<p>An amazing post, kal. I think you put it much better than I, and I agree with everything you say, the good and the bad. Congrats on ur acceptance! :D</p>
<p>Obviously, you feel strongly about your position. </p>
<p>As you succintly mentioned, everyone is entitled to their opinion. You have provided your thoughts based on your experiences and they are genuine.</p>
<p>McDeb expressed an opinion based on his/her daughter's experience at Lehigh, and their experience visiting the college on a frequent basis. That is equally legitimate.</p>
<p>However, "where there is smoke, there IS fire". There is no shortage of articles/anecdotes that corroborates the fact that alcohol is a promiennt ingredient of the Lehigh social scene, perhaps in fact, still a dominant ingredient. There is no one on this forum naive enough to believe that alcohol usage does not exist on every campus. However, on some, it is woven into the fabric of the social scene.</p>
<p>That alone should not define Lehigh, as alcohol is the bane of too high a percentage of schools. Lehigh has much to offer. A physical plant that is the envy of many other high profile schools, academic rigor in numerous disciplines, an increasing national reputation, and a burgeoning endowment.</p>
<p>Well, I think we're being played by a 14 year old.</p>
<p>Thank you Jerzyjim, I think you make very valid, mature points. I was told long before I came to college that drinking would always be an issue (the legal age in England is 18 so by the time kids go to college they've pretty much done that...), and I'm not expecting to find a college where every student is responsible about drinking. So I totally agree with you on the points you made. It is true that Lehigh's rep is gaining, something must be said for that. And I am pretty sure Lehigh is trying to improve the humanities classes, although of course these things take time. Thanks again for your insights.</p>
<p>Mcdeb, if that is your response I think that says a lot.</p>
<p>mcdeb:
Excuse my referring to Lehigh as a "private LAC." My son informs me that it is in fact a "private university." I am not pretending to know very much about Lehigh (I did not even go to the visit), as I am not the person who applied there. I do however think that all these schools should take the drinking problem more seriously than they do - and Lehigh is clearly not alone in that. Perhaps when they see and hear pressure from students on the subject it will become a higher priority, although, admittedly, I have no idea what they can do about it. (But that has nothing to do with why my son isn't going there.)</p>
<p>If LAC means liberal arts college, then yes, Lehigh is definitely a private liberal arts university. It says so on the website.</p>
<p>As I speak, a much beloved member (college student) of my town is being buried right now. He died over the weekend in a house fire at the University of Maryland.</p>
<p>That being said, no matter where one goes to school, please remember in the long run that life is short. If one is not happy at one school, then change. If one is happy, then close your ears to the naysayers.</p>
<p>And to all of the parent's out there. Please love your children and let them know it. And to my fellow parent's of seniors...please embrace and enjoy the last few months that we have with them until they leave home...............</p>
<p>US News groups Lehigh within the "National University" category, where it ranks 37th overall. It's programs are more encompassing than a traditional LAC, where the emphasis is mainly on the undergraduate liberal arts....clearly not Lehigh.</p>
<p>Lehigh is not a private liberal arts university. I'm confused why you don't know what type of college you attend.</p>
<p>As far as drinking, I trust my kids to make the right choices. Anyone who doesn't should probably reconsider whether his/her child is mature enough to be away from home. If your child has never been given any freedom to make his/her own choices, he/she will probably have some problems at college.
If you're child already has a history of drinking in high school, then it will probably be a problem no matter where he/she goes to college. If not, I doubt that he/she will be suddenly hit by an uncontrollable urge to get drunk all the time. Unless we're talking Brigham Young or somewhere similar, there will be drinking. </p>
<p>The serious students at Lehigh tend to get involved in other activities.
