<p>i need some advice, i'm pretty sure i want to go to medical school, i want to become a orthopedic surgeon, which will take me 15 years to do so or i can become a PA in a couple years. I've always wanted to become a Doctor lately i've been questioning myself, because as much i wanted to become a doctor, the type of doctor i want to be will take too long or being a doctor period will take too long. i don't want to be any other type of doctor beside a orthopedic surgeon, but my family situation is really bad i can't watch my family suffer anymore especially mother. I was thinking of trying to get into a PA school and Become a cardiovascular physician assistance (anything involves surgery) and help my family for a while and go back to medical school when our financial issues where stables or just forget about medical school for now. but its my dream to be a orthopedic surgeon, i will do anything to become that because i can do so much great things with it, i can help a lot of people. I don't mind being a PA, i think its a great profession but it not the right one for me in term of my personality. one thing i'm a person that like to be in charge and don't like people (especially inexperienced people to tell what to do, especially when i know the are completely wrong). don't get the wrong idea , i really like the idea of being a PA because i still do what i love, but i will never be in charge or really practice medicine, or considered a doctor. i will never forgive myself for not becoming a surgeon nor forgive myself for not helping my family first. i don't know what to do, should i just go to PA school and work on being a surgeon later.i know its hard decisions to make and a decisions i have to make myself, but i need all the advice i can get to make that decisions. </p>
<p>I'm sorry about the grammar and punctuation mistake, English is my third language and i'm still learning it.</p>
<p>and if i offend anyone i apologized i don't mean to.</p>
<p>To be honest, I would not become a PA. I feel that once you have already helped your family financial situation you are not going to want to go back to school to become a physician because of many factors like time but who knows. I would go to medical school. Plus , once you have already started residency you begin to get paid and if you want more money you can moonlight. However, that will not be until another 8 years which does seem like a long time(college + med school). However, how much time do you think it will take to help your family?</p>
<p>You just need to decide what you want to be. If surgeon is it, then take the time. I’ve had appointments with physician assistants before and in many field they seem to do the same work but for a lot less pay. They are basically the paralegal equivalent to lawyers.</p>
<p>I’d recommend getting your family issues settled first, as both professions will be a significant academic challenge. Also, it appears that you want to be in charge, and don’t want people telling you what to do(paraphrasing): frankly, this will be a major issue. Training for both(surgeon and let’s say an orthopaedic PA) is rigorous, academically and physically challlenging, and will require many hours of “people telling you what to do”. Most medical training starts at the bottom of the ladder, where all sorts of people-physicians, nurses, PAs, etc-will be telling you what to do.<br>
So I’d advise getting family issues settled first, if possible, and then you need to take a good look at yourself, as there will be many years of people telling you what to do(for a surgeon, depending on specialty, as many as 10 years).</p>
<p>First of all, please understand that it’s extremely difficult to get a residency in orthopedic surgery. It’s one of the most competitive specialties around and there are only a limited number of training spots available. If you would be happy ONLY doing orthopedics, then you will likely have a big problem in future because the odds say you will not qualify for one. (You need top med school grades, top USMLE scores, relevant research during med school, excellent LORs from ortho surgeons you’ve worked for and good interviewing skills just to be considered-- and that’ still no guarantee you’ll get one.)</p>
<p>Also from your description of your personality, you’re going to have problems being successful in med school. Physicians–yes, even trauma surgeons and ER docs who tend to be the most take charge people around–are expected to work cooperatively and well within groups. Having excellent people and communications skills is much valued by medical school adcoms and med school faculty and they select applicants who can demonstrate those skills.</p>
<p>Where are you in your educational process? High school? College?</p>
<p>PA school is a 2 year (graduate) MS program. Most PA programs require hundreds of hours of direct patient experience in order to be considered for admission. Do you have that?</p>
<p>Unless you are a college junior right now, you really don’t need to decide between PA and MD programs just yet. Undergrad coursework requirements for both MD and PA programs are nearly identical.</p>
<p>I also don’t even understand these options. What is it about orthopedic surgery that you like if the alternative is cardiovascular PA? It appears that the OR is really what appeals to you so why are general (far less competitive), neuro, cardiothoracic, vascular, uro, gyn, ENT or plastics off the table? Honestly a physical therapist or athletic trainer deals with problems that are more similar to an orthopedic surgeon than a cardio PA.</p>
