<p>Somewhat off topic-</p>
<p>My daughter has a friend that completely fabricated all of the volunteer work on her applications. Obviously not a good idea, but it got me wondering how common this is? I don’t think that schools actually check on this.</p>
<p>@NeverEmptyNest wrote:
The repeated theme in this thread is that required voluntarism is a MYTH. Please accept this. Your DD is fine. We should all repeat it at the beginning of ninth grade orientation!</p>
<p>Community service is not a requirement for college admission.</p>
<p>Community service should be something that people want to do. It’s not an obligation…or something to get credit for…or something to pad one’s college application.</p>
<p>I encounter extremely busy professionals, blue-collar workers, and students who somehow find a way to participate in community service activities. They really enjoy community service. They love the spirit of the people who are involved (helpers and those being helped). Being involved makes them feel good. Community service becomes part of their lives.</p>
<p>My kids did only the 30 hours of community service required to graduate from their HS. Their limited involvement with volunteer work had no negative impact on admission to the colleges they applied to. Combined, they were 9 for 9.</p>
<p>Community service is one of thing that may demonstrate your passion. It is not essential for anything. But if you have nothing in your EC to show your passion or how you used the time, if may hurt your college application. Of course, there are many colleges that do not put as much weight in EC as Ivies. Besides, it would be very hard to compete for scholarships. My D is very strong academically, but rather weak in EC and has no sport and no leadership role. She is having a hard time even in writing essays for scholarship applications. All these EC enriched your life experience and that is what the schools and scholarships are looking for. Community service is just one of the many possible ways to show what you are. </p>
<p>My son had virtually no community service - served meals at a homeless shelter once a year. Obviously didn’t put that on his app. He had several EC that he did for all four years and he had a part time job starting in summer before senior year. He was accepted at every school he applied (9 for 9) </p>
<p>Most schools in this country won’t care. Not one bit. They take virtually everybody with a college degree. Look at the acceptance stats at most schools. Those schools not considered selective are really not going to look at ECs, comm service, etc. A lot of the larger state school don’t either. They don’t even look recs and other such things. Penn State out and out has said they just look at class rank/grades, test scores and the date they get your app. All numbers. </p>
<p>But if a student is looking at schools that are highly selective, they LOOK for reasons to deny admissions, because they get SO MANY applications from highly qualified kids. If you are applying to Williams, Amherst, or the top 15 national universities, for example, that you have very little community service without a compelling reason, that can knock you out of contention. Yes it can hurt admissions chances. My son was a national level athlete as were many of his peers, took top difficulty classes, and he and most of his teammates still managed to come up with a nice list of other ECs including community service. </p>
<p>Now if there is good reason, that’s a whole other story. If you come from a family challenged and in need of community service itself, if a part time job is imperative to getting needed items since your family is low income, it’s not going to matter a whit. But it you have the family support and your peers are racking up those hours and you can’t , well, you have a problem because you ain’t gonna look as good and who do you think the school is going to cut, when they have to cut?</p>
<p>For the competitive Top 20 colleges, I believe they do care. They want to see what you will contribute to the the school community and the extended community. It’s not about racking up hours; it’s about going deep and showing a sense of commitment. If your kid is involved in a specific sport, couldn’t he/she help out with the youth in your community? Same could be said of a musical instrument. I think schools will put that in higher regard than a part-time job (unless the money is going toward helping support the family). I agree with cptofthehouse – highly qualified athletic kids with part-time jobs and a zillion AP classes are a dime a dozen. Figure out how you can make yourself stand out from the field. </p>
<p>I think we put too much focus on admission, while merit aid is sometimes the determining factor where the kid will go. While most schools do not put much weight on EC for admission, it is very critical for most top scholarships at most schools. My D was accepted to all but one school which is a reach, but only half of the admitted schools are realistic options due to merit scholarships. So getting admitted does not really help if one cannot get sufficient aid to make it affordable particularly for schools do not meet needs. Of course, one would have a safety school that is affordable, but that would be usually the last option one would pick.</p>
<p>That’s a good point.
Oldest was accepted to a school that meets 100% need.