I guess there could be a group of kids on the other end of the spectrum who are there to party, same as any school. </p>
<p>That said, I am unfamiliar with the curriculum of traditional liberal arts majors at Lehigh and if someone feels it's not a great place to be an English major or whatever, that is definitely a viewpoint to consider. Different universities have different strengths.</p>
<p>Mommypain, I posted a month or so ago about another fatal college fire and urged parents to take a close look at where their college students live, especially if off campus or in an older building that might be "grandfathered" out of fire safety compliance. Since the Seton Hall fire, I believe colleges are stricter with compliance but it is not something we should assume. My post was moved to oblivion however by the moderators. I thought it was a pretty important point.</p>
<p>Sorry, I don't think I made myself clear on my last post. When I said that Lehigh is a liberal arts university I meant it is a university with a liberal arts program (among others). Lehigh compares itself to other liberal arts colleges, and also universities. I do know that Lehigh is a university (hence the name Lehigh University) but also that it can be compared to a liberal arts school. Many professors here have said Lehigh is trying to become more like a liberal arts college, but with a graduate progam. Note: this is not what I have said, but some professors!</p>
<p>Mcdeb, it sounds like your child does make mature drinking choices (as I've said about your previous posts). It is true that not matter how the child may act at home, when he/she enters college they may act in an entirely different way.</p>
<p>I disagree with the generalization that if a child drinks in high school he/she will drink in college also, or if he/she has never drunk he/she will not do so at college. This is far too much of a generalization. Many students can mature after high school, or at least learn to drink responsibly. Some students experience freedom/peer pressure/parties they have never come across and start to drink. And they are more likely, in my humble opinion, to be the ones who "get into trouble" (i.e. if they have not learnt how to control their drinking/know how much they can drink without getting drunk and so on). I agree with peacenik I think it was, who said schools should be doing more. But yes, what exactly can be done?</p>
<p>If you mean serious students as in studious students then I can assure you it is both the studious and non-studious types that drink here at Lehigh. Not all irresponsibly, but drink they do. Yes, there are kids on both ends of the spectrum (studious & dont drink, non-studious & drink all the time, and vice versa) but even those with top GPA's can drink all weekend, just like at any school.</p>
<p>That said, mcdeb, I think your points were well made and I can see where you're coming from.</p>
<p>BlueAngel - I'm sorry to hear that Lehigh has not met your needs and you must transfer. I was just wondering if the fact that you went there as a 21 year old freshman had anything to do with it? Most freshmen, as you're aware of, are 17-18 years old. Just wondering if that had anything to do with your dissatisfaction. You may be more mature than most freshmen??</p>
<p>My son is a freshman at Lehigh (I've posted before) majoring in Mechanical Engineering. He is very satisfied with his first year, taking the requisite classes. But then again, engineering can't be compared to the English/Humanities department, he hasn't had any problems getting classes...next year will be a different story. There is one required course for engineering that is only offered on a certain day and time so this means on Thursdays he will have classes from 8 am until 5 (including labs)...no break for lunch.</p>
<p>He is not a drinker and has mentioned times spent on a Saturday evening entertaining himself because he didn't want to deal with the partying (roommate was a partyer, sp.). He has friends in his dorm who just finished pledging and a few are borderline grade-wise due to partying. And Blue, the security does arrest kids in the frat houses...one kid from my son's dorm was arrested for being so drunk in the house and passed out cold. Fire alarms were pulled and security arrived pronto and he was hauled away. You can read about that one in the school paper too, I did, after my son filled me in on the details. Alcohol in general is prevalent in colleges everywhere. I have another son who is a senior at another college and it is just as bad there, with less students and no greek system.</p>
<p>School is what you make of it. Find a place that truly makes you happy because these are supposed to be the best years of your life!<br>
I wish you nothing but the best.</p>
<p>Hi laxmom, thank you for your post!:) I said in a previous post (this thread or another) that it wasn't the age thing. I do have friends at Lehigh. Albeit they seem slightly more mature and don't go to the frat parties at all, but they are all 18-19 nonetheless. And if I transfer, people will still be younger than me, I know that.</p>
<p>I've heard that a lot of students are happy with Engineering and the IBE program. Lehigh is known for that, and students in IBE have their classes chosen for them. But wow that is a lot of labs. I am surprized there aren't more options for that class though. I certainly find that with many of my classes: only one time is offered so I have to reschedule everything. I'm sure other students experience similar things at other colleges, but I'd prefer to be at one where Humanities students are placed above or at equal level as the science students.</p>
<p>I understand your son's point about the drinking/partying. Two RA's (Gryphons) were fired this year because of underage drinking. If you don't mind me asking, what college does your other son go to? The colleges I've looked at to transfer aren't as prevalent in their drinking (or so other students tell me).</p>