<p>But yes, WOWMom points out an issue that keeps popping up here. Medical school acceptance does not guarantee any specialty. It doesn’t even guarantee being a physician (although the ~95% match rate means it’s a pretty safe bet you will be). There are certain specialties where without the step 1 score or the clinical grades or the research experience or the LORs that will be completely closed off to you, and specialties like ORTHO, plastics, derm, radiology and optho come to mind.</p>
<p>Thank you everyone that applied so far anymore advice would be highly appreciated. @i<em>wanna</em>be_Brown i din’t really care what type of PA , i just want to be involve in surgery. i said if i would be a cardiovascular PA, because most of people in my life have some kind of heart problem, it something i can relate two and would mind. but i want to be a orthopedic surgeon because i can personally relate to it the most, when i was a little i was diagnose with a bone diseases even though i cure from it it still affect me today. i’ m really passionate about orthopedic surgery i want to kids that endure the same pain i did as a child. but my family need my help 15 years( 4 years college, 4 years of medical school, 4-5 residency, 3 years fellowship, 2 years of specialty fellowship, 1 years of internship) that is to long for right now, i’m 19 i pretty young that is fine. as someone said once if i become a PA i might not want to go back to school and will forever regret it but i will regret not helping my family more. by the way i know i said i like to be in- charge and don’t like people tell what to do , is not what i mean really. what i mean i don’t want to have a career where i will never be in charge in forever have people tell what to do. i know before i can have my own practice and be independence i will have to listen and work under people for a while i don’t mind that, i love collaborating with people, i love working as team i know i will always have to, i actually enjoyed that but i want my freedom to what i think is the best for my patient and etch. some PA told me that surgical PA don’t really participate on surgery, i don’t i want to do the small staffs and watch others take one the big job. I love the idea of become a PA anything that involve me working in a hospital and helping people is good for me, plus PA have more patient interaction than most doctors that’s a plus and do alot of the same jobs, but i’ll rather become a doctor, but my finally financial situation it to much, i need a career withing 5 years. @ WayOutWestMom i am a second semester college freshmen, i will be a complete my pre-med requirement, and i will also applied to both PA and Medical school. i just want planing on taking a combine degree and get my degree within 5 years rather than 15 years. Thank you everyone.</p>
<p>The quickest way to get in the OR is to get certified as a surgical technician. 1 year at a CC. Starts at $20/hr. Excellent job outlook. </p>
<p>OP–unless you are currently enrolled in a direct admit combined BS/MS PA program, you will not be able to to complete you training in 5 years. PA programs require a bachelor’s degree plus 1000+ hours of direct patient experience, plus another 2 years to complete your PA coursework and clinical training.</p>
<p>Direct patient contact includes:
</p>
<p>Will you have be able to complete all those experience hours in the next 2 years while simultaneously participating in the ECs required for medical school and AND maintaining the high GPA and sGPA required for both PA and MD programs?</p>
<p>I think it will be difficult to next to impossible.</p>
<p>Please take some time to think thru your priorities and do some shadowing of both PAs and physicians to see which career path works better for you.</p>
<p>P.S. What makes you think physicians never get told what to do? Happens all the time… <cough> insuance companies<cough></cough></cough></p>
<p>@ WayOutWestMom, thank you. i was thinking of either joining a BS/MS program which i would finish i 5 years according from the information i got from the website, or just do the pre-med requirement and applied to both medical school and PA school since the requirement is the same for both school.The reason why i wanted to make a decisions to either go for 5 year MS program or finish pre-requirement and applied to both school, is because i feel my second idea will be a wast of time if i decide to go to PA school, but i will make the wait until after my sophomore years to decide, i don’t know.@WayOutWestMom i do know that that doctor get tell what to do sometime, its not that often as a PA, especially if you have your own practice like i’m planning on doing.</p>
<p>If you are about to complete your freshman year, it’s too late to enter a 5 year BS/MS program. Direct admit programs only accept students into the program immediately after high school.</p>
<p>thank you everyone, can someone help with another decisions i planning on transferring out SUNY Oswego to Binghamton, Geneseo, Ubuffalo. I have been accepted to all of them i was wondering what you guys think, which you think is the best for someone planning on going to medical school or PA school. i’m having really hard time deciding Geneseo is too rural, Ubuffalo is to far and to big, and binghamton is too dull and the town is boring and unattractive. but all them are amazing SUNY school. Thanks @WayOutWestMom, i always taught you could transfer to a BS/MS program before junior in college. i guess now i will finish my bachelor degree and pre-med requirement and take both the MCAT and GRE, and decide later of what i want to do. Thanks again everyone that replied any more advice would be highly appreciate .</p>
