsible, because he disappears to some other continent, or because he can’t get a job making enough money to pay, or a variety of other reasons. I know. It happened to my mother and brother and caused bad feelings in the family for many years, though it was not a huge amount of money. You can’t go unless you can get someone who qualifies for those kind of loans to cosign. That may seem an insignificant hurdle to you, but it is a large one for many people. And the idea of taking on that kind of debt is pretty daunting to many people. That is a GOOD thing, that the idea of that much debt gives one pause. Of course, you might argue semantics, it is an abuse of the word ‘can’t,’ if you could get a cosigner.</p>
<p>First of all, this is hardly a “right wing forum.” Most posters here–regardless of political persuasion–think it’s incredibly stupid to go into major debt for college. Especially when it’s possible to have a very successful adult life starting with an education at a state school or CC. There is no “magic” to selective colleges that guarantees their graduates lucrative jobs, despite what you want to believe.</p>
<p>Second, you are EXTREMELY naive about the working world. Do you know how long it would take to pay off $100K in debt? Do you know what starting salaries are for college graduates in different fields? How about the cost of living in different cities? </p>
<p>You say you have “learned a ton” on this forum, but I am not sure what that might be.</p>
<p>Why do you think lenders require co-signers? Not because they expect that the parent will speak sternly to the child or send their child to bed without supper if payments are not made. It’s because if the kid doesn’t pay, they will go after the parent for the money. Sorry, but that debt obligation is indeed the co-signer’s.</p>
<p>The reason why we say ask your parents, is so that you know if they are indeed ready, willing, and able to help you pay for college. If they aren’t then your strategy for finding good options is different than if they can help just a bit, more than just a bit, or a whole lot.</p>
<p>There is no money fairy out there. However, there are a lot of smart and helpful people in the Financial Aid forum. If money is an issue, start there.</p>
<p>Yeah, the OP is pretty out of the touch with the realities of student debt for sure…but I will agree that there is a definate CC bias against applying to schools you know you can’t afford. Maybe our situation is a fluke. 16 apps, 16 acceptances. State schools, large unis, tiny LACs. With about 3/4 of the packages in hand, at this point the one school we know can afford was the biggest reach in every way…the most expensive, the most selective and the biggest leap for stats. Who can tell how these things work?</p>
<p>Another point…contrary to popular belief going to a more selective thereby more expensive school does NOT guarantee you a higher starting salary. Point in fact a close family member is the principal of an elementary school, she has stated that where you get your bachelors degree has no bearing on how much your starting rate of pay is. It is the same for all newly hired teachers in her district regardless of whether they graduated with a bachelors from Princeton or Kean Universities. Any school that claims to produce higher paid gaduates is misleading you. There are many factors outside of the name of an institution on your degree that go into your starting salary. So going into extreme debt for the sake of bragging rights is ridiculous. Even with money to burn I would not condone overspending on an elite bachelors degree. Go to the best school your money can buy.</p>
<p>For the OP -
I am not sure that the other posters have really answered your question. So, I think maybe this will help explain it. </p>
<p>You get into Harvard. It costs 60,000 year. Your parents make 250k a year but don’t think H is worth the 60k a year when you can go to state school for free cause your freaking brilliant ( I mean, you got into H, right?) It just doesn’t make financial sense to them. </p>
<p>You, as a student, are limited to 5,500/6,500 a year in student loans. Even if you take the PLUS loans or whatever, it maybe gets you another 5k a year? something like that. You can’t borrow your parents expected 60k a year contribution. </p>
<p>Now, if your parents make 50k a year, your parents contribution for H or another Ivy might be 1.5k year. That’s nothing. The problem is getting in to those schools. If you get in, you can choose between schools if your family is poor enough because you can borrow your parents contribution and stay within the 31k total for undergrad and the limits per year. I might be off on the exact limits per year or during undergrad but its not like you can just borrow the 60k per year. You just can’t. So, you have to know what your parents make, go to each schools website and figure out the parent’s expected contribution for each school (because it varies from school to school) and then figure out what you can afford.</p>
<p>I forgot to mention that some schools require you to take a loan. For example, let’s say at Tufts. Maybe it costs 60k a year. And, they will say your parents contribution is lets say 10k and your work study is 3k and you are required to take out your 5.5k in loans. Then, they give you grants for the rest. Well, you can’t borrow the 10k for your parents contribution. Maybe you can get a plus loan for 5k of it. But, you have already taken out the 5.5k you can get in direct student loan and you can borrow another 5k, maybe. But, then you have to worry about how you can’t borrow 10k per year for four years because of that cumulative 31k limit. Or at least I think that’s how it works.</p>
<p>Others have already pointed out the flaws in your argument, OP:</p>
<p>-That new freshman can borrow at most $5,500 by themselves without a cosigner.
-That cosigners should very much care about whether they cosign large amounts of private loans, because if the borrower defaults the cosigner is on the hook for the money. That’s what cosigning means.
-That people borrowing 6-figure debt making $100K out of college is a fiction. Most college grads are lucky to make half that out of the box. $100K in debt on a $45,000 income is crushing debt, the kind of debt that makes you move back home.</p>
<p>But one last point: Why are you equating community college with working at McDonald’s? Motivated students can attend community college for two years and then transfer to a 4-year college. Going to a community college doesn’t mean that you have doomed career prospects.</p>
<p>What is the problem with being fiscally responsible? Would you tell someone who wants a BMW they can’t afford instead of the Toyota they can to go ahead and buy the BMW because it’s prettier and shinier and they may get better benefits from it and who knows, maybe they’ll win the lottery and be able to pay it off quickly?</p>
<p>If you know you are going to work at an investment bank or Google when you graduate $100,000 is nothing, but for most people you are talking about a burden that will last for decades. It’s no fun to be paying off student loans when you should be saving for your retirement or saving for your own kids’ schooling. Not against some loans, but the total probably shouldn’t be much more than what you expect to make your first year out of school. Also, I’m pretty sure the amount students are allowed to borrow is limited.</p>