<p>Thank you so much for your best wishes, that really means a lot. I'm not miserable at Lehigh but I DO want to find somewhere I'll love and be challenged. Thanks again! :)</p>
<p>We went to visit Lehigh and the town is not the slum everyone makes it out to be. I'm sure there are many hard working lower middle class and middle class people living there. If you want million dollar homes surrounding you, apply to Princeton. But don't knock a town just because it doesn't meet your high expectations. Lehigh is a beautiful school but remember middle class values are what makes this country great. Seeing people of color in the town contrasted against the lack of diversity on campus doesn't give someone the right to belittle them. The students of Lehigh are only visitors, the residents should be treated with respect. Maybe it is because I live in New York City, where I am exposed to every nationality you can think of, that the ride to Bethlehem was just another trip. I was both awed and saddened viewing the steel works. It seemed a metaphor for what is troubling our nation. As far as drinking on campus, didn't previous generations grossly indulge in drugs and alcohol during their college years? How many parents can look their child in the eye and say I never experimented. Youth is when a person can decide what is the right course of action for themselves. After one hangover. a lifetime lession is learned. But drinking and driving should never be condoned.</p>
<p>There is some bias toward the socio-economic realities of Bethlehem. For many Lehigh students, it is their first exposure to an environment different than white middle class suburbia. What Lehigh may lack in diversity is contrasted by the residents of Bethlehem and students should make every effort to respect that reality. </p>
<p><<i was="" both="" awed="" and="" saddened="" viewing="" the="" steel="" works.="">></i></p><i was="" both="" awed="" and="" saddened="" viewing="" the="" steel="" works.="">
<p>It is an awesome piece of history. </p>
<p><<as far="" as="" drinking="" on="" campus,="" didn't="" previous="" generations="" grossly="" indulge="" in="" drugs="" and="" alcohol="" during="" their="" college="" years?="">></as></p>
<p>Yup, the majority did. Even our president, admittedly. Of course, I would not be one to hold him up as an example of how many extra brain cells we have.</p>
<p><<how many="" parents="" can="" look="" their="" child="" in="" the="" eye="" and="" say="" i="" never="" experimented.="">></how></p>
<p>I would hope they don't. I've been honest with my kids on an age appropriate basis and I think that has something to do with them not jumping into the party scene with both feet.</p>
</i>
<p>I would like to point out that I am nowhere near middle class; the only reason I can go to such an expensive school is because financial aid allows me to afford it. So South Bethlehem (a distinction must be made between north and south) did not come as a shock to me, rather as a disappointment. It is <em>nothing</em> to do with the residents that live there. Personally, I have never had any problems with the residents. In fact, I'm sure they have more problems with the mass of Lehigh students that take over their town! (Although it must be said other Lehigh students have been robbed/assaulted/abused by some South Bethlehem residents- obviously the absolute minority, and this can happen in any town/city, of course.) I was just upset South Bethlehem does not offer a lot in terms of social activities. This is not something I noticed on the tour (we were not taken around South Bethlehem). Yes, there is Campus Square but not much else. It's a shame as I'm sure if more bookstores, cafes, cinemas etc. were in South Bethlehem they would be extremely popular with the students who don't drive, don't like to go to the frats and would like to experience life outside the "Lehigh bubble" as it's called.</p>
<p>So, as I said, I would never "belittle" Bethlehem residents, and I'm sure for many Lehigh students it is their first time being surrounded by people of other nationalities and income. It would be interesting to hear what other current Lehigh students think of S. Bethlehem.</p>
<p>Students who come to Lehigh and Bethlehem b/c they didn't get into their "dream" school should be wary of having a chip on their shoulder that may cloud their judgment and cause them to ignore what is available while spending a year of their lives griping until they are able to transfer out. That is true of any college and any student. </p>
<p>It doesn't take a whole lot of effort to make your way around Bethlehem and Allentown even without a car but it does take more effort than sitting in your room and complaining that it's not NYC.</p>
<p>My bet is that some students have never even been to Lehigh's other campuses.</p>
<p>Mcdeb, I didn't have a "dream" school when I applied as a freshman and I certainly do not spend all my time in my room. It's interesting that I am the only student on this site that is willing to talk and discuss Lehigh. I have pointed out both it's good and bad sides. Just because it's not my "dream" school now does not mean it's the worst school. I have made friends here, do very well academically, am involved in extracurrics. So I would appreciate it if you stop making rude comments to me/about me and making unsubtle remarks regarding my points of view. I'm sure everyone here is happy for your child/children, and they love Lehigh. Now if you don't mind, I am not here to argue with you, simply state my opinion in a nice manner. I suggest you do the same.</p>
<p>That was as nice as I could make it.</p>
<p>If that's the case, you should learn to respect others' opinions and leave it at that. I believe we've both wasted enough time disagreeing, it's not worth the time.</p>