These are now a few years old but are interesting articles on skills for liberal arts majors to be used in the workforce. https://www.chronicle.com/article/Liberal-Arts-Majors-Have/236749?cid=trend_au&elq=9980ad498b7f45f5842649beb36b0f8a&elqCampaignId=3318&elqTrackId=6e4f5f9950b8487c9ddbc00eb19e4474&elqaid=9408&elqat=1
http://www.burning-glass.com/wp-content/uploads/BGTReportLiberalArts.pdf?platform=hootsuite
The only 2 people I know that have an English degree started in a field related to their degree but ended up going into nursing mostly for financial reasons and career stability
People I know with English degrees are creative writers (including me), teachers/professors (including me), lawyers, doctors, editors or otherwise in publishing, medical or technical writers, counselors, businesspeople, and a whole range of jobs I could come up with if I think about it more.
@CupCakeMuffins So, what’s the decision? Is your S going to Amherst or not? What’s the other school in contention?May 1 is Tuesday!
The same is also true in the other direction: most natural/physical sciences majors also don’t go into STEM careers.
The Census Bureau released a report back in 2014 (https://www.census.gov/newsroom/press-releases/2014/cb14-130.html) analyzing this phenomenon. My favorite part of it is the interactive visualization (https://www.census.gov/dataviz/visualizations/stem/stem-html/) that shows you where graduates in each major group end up after college.
The National Science Foundation considers behavioral and social sciences as STEM majors, btw. But even if you just look at computer and mathematical sciences and engineering, only about half of graduates who majored in those fields go onto careers in those fields. For the physical and biological/life sciences, it’s far fewer.
The other cool thing is that you can also see what kind of backgrounds people have in the fields listed on the visualization. For example, it looks like a good 20-25% of computer workers have backgrounds in something other than the computer/mathematical sciences or engineering. Only about half of mathematicians and statisticians majored in those fields in college.
You can view the specific positions for different majors at https://www.amherst.edu/system/files/media/LoebCenter_AnnualReport_2015-16.pdf . In some majors, most have first jobs that are notably related to their major. For example, economics is one of the more common majors. Most seem to working as analysts at a banking companies, which is closely related to economics. Psychology is another common major, where the first position list shows less obvious connections. Analyst seems to be the most common position again, including banking and consulting. However, there are also some tutors and teachers, as well as varied other types of positions.
Part of this relationship relates to investment banking and consulting being the most common first jobs at Amherst overall. The top 4 employers across all majors were Goldman Sachs, Delotte, Morgan Stanley, and Bain. You’ll find a similar relationship at many highly selective private colleges in the northeeast. Lots of students like the high starting salary in investment banking and consulting. In many cases, these are short term ~2 year positions, with the plan to make some money quickly, then do something else (see https://www.vox.com/2014/5/15/5720596/how-wall-street-recruits-so-many-insecure-ivy-league-grads ). That “something else” may be more relevant to the major.
Another issue is the number of available, quality, relevant jobs with a bachelor’s degree in that major. Again this varies by major. For example, if you want to be a psychologist, the path with be a lot easier for a student with graduate degrees in psychology than with a bachelor’s, and many Amherst grads do go on to pursue graduate degrees for similar reasons. Among those who instead seek jobs with a bachelor’s, it is not surprising that few positions are closely tied to psychology. However, there are lesser degrees of relationships. For example, psychology no doubt plays a role in the teaching positions, as well as the consulting positions. The same could be said of a liberal arts education in general. There are less direct influences in almost all positions.
“In many other countries, students do pick a major from day one. They aren’t locked into that as a career though. They have the same flexibility to apply their education to whatever they desire.”
Exactly. And why is this discussion focused on liberal arts? It’s not like my degree in math has anything to do with the real world, let alone my job. The point of getting a degree is mostly about signaling to potential employers that you’ll make a good employee, as this excellent book “The Case against Education: Why the Education System Is a Waste of Time and Money” helpfully points out: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Case-against-Education-System-Waste/dp/0691174652
Math is a liberal art @Twoin18 - maybe not in the “humanities” however. There is no LAC in the world that doesn’t offer a math major.
Although math is also obviously a STEM subject, I agree you’ll do better (and perhaps enjoy it more) if you view it as art rather than science! The beauty of mathematics and all that…
Actually I think there’s a good argument to be made is to keep young people off the labor market for four years… perhaps in combination of the value of simply a few years of maturity in an employment, and the possible job skills the college students will gain along the way though part-time and summer employment without directly competing for full time jobs.
A few LACs do not offer (any) majors in the usual sense. Examples include St. John’s College, Evergreen State, Sarah Lawrence. Note that these three also do not appear to offer the upper level math courses that one can take to approximate what a math major elsewhere would take.
But, yes, math is a liberal art.
I suppose it depends what you mean by “relevant”. At McKinsey in the UK, they love classics majors. I’ve also known several English majors who went to work for the UN where their writing abilities were greatly appreciated.
I know someone who majored in Peace Studies in UG, then traveled to third world countries for a while, then went to MIT for business school and now works for McKinsey.
My sons’ pediatrician was an international relations major. The daughter of our friends was a philosophy/psychology major and got a great job in Silicon Valley testing data bases and doing technical writing. I was a polisci/journalism major and went in to pension administration and communications.
My liberal arts degree is relevant to my most important job in every way—parenting!
I got a degree in anthropology and arts & humanities. I’m not working in either of those fields but use the skills every single day.
If that didn’t signal I’m a good employee, I’m pretty sure my years of employment and stellar employer endorsements and letters of rec would.
Many humanities majors actually do providing in important job skills that are useful across the board. English obviously is useful because written communication skills are helpful anywhere. I briefly considered majoring in rhetoric, which would have greatly improved my oral communication skills as well. A foreign language major who gains fluency in one or more languages can use those skills at any job where multilingualism is valued – often even if it not a specific job requirement. (It’s a value added thing that can lead to one applicant being hired over another, for any job that involves interfacing with the public – never hurts to haves someone on staff who can talk to a customer who has difficulty with English).
My younger sister graduated cum laude from an Ivy League school with an English degree and spent the next ten years as a white water raft instructor in the summer, ski instructor in the winter. Bartended in spring and fall to fill in the gaps. She abruptly decided she hated being poor and went to law school, now she specializes in water rights law.
For those ten years she would have seemed to be massively underemployed but she was doing what she loved. My father refers to it as her gap years. She likes to say she took her retirement at the beginning of her career rather than at the end, while her body could handle the rough waters…
Years ago I remember a comedian who had a philosophy degree, and he said he had to go into comedy because his philosophy shop didn’t make it.
It sounded funnier when he said it.
There are very specific industries that require specific or technical training. Think engineering, physician / nursing, accounting, computer science, etc. I’m sure there are exceptions, but if you want to be an engineer, you get an engineering degree (or something very relevant).
For most other industries, employers want intelligent employees they can train. F500 management training programs will hire from many majors. They value critical thinking, communication (verbal and written) skills. They want to develop leaders and others they feel good about putting in front of clients.
Personally, I received a BA in communications in the 80s. Wanted to be a sportscaster. There were no jobs to do that specific thing (almost got hired as a weekday weatherman/ weekend sports anchor for 9k annual salary - would have taken it in a heartbeat!). Got in to corporate sales. Used those “presentation” skills all the time. Did well and eventually started my own business and have owned / operated a successful venture for over 20 yrs. Ironically, I do some guest hosting on a financial radio show - it only took 33 years to make it!
Other than those narrow industries, you can do quite well with a quality general education. Yes, Google hires tons of computer science coders. They also hire tons of others to actually run their company.