Of course schools that meet full need generally use more information than FAFSA to determine what need is as they are using their own money.
We know several other kids who were admitted but still couldn’t afford it, but her aid package met her FAFSA EFC. As that was roughly the same amount as instate college, we allowed her to attend.
Her school is need aware, so there must have been any number of things for the balance to be tipped to admit, but I think each circumstance is individual.
It’s about finding the right fit school not the other way around.</p>
<p>Just curious why the job isn’t on the chopping block.</p>
<p>@NeverEmptyNest - I do think there is a distinction to take here. ECs and volunteer work could be two different things, and usually are. </p>
<p>My DS had a couple ECs he was committed to, which took much of his time. He did zero volunteer work; I mean none. No local community service or stuff like that. This did not stop him from getting into several top 10 schools, including the very top ones. It is all in how you present why you did what you did. </p>
<p>BrownParent:
“Just curious why the job isn’t on the chopping block.”</p>
<p>Just curious what that means, or what you are responding to?<br>
Because it has been our experience that long term paid jobs during high school are regarded with a great deal of respect by ad coms, future employers, internship administrators… Two years of balancing school, sports and a year round part time job says a lot about a teen. </p>
<p>Or were you referring to something else?</p>
<p>Because in some families a teen’s job provides really useful income? It allows the teen to socialize with friends out of his income bracket? Because a job provides real life lessons? </p>
<p>If my choice were for the kid to have a paying job or volunteer - I’d have them do the paying job. That’s what my older son did most of the time.</p>
<p>Our family believes volunteerism is a part of life, so we don’t count hours. I think if they do things they enjoy and fit them in when they can, it’s more likely to become a habit.</p>
<p>I can’t say for sure how adcoms view our method. We only have one acceptance so far (from a state school), but my feeling is that if colleges turn my children down because they disagree with that philosophy, they aren’t the schools for us. There are plenty of schools out there; one of them will be happy to cash my checks. </p>
<p>BrownParent,
The job isn’t on the chopping block because while I think volunteerism is important (I am very active in the community), I think working is very valuable for her. She makes really good money and we require her to pay $50 per month towards her expenses, save 50% towards college, and the other 50% is spending money. She is also gaining a lot of good life skills from this job. No, our family doesn’t need the money. </p>
<p>Even among colleges which look favorably on community service will judge someone on the context of their personal circumstances, SES status, etc.</p>
<p>For instance, I am fairly certain they aren’t going to hold lack of community service against a low-income academic high achieving student who is engaged meaningfully in a time-consuming EC like the math/debate teams or sports while holding a part-time job to contribute to the household income.</p>
<p>On the flipside, I have heard some adcoms speaking in school and among a few in my own family who stated that if one comes from a more privileged SES background, the lack of meaningful community service is more likely to be viewed negatively. Especially if the student concerned has no extenuating circumstances and doesn’t have many commitments from HS ECs and/or part-time job. However, this is evaluated on a case-by-case basis and in context of the student’s entire application.</p>
<p>^^ I can say that privileged background had no effect on my DS at the top schools. I do really think it is how you present yourself and why you did what you did. </p>
<p>This idea that forcing students to do mandatory volunteer work, like many schools do, shows more altruistic character or teaches students to care is a fallacy. There are many ways to demonstrate a humane character and the caring for other human beings other than giving your time and energy free to some organization. Students are on to this and now just do stuff for resume building. </p>
<p>I think what helped my DS is he was upfront he did not do that, stated exactly why, and explained how what he did was helpful and useful to other people, even though it was not volunteer work. It worked for sure in his case. I do think adcoms can read through too many soup kitchens after a while. </p>
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<p>I agree. Mandatory volunteer work is a contradiction of terms, tends to turn off folks who weren’t inclined to pursue it voluntarily, and worse IMO…obscures the virtues of students who are inclined to volunteer of their own free will. </p>
<p>I say this as someone who did a bit of volunteer work in HS and much more volunteer work in college. </p>
<p>^^ I did a good bit of volunteering in HS as well. Probably as much as many kids today. And, guess what? I was never told to do it. Things that interested me I simply did.</p>