<p>I am a recruited athlete, and I have to decide between these two schools in the next week. I'm interested in something science related, probably a form of bio (so I like the bioengineering at Cornell). I like the outdoors a lot, like snowboarding and stuff, and I would be recruited to run on the track teams at both schools. Mainly I'm concerned with the academic differences at the schools. Which would give me more opportunities to do research/get published? And which school would give me a better shot at getting into a good phd program for grad school? Which has a stronger reputation among employers?</p>
<p>You’ll do better in the environment you enjoy more…was that the bigger Cornell or the smaller Williams? Both will equally get you where you want to go…you just need to go with your gut feeling on what environment you like better. </p>
<p>Congrats on your acceptances.</p>
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<p>Cornell, being a larger school, will generate much more research activity, but that does not necessarily mean that the research opportunities for undergraduates will be better.</p>
<p>From 2006-2010, Cornell graduates earned 412 PhDs in the biological sciences. Williams College graduates earned 57. After adjusting for school sizes, the per capita rate is about the same for the two schools. A better adjustment would be based on the number of graduating biology majors at Williams and in the Cornell CAS. I don’t have those exact numbers, but about 12% of Cornell students major in biological/life sciences compared to about 7% at Williams. Therefore, it appears that Williams generates more biology/life science PhDs per capita than Cornell does.</p>
<p>On the one hand, Cornell alumni do have a larger presence than Williams College alumni among people with PhDs in the life sciences. On the other hand, it appears that at least as many Williams College bio majors, per capita, go on to earn the highest degree in their field. Once you get your doctorate, employers should care much more about your PhD-granting institution (and the work you’ve done there) than the name on your undergraduate diploma.</p>
<p>So, I agree with UCBChemEGrad. The numbers suggest that either school can get you where you want to go. It really comes down to which environment would be a better fit for you (and then, of course, what you make of the opportunities at either school).</p>
<p>Sources:
<a href=“https://webcaspar.nsf.gov/[/url]”>https://webcaspar.nsf.gov/</a>
(and the Common Data Set files, Section J, for each school)</p>
<p>[College</a> Navigator - National Center for Education Statistics](<a href=“http://nces.ed.gov/collegenavigator]College”>College Navigator - National Center for Education Statistics) shows the total bachelor’s degrees in Biological and Biomedical sciences in the most recent year to be 433 for Cornell and 48 for Williams.</p>
<p>LACs like Williams have small class sizes, lots of interaction with professors, and no graduate students to compete with. Research is plentiful. Williams has a good bio Dept.</p>
<p>Cornell is agonizingly competitive, and intro classes range up to 1,000 kids. Most sections are taught by graduate teaching assistants of variable quality (many are not native English speakers). I never even spoke to a professor during my 4 years there. </p>
<p>Take a look at Forbes rating of colleges (based on advanced degrees, student satisfaction, less debt). Williams is number 2. Cornell is number 51. </p>
<p>I would take Williams hands down.</p>
<p>If you are interesting in some type of engineering (you mentioned bioeng) major go with Cornell.</p>
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<p>If that is a typical year, then it appears that Williams bio majors earn about 25% more life science PhDs per capita than Cornell bio majors do.</p>
<p>Williams alumni: 57 PhDs 2006-10 (11.4 per yr / 48 majors = 24%)
Cornell alumni: 412 Phds 2006-10 (82.4 per yr / 433 majors = 19%)</p>
<p>These numbers by themselves don’t indicate Williams is “better”, but they do at least suggest the LAC environment isn’t holding students back from success in life science research. Faculty engagement and mentoring may have a bigger impact on preparing students for grad school than the larger number of course offerings and other advantages of a big research university.</p>
<p>Have you visited both schools? You should like one or the other more. My younger daughter definitely didn’t think Williams was for her because of the location and size. She felt right at home at Cornell. Of course, there are students who feel Cornell is just too big. </p>
<p>I don’t know why 2prepmom never spoke to a professor while she was at Cornell. Maybe time has changed, both of my kids have had close contact with their professors, not just with TAs. Our older daughter had a professor call her back while on vacation. Our younger daughter is only a freshman, but most of her classes have been small, except for intro to macro econ.</p>
<p>There is a lot of benefits in going to an Uni with 7 different schools. As an athlete, your circle of friends could be smaller if that is what you want. If you want to branch out, there is the Greek life, a lot of ECs.</p>
<p>You will get a great education at both institutions. It really gets down to what is the right fit for you.</p>
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<p>As a biology major, expect poor major-specific job prospects at the bachelor’s degree level (i.e. look widely for jobs and internships, rather than restricting your search to those related to your major). Bioengineering / biomedical engineering is somewhat better, but not as good as most other types of engineering.</p>
<p>Cornell may attract more on-campus recruiters simply because it is bigger. But you may want to try to find out from each school’s career center who comes recruiting.</p>
<p>Cornell’s College of Agriculture and Life Sciences has a career survey report:
[Postgraduate</a> Report and Survey | College of Agriculture and Life Sciences](<a href=“Undergraduate Students | CALS”>Undergraduate Students | CALS)</p>
<p>Williams appears to restrict its career survey results to those with Williams logins (possibly due to individually identifiable information).</p>
<p>OP could also be a biology major in A&S, not just in CALS. Most recruiters do not just restrict to one school within Cornell.</p>
<p>The problem is, only the College of Agriculture and Life Sciences seems to put out career survey information. Cornell’s other divisions do not seem to make it publicly available.</p>
<p>Professors at Williams College have pretty rigorous research requirements and the research support there is better than your average LAC, so you will have excellent opportunities to do research there. Cornell will produce the more cutting-edge stuff, but Williams professors are hired because they can articulate how they will incorporate undergraduates into their research and see it as a joy and a privilege, not a requirement.</p>
<p>I would imagine that Cornell has a better reputation among employers, but Williams will also have a strong reputation being one of the top LACs in the country.</p>
<p>Both have the outdoors and snow, being in semi-rural areas.</p>
<p>Basically, do you want to be at a huge university with a fairly thriving Greek life and lots and lots of student groups and activities to join, or do you want to be at a small, close-knit LAC with lots of personal attention from professors?</p>
<p><a href=“Career Services | Student & Campus Life | Cornell University”>Career Services | Student & Campus Life | Cornell University;
It takes a while to load. It is a report of postgraduate survey for all students. I would encourage all students to check out every school’s survey they are interested in. There is life after college.
<a href=“Career Services | Student & Campus Life | Cornell University”>Career Services | Student & Campus Life | Cornell University;
for years from 2000-2011.</p>
<p>Country, my son has an undergrad degree from Williams and a graduate degree from Cornell. They’re both great schools, but aside from great natural beauty, are very different in environment and ambiance. </p>
<p>My son is not in the sciences; his friends who are did well in research, internships and eventual graduate school choices so I wouldn’t worry about Williams in that respect.</p>
<p>Ithaca is a real town. Williamstown is a mountain village. Socially the atmosphere at Cornell is more Greek oriented, Williams more geared to a small group of friends. It may have just been due to the intensity of graduate school, but my son, also a snowboarder, took more advantage of outdoorsy activities at Williams than at Cornell.</p>
<p>The Ivy League carries strong name recognition weight, while most people outside of the midwest have never heard of Williams. That said, Williams is well respected by graduate school admissions and its career counseling and alumni/ae network is very active and accessible.</p>