<p>No, you cannot transfer into a 5 year BS/MS program because of the way the program is structured. In a 5 year program, you have a severely compressed academic schedule and complete all undergrad work in 3 years. Years 4 & 5 are graduate and professional clinical classes.</p>
<p>BTW, in a 5 year program, any undergrad need-based aid ceases at the end of junior year. (Pell grant, subsized direct loans, Perkins loan, work study)</p>
<p>@schoolfees its funny you say that because i taught about that before i start college, that is why i am a biochemistry major. but wouldn’t that be harder though going to pharmacy school and medical school?</p>
<p>Pharmacy is a professional grad program that requires 3 years of training after undergrad. Admission is competitive (though not so much as medical or PA school).</p>
<p>Pharmacy is not a bridge career for physicans. It’s a career track in its own right. </p>
<p>There is no such thing as going to medical school part-time while working. There’s no time in medical school to work 15-20 hours/wk at something else. In med school (even during the didactic portion), your time is not always your own.</p>
<p>My son is graduating from PA school in Aug and is going into surgery, so he’ll get the best of both worlds. At this point we don’t know how much autonomy he’ll have. It will depend on the practice.</p>
<p>The reason I made mentioned Pharmacy here is because of the OP’s concern with financials. He seems very interested in the medical profession. I believe that with his capability he can become a pharmacist and also later go on to med school. Going to be a physician’s assistant I believe will cost him about 2 years or so , of which does not count towards a first degree. I stand to be corrected. I am not sure he can do the prerequisites for med school while studying for PA but he can with pharmacy.
He will still have otherwise have spent an extra 2-3 years in pharmacy but it is a professional degree (PharmD). I know some people who finished pharmacy and went on to med school. There are people who work as part time Pharmacists or relief Pharmacist while in med school. Yes it will not be easy but a 4 hours shift can give you anything between 200-240 dollars a day. A thousand a week. I know this is doable.</p>
<p>^So just to clarify, your suggestion is to go to pharmacy school, earn a PharmD, then work as a pharmacist, somewhere in there complete the remaining med school prereqs and apply to and be accepted to med school, then work as a pharmacist for 4h/day for 5days/wk to make some money while in med school? Just curious, do you know someone who has successfully followed this plan recently (past 10yrs)?</p>
<p>I would caution OP about the idea of working while in med school. Ideological arguments that one should focus solely on med school while in med school aside, it will likely be logistically challenging to juggle class requirements with other academic requirements with having a job. To my knowledge, none of the 200ish med students I know at my med school has a job during med school. Furthermore, if you were going to have a job during med school…you could probably only do it during your first two years, because your school owns your time during 3rd year and 4th year you’re busy with electives and residency interviews. </p>
<p>If money’s really such a concern that you can’t take out loans for med school, I’d definitely suggest working full time for a few years and saving lots of money rather than working during med school.</p>
<p>Also, you would need a job that lets you work nights as you’ll have class and small groups and such during the day. I know med students with jobs but literally they are either tutoring or babysitting jobs (jobs with very flexible, non traditional business hours jobs), and nothing else and as she said, this is only during Y1/Y2. During your surgery rotation you’re easily at the hospital over 12 hours each day and you also have to find time to study for your shelf exam or prep for whatever you were asked to do for the following day.</p>
<p>Now let’s think a little ideologically. $1000 a week, even without any weeks off means you’re talking about giving up 20 hours/week of studying to earn, over the course of the first 2 years, $96,000. Let’s say that by sacrificing that study time, you end up with a board score that places you out of orthopedics and forces you into pediatrics. You just lost an average of ~$200,000 each year for the rest of your career (<a href=“Medscape: Medscape Access”>Medscape: Medscape Access).</p>
<p>Would like to add that I think IWBB’s analysis–that losing 20h/wk of studying for 2yrs–could certainly result in a poorer board score overall and thus selection of a less lucrative specialty in the future. Boards prep is so freaking time consuming and really builds on what you learn during the first two years. Which is to say: I don’t think his example is extreme.</p>
<p>You might also keep in mind that, depending on your curriculum, sacrificing study time in order to go to work could have some real consequences. We have 4 final exams per block, and if you fail any exam one block and fail any exam the next block, you must repeat the year. While this isn’t a common occurrence, I bet it happens to 3-4 people/yr. The general wisdom is that once you’re in med school you’re in, and you likely won’t fail out altogether–I definitely believe this, but I can’t imagine why I’d ever set myself up to fail anything.</p>