<p>LOL. USNWR is very slanted towards private universities. The PA of Michigan hasn't changed very much over the years. It still is ranked above most of the so called top 25.</p>
<p>
Yeah, only rich kids who did not get into any top private school would go to Michigan over Wisconsin with a 50k price difference over four years.</p>
<p>Sure ead. Whatever you say.</p>
<p>A2wolves6. I would bring this discussion to the Wisconsin listing in the CC top universities site. I would do it, if Wisconsin were listed there.</p>
<p>Actually I have no problem at all with Michigan charging high tuition for OOS students as well as not giving them aid. It's a state school, and the emphasis should always be placed on the in-state students. If they were screwing over the in-state students, there would be a problem, but they're not and Michigan remains one of the best values in the country for in-state education. The OOS tuition doesn't effect me. I'm in-state and in 5 months, I will graduate and leave this economically depressed area. Why should I care?</p>
<p>The problem I had was people trying to dodge the fact that Michigan is the most expensive (or 2nd most, depending on criteria) public U, and then making an argument using data that works against their point.</p>
<p>Point taken A2Wolves6.</p>
<p>Apply to Berkeley, I heard its a pretty cool place.</p>
<p>"Wisconsin does not offer a "better" experience than Michigan. Different and as good, yes, but they are too different to compare. And the reason why OOS and international students are willing to pay so much to attend Michigan (and Cal) is because it is one of just three or four public universities that is generally held in the highest possible esteem."</p>
<p>Too different to compare? Alexandre, how different are they? Although I admit Michigan has slightly stronger reputation and academics than Wisconsin, I don't think that they're that different to compare. They're almost like virtual peers.</p>
<p>I think any student looking at virtually any science major would be hard put to favor Michigan over Wisconsin. I'd give a solid edge to Wisconsin. UM has a small edge in engineering and business but UW is pouring money into business and closing that gap. In liberal arts it's a mixed bag. Michigan is slightly better in some areas like social sciences and UW is better in languages but both are very good overall in these areas. Facilities are pretty much a draw. I think UM has done a better job of brand creation and marketing. It is much better at tooting its horn even though UW has just as much to brag about--more CEO's, more non medical NAS members, virtually the same numbers of major faculty awards over the years, virtually dead even in research.</p>
<p>"I think any student looking at virtually any science major would be hard put to favor Michigan over Wisconsin. I'd give a solid edge to Wisconsin."</p>
<p>Barrons, I am not sure I agree fully with that assessment. According to the latest USNWR rankings. Michigan edged Wisconsin out in 3 of the 6 Sciences and tied Wisconsin in 1 of the 6 Sciences. Wisconsin was ranked higher than Michigan is just 2 of the 6 Sciences:</p>
<p>BIOLOGY:</p>
<h1>15. University of Michigan</h1>
<h1>15. University of Wisconsin</h1>
<p>CHEMISTRY:</p>
<h1>7. University of Wisconsin</h1>
<h1>16. University of Michigan</h1>
<p>COMPUTER SCIENCE:</p>
<h1>11. University of Wisconsin</h1>
<h1>13. University of Michigan</h1>
<p>GEOLOGY:</p>
<h1>5. University of Michigan</h1>
<h1>15. University of Wisconsin</h1>
<p>MATHEMATICS:</p>
<h1>9. University of Michigan</h1>
<h1>14. University of Wisconsin</h1>
<p>PHYSICS:</p>
<h1>13. University of Michigan</h1>
<h1>16. University of Wisconsin</h1>
<p>I'd say Michigan and Wisconsin are pretty even in the Sciences. Michigan and Wisconsin are also pretty even in the Humanities and Social Sciences. </p>
<p>I also agree that Michigan only has a slight edge in Engineering. However, to say that Michigan only has a slight edge over Wisconsin in Business is an understatement. Michigan's Business school and its facilities are significantly better than Wisconsin's. </p>
<p>As I always say, academically, Michigan and Wisconsin are peers. What gives Michigan the edge over Wisconsin reputationally are its graduate professional programs, particularly its MBA, Law and Medical programs. Furthermore, although Wisconsin and Michigan both have excellent facilities, Michigan's Law, Medical, Engineering and Business facilities are better than Wisconsin's. Finally, although both universities have large endowments, Michigan has a significant edge there too.</p>
<p>Anyway, when I said Michigan and Wisconsin are different, I was not referring to quality. In terms of quality, I have always been adament that Wisconsin is as good as they come. I was referring to campus and town environment and culture.</p>
<p>You have not seen UW's new business buildings. It's a great complex. Business also raised $100,000,000 this year for academic improvements (not buildings).
