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<p>I don’t think this would be necessary. At least the way both my kids’ colleges, do it, they send the tuition bill to the student, and another copy to the “authorized payer,” which in our case is me. I don’t see anything in the process that justifies excluding one of the divorced parents’ incomes.</p>
<p>It’s radical and unfair. If parents who are married can’t be REQUIRED to support their children in and through college - why should that be different for divorced parents?</p>
<p>But that discussion is off topic. Getting back to swdad- the purpose of financial aid is to encourage kids from low income families to attend college. No where on the application does it ask if you would be able to attend without government help. Some kids who don’t qualify still won’t be able to attend if their parent doesn’t support them - likewise for some kids who do qualify when they realize they still can’t afford college.</p>
<p>*When you are awarded insitutional aid you are not taking other taxpayers money.</p>
<p>by claiming every deduction and credit for which you are entitiled you pay less into the treasury - that is made up by someone paying more.*</p>
<p>The argument was about someone who’s taking federal money, not institutional money (as in Pell) for having a 0 EFC that wouldn’t exist if both parents’ income was included.</p>
<p>As for the taxes…someone taking legitimate tax deductions is not having his taxes made up by someone else. He is paying his taxes.</p>
<p>What makes tax deductions legitimate is if they are allowed according to the rules. If a student is filing for financial aid according to the rules, there’s nothing any less legitimate about that. Some folks have issues with the rules in both instances, naturally.</p>
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<p>The difference here is that we <em>know</em> why the mortgage interest deduction exists (to encourage home ownership) and why the charitable deduction exists (to encourage charitable donations). No one on this thread seems to know why FAFSA excludes the non-custodial parent’s income. If we knew, it might clear up the animosity inherent in what seems to be a system set up to <em>reward</em> broken families over intact families. It needs an explanation.</p>
<p>It may be because the government doesn’t want to make getting the minimal aid it offers more difficult for the students who need it most. Does that mean some students whose non-custodial parents can contribute get a little advantage for their first year? Maybe. (Remember in subsequent years the formula will work out worse for them.) That’s a trade-off, and a reasonable one, it seems to me.</p>
<p>I can’t understand the logic of excluding one parent’s financial info when neither one is truly a “non-custodial” parent. Most divorced couples I know have joint custody. Why does the process declare one of them non-custodial? How does that even make sense in the context of an 18 year old student anyway, who technically has no “custodial” parent at all?</p>
<p>The FAFSA does not use the term “custodial”, it merely asks questions about your living arrangement and support to determine which parent must submit their info. We use it here on CC just as a kind of shorthand, but you are correct that is not really applicable with regards to the FAFSA.</p>
<p>^ right. The logic is that the parent who has been supporting the child counts. It gets tricky so they developed the checklist to determine which parent to count.
Alimony counts and child support counts. Since they count child support to count the “non-supporting” parent would be counting them twice. </p>
<p>I would think that if Dad (or Mom) makes $500,000/year he/she is paying some hefty child support. If so then that shows up on the FAFSA. </p>
<p>Bay - why do they ask for any parent’s income? There is no law that says parents must contribute and many don’t. The reason they ask is because the government has limited funds and they want the kids from the neediest families to have access to money. Why do you think the age for “independence” is 24? </p>
<p>My whole point above is - there are lots of government programs out there. It really isn’t up to us as individuals to judge and tell kids to not take money for which they are qualified. Would you tell a poor woman to not claim the Earned Income tax credit? A lot of folks are upset (including me) that their working dependents dont qualify for the MWP credit. But that credit is intended for people who work and support themselves. If they took every situation and looked at it case by case then no money would ever be awarded. There are lots of posts by kids from divorced families where they can’t get financial information from both parents for the CSS/Profile. If FAFSA made the same demand then it would bog down the whole system and fewer kids would get the help that they need. Without financial help a number of these kids would either never make it to college or would not finish.</p>
<p>I think that it is irresponsible for parents to tell kids that applying for federal financial aid and answering the questions correctly is unethical.</p>
<p>JustAMom</p>
<p>I agree with you that the rules are the rules and you are not doing anything illegal if you follow them.</p>
<p>Conceptually however consider the case
Divorced parents follow the rules and the EFC is say $10,000 but using information for both parents results in an EFC of $100,000, should the parents question if following the rules really gives them the right answer?</p>
<p>I reject the notion that it is really a timing issue and any benefit which may be gained in the first year will be negated in subsuquent years when you include the support provided by the second parent. It doesn’t necessarily work out that way.</p>