Also there is much more to bio than just biology. There are probably 20 departments at UW that are subareas of biology from botany to zoology. I really think UW has the edge in life sciences and the research funding and patents it receives also indicates that edge.(double UM's)</p>
<p>Business school--total about 400,000 sf plus an executive education building down the street. Addition opens this Fall</p>
<p>University</a> of Wisconsin-Madison FLUNO CENTER for Executive Education Conference Center</p>
<p>After thinking about it for a bit I'm leaning towards not applying atm, and here's why...Georgia Tech is currently my #1 school right now, the moment I stepped foot on campus I knew it was right for me. Plus it is:</p>
<ul>
<li>cheaper OOS (I live in Tennessee)</li>
<li>almost as good for engineering</li>
<li>easier to get into</li>
<li>smaller</li>
<li>has better weather</li>
<li>closer to me (45-minute plane ride)</li>
</ul>
<p>The only problem is that the M/F ratio is >2:1 :/. I've heard some scary things about the lack of social life at GA Tech...</p>
<p>Barrons, you also haven't seen Michigan's new building for Ross that is almost completed. Michigan's programs head to head are rated better than Wisconsin's overall. It's not a huge difference btw.</p>
<p>Barrons, Ross is indeed significantly better than Wisconsin Business School. You said that Wisconsin's been pouring money into its b-school, do you think that Michigan hasn't? The advantage that Ross has over Wisconsin with regards to facilities & resources is not as small as you think it is.</p>
<p>fIN, not all your reasons for preferring GT are valid. </p>
<p>First of all, Detroit is only 40 minutes (by plane) further from Tennessee than GT. Tennessee to Atlanta is a 60 minute flight (I am not sure where you got 45 minutes, Knoxville and Nashville are both like 1 hour flights to Atlanta), Tennessee to Detroit is a 100 minute flight. So it's not like Detroit is a long flight. Besides, if memory serves, tickets to Detroit are significantly cheaper than tickets to Atlanta. </p>
<p>Secondly, although Michigan is larger than GT, GT's CoE is significantly larger than Michigan's CoE.
UNDERGRADS ENROLLED IN CoE:
Georgia Tech: 7,300
Michigan: 5,100</p>
<p>GRADUATE STUDENTS ENROLLED IN CoE:
Georgia Tech: 3,600
Michigan: 2,600</p>
<p>TOTAL STUDENTS:
Georgia Tech: 11,000
Michigan: 7,700</p>
<p>College</a> of Engineering at Georgia Tech</p>
<p>Michigan</a> Engineering | Student Profile</p>
<p>Georgia Tech's CoE is roughly 40% larger than Michigan's.</p>
<p>Thirdly, I am also not sure how being easier to get into is a positive. It isn't a negative mind you, I personally attach minimal importance to selectivity. </p>
<p>In Georgia Tech's defense, it is not merely "almost as good as Michigan for Engineering"...it is every bit as good.</p>
<p>And yes, GT is definitely more affordable than Michigan, so that's a big plus. </p>
<p>I have two problems with GT:</p>
<p>First of all, the undergraduate experience you will have there. It isn't just the male to female ratio. It goes beyond that. Since most students are Engineering and Science majors, the school's overall atmosphere tends to be very intense and serious. GT is not the funnest place to spend four undergraduate years.</p>
<p>Secondly, if you chose to change majors to say Business or Economics or another Social Science, GT is not quite as good.</p>
<p>So, if your folks can easily afford the difference, I would probably recommend Michigan. If money is an issue, go for GT.</p>
<p>EDIT</p>
<p>Upon re-reading your original post, given your family's financial resources, I would recommend GT. Going there would afford you the luxury of graduating debt-free. Getting a degree from a top 10 Engineering program like GT while staying virtually debt-free is a great bargain. No university, Michigan included, is worth $50k of debts when you have a much more affordable alternative like GT.</p>
<p>Back to Wisconsin, fIN, you may want to consider Wisconsin. Like Michigan, it has an awesome campus and college town feel, a well balanced student body and it is roughly $10,000/year cheaper than Michigan. Wisconsin's CoE is almost as good as GT's and Michigan's. Should you chose to change majors to Business or Econ or whatever, chances are, Wisconsin will be stronger than GT. Madison may be slightly further away and the weather is even worse than Michigan's, but in terms of value, overall quality and overall undergraduate experience, I think Wisconsin is definitely worth a look.</p>
<p>You may want to consider UIUC too. Only 400 miles or 6 hrs by car. UIUC's CoE is on par with GT/Michigan/Wisconsin. The overall campus life is not as good as Michigan and Wisconsin but certainly better than GT.</p>
<p>I am aware of the new Ross building. And yes to is very nice. So are UW's. All the UW SOB buildings have been built since the 90's and are very state of the art. UM's largest advantage is that the ug program is very small--less than half the size of UW's. This also makes it very difficult for many prospective students to get the major they wanted. That is unfair to some kids paying over $40,000/yr for school and unfair to lots of instate kids.</p>
<p>My class rank is low though, between 25-30% (my school is competitive though, average ACT is 24, one of the best for Tennessee public schools), so UIUC is a huge reach for me, as is Michigan. Georgia Tech doesn't consider class rank, and my weighted GPA is within the 50 percentile. I'm not sure about UW, I'll have to look more into that, but judging by collegeboard it looks like it will be a reach for me too as well (unless they dont consider class rank like GT)...</p>
<pre><code>* 60% in top 10th of graduating class
* 93% in top quarter of graduating class
* 100% in top half of graduating class
</code></pre>