<p>Would you personally think it is right for a student to receive financial aid (the sources of which are finite) using the information for one parent when the other parent doesn’t work and yet lives an upper middle class lifestyle afforded to them from earnings off of their investments?</p>
<p>Finally, it wasn’t my intent to advise or judge anyone here. I found the topic to be of personal interest and was offering support for an alternative point of view.</p>
<p>*
I would think that if Dad (or Mom) makes $500,000/year he/she is paying some hefty child support. If so then that shows up on the FAFSA.*</p>
<p>But, only for one year…once the kid is 18, the support ends.</p>
<p>And, I think Congress is considering removing the child support inclusion because it disappears once the child is 18 and in college.</p>
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<p>But they do look at every FAFSA application on a case-by-case basis. Everything you wrote here ^ could apply equally to kids whose parents are married. I’m don’t understand why a dissolution of a marriage between parents removes the presumed obligation to pay for college as between the parent and child that applies to the married parents of college applicants. There is absolutely no difference in the <em>legal</em> obligation of married parents to support their 18-year old children than there is for divorced parents.</p>
<p>I’m not implying that what OP and others do is unethical, if they are following the rules. I’m questioning the rationale for the rule.</p>
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<p>What you are describing is a benefit that comes with the parent’s employment and there is nothing wrong with that.</p>
<p>I guess you would really roll over and die, because if they attended the Ivy where their parents worked, they would get free tuition.</p>
<p>Not all schools give reciprocal agreeements. I know that Columbia and a few others only give free tuition at Columbia and their affiliated college. The student will only receive half tuition if do not attend the school where their parents works.</p>
<p>mom2ck - you are correct however, if the child support parent then contributed $$$ toward the child education, that money would be reported on FAFSA.</p>
<p>swdad1 & bay - do I have my own personal beefs with the FAFSA? You betcha. I fully recognize that it is not always “fair” and have been on the short end of that. But that is not the topic of this conversation.</p>
<p>However, it’s a double edged sword. The more complicated you make the process the fewer folks will even attempt to negotiate it. By making it simple - more kids can be helped.
It looks like it will soon become even more simple - which may be a good/bad thing.
I also recognize that some folks refuse to accept any government help for anything. That is their preogative but not your claim in this argument. As long as you accept that some kids may apply to the federal goverment for financial aid - it is not up to you (personally) to determine their worthiness.</p>
<p>The question is NOT who contributed most, but with whom did you reside more than 50% in the past year. That being said, some colleges will eek out the information they need from you before determining financial aid.</p>
<p>I see this has become a featured thread. One part of the answer to the OP’s question is that if a college thinks there is anything unusual about the figures you report, the college will ask you to fill out a verification form. The verification form request will make clear what information the college wants to verify. The student doesn’t get aid unless the verification documents requested are sent to the college. </p>
<p>Good luck in the financial aid process. I worked my way through college because this was all too complicated for my family in my generation. I’m trying to learn and follow all the rules so that my children get their chance to go to college.</p>
<p>The op asked a pretty specific question, “Will this affect my chances?” and referred to two schools, UNC Wilmington and App state. I assume the op means her admission chances and I don’t think her financial situation or her fafsa will have much impact on her chances at those particular schools.</p>
<p>From other posts the op appears concerned that she may be “gaming” the system and presumably this could come back and impact her college admission. Given the current fafsa rules which she appears to have followed it’s seems unlikely that there will be any repercussions as she has done nothing wrong.</p>
<p>A few have commented that only rather minimal federal aid is up for abuse, but I would not lose sight of substantial institutional aid being waylaid too, which increases the cost of others attending, and limits available aid to the actually needy.</p>
<p>Nah… if you are looking for moral justification to game this system, look elsewhere.</p>
<p>As for the argument that kids should not be harmed by deadbeat divorced parents, I have to wonder why kids that have deadbeat undivorced parents are not protected, too.</p>
<p>I simply view this rule as stemming from the basic mercantile basis of a marriage contract: if it is dissolved, then in more than one way the child does not have that contractual parent anymore.</p>
<p>quote:</p>
<p>“only 2 public universities – UNC and UVA – promise to meet the full demonstrated need of all students?”</p>
<p>northstar, or anyone: can you provide a link for a list of colleges that provide full demo. need ? public, private would be good.</p>
<p>quote:
“I worked my way through college …”</p>
<p>At 25-50k a yr , in today’s inflationary costs of college, I am not sure how someone can work there way through college unless it is a commuter community college . That would be $100,000 to $200,000 to go to a typical 4 yr college. THat is a heckuva lot of burgers to flip. I am sure a good math student out there could prove there would not be enough time to do this.</p>
<p>^ roderick,
My father paid for his undergrad at CalTech by working RR construction in the summers. That just does not seem even remotely possible now.</p>