<p>Second job in addition to the $30k day job. It would also be possible to live in certain areas of the outer boroughs on the $30k in a shared situation. It wouldn’t necessarily be pleasant, but it would be doable. In fact, in the outer boroughs, the $30k isn’t such an outrageously small amount.</p>
<p>Marian- I have kids, nieces, nephews, daughter of college roommate, etc. who have done the 30K life in NY, DC, Boston. Marginal neighborhood, no car, first to show up at a company sponsored lunch or breakfast (real food!). And way too many roommates.</p>
<p>And then as Zooser helpfully points out- SAT tutoring on the weekend. Doing a catering gig as a waiter. Selling perfume on Sundays before Xmas, Valentine’s, Mothers Days. Craigslist posts a bunch of “one time only” jobs every weekend-- my niece just did a gig for a benefit at one of the museums and in addition to the very nice pay, got two tickets to a special exhibit and a great catered meal.</p>
<p>Ema - There are a lot of emotions regarding this topic. It’s not black and white. There are many recent grads that are struggling despite their worthy efforts and willingness to live lean for a while. However, many of the parents on this thread (including me) know peers of yours that are not realistic, etc. Some of the parents here may be frustrated with their own child’s efforts, who knows? We older folks do have the benefit of experience though. Many of us struggled every month with bills (some probably still do). It is a terrible feeling to be worried about money all the time and to be dependent on someone else, I know! It is an especially rude awakening when one thought that an investment in a college education would open better doors. I don’t assume an un/underemployed grad is lazy or spoiled, but I do know many of the specific “basement dwellers” in my neighborhood are! I am rooting for you. Try not to be discouraged.</p>
<p>I just came up with this. In a very good area of Staten Island, a two-bedroom apartment rents for $1500 with utilities. The person can either take the bus to the ferry or walk/bike to the ferry (which is free). Assuming bus, that would be another $4.50 per day. So $750 for apartment and $90 for commuting (now it would be very easy to knock a couple of hundred dollars a month off that rent to be in a less nice neighborhood). Assuming about $300 per month for food, it is doable. Not easy. There would have to be scrimping, sale shopping, packing lunch, eating ramen noodles, but it could be done. Within NYC on one job.</p>
<p>Son knows a lab tech at the place where he works that works part time at a local grocery store bagging groceries - I’d imagine that he gets discounts on food there. This is in Boston.</p>
<p>So that isn’t really $30K but it’s a $30K job with a part-time minimum wage job.</p>
<p>Our kids’ apartment rents for $1,000/month and it’s two spacious bedrooms and includes parking. I’ve seen as many as four students renting these units. That’s $250/month each and you can take the Commuter Rail into Boston. $2K/month - $250 (rent) - $9x2x20 (commuting) = ~$1,400 for other stuff.</p>
<p>I imagine that there are some rougher areas of Boston where the rent is a lot lower than it is close to where there are a lot of jobs, say along the Red Line. I had a friend that used to squat in a building in South Boston. Rent = $0.</p>
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<p>Learning how to navigate and work with tablet PC/mobile phone interfaces as that is increasingly becoming required in some companies/industries I know of. </p>
<p>One issue college students and those in the working world need to be mindful of is the need to keep up with the technological trends/pace to avoid being left in the dust with obsolete/non-existent technological skills necessary for the near/far future. </p>
<p>One group of folks I know of who have been suffering in the last decade employment-wise are those whose skills have been rendered obsolete due to technological changes and they aren’t able to keep up due to technological/continuing ed access issues and/or their inability/unwillingness to learn new technologies.</p>
<p>Zooser-- most companies in NYC participate in the transitchek program to subsidize the cost of the bus/subway. Get a third roommate in that apartment on Staten Island and you’re even going out to dinner once a month.</p>
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Very true, but I’m assuming no benefits. The young person could qualify for the NY State health plan, though, and for the summer months they could get breakfast and lunch at one of the countless public schools in the city because the program is not only for students, it’s for anyone.</p>
<p>ema - well, you know I did not say those things and I am rooting for you. I remember one weekend that I had $5 for an entire weekend. Friday night, All day Sat and all day Sunday. There was a local pizza place that gave you a slice and a coke for 50 cents. Guess where I ate that entire weekend. I mean I had some pretty lean times. Alot of us have. Ema, with your current situation (boyfriend), are you limiting yourself to your immediate area for a job. If you are - that’s your choice, but it could be limiting your job opportunities. Are you willing to relocate? And please know that I’m not passing judgement.</p>
<p>You’re not including student loans or car costs for those numerous cities that don’t have public transportation. I live in a podunk suburb and wouldn’t dream of finding a 2br with parking for $1000. I pay more than that for less! Then I get to take out $150 a month for gasoline, for driving nowhere but to work and back since we take boyfriend’s car for anything else, and there’s another $206 a month taken out of my check for the employee health insurance plan. At my job in my state, after taxes and health insurance are taken out, a 30k job amounts to about $1600/mo. If there are significant loan payments to add into the mix, that is tough.</p>
<p>Some of you guys (not necessarily most/all…did not read all eight pages) need to wake up and smell the coffee. “One in two,” which is fifty percent (50%) or one-half of all new graduates (just in case your mathematics / numerical thinking skills are suffering from being out of college so long) is far too many to blame it on the underemployed/unemployed themselves. Yes, in some cases it is their fault. As others have mentioned, I have seen countless students just not care to do anything in college to increase their chance of getting a job afterwards. However, a fair amount of these cases (including myself) are unemployed <em>despite</em> working very hard during and after college, and this is only the fault of the “new” economy, and I am not just talking about the recession, which only makes job hunting in the “new” economy even worse.</p>
<p>Goals- Ok, I’ll bite. What do you want to do, what kind of jobs have you been looking for, how are you supporting yourself now, how far from your current “base” have you cast the net?</p>
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<p>The 2br + parking for $1K is in a gritty urban area. There was a double-homicide two blocks away two years ago. The trial of the people responsible is coming up soon. One could also apply the principle to a suburban home with (more) roommates. That’s what we did in my era.</p>
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<p>I didn’t have a car for my first job. It was about a three mile walk or I could take two buses with one transfer. I could also ride my bicycle. A car adds a lot to living expenses. There are couples that live with one vehicle too. It can be a pain and it certainly costs in time but it can be a way to save.</p>
<p>Any kind of debt can make things tough.</p>
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What about 4 out of 10? Because those were the numbers at the height of the dot-com boom (Read the article). And according to the article a record low. </p>
<p>So apparently this is not a new phenomenon. Seems like UE-UnderE number varies between 40 and 50%. </p>
<p>Of course, I don’t agree with blaming the job seekers. I’m sure it is tougher out there these days. But I bet that recent graduates have always been more likely to be “underemployed.” It takes a while to settle into your niche.</p>
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<p><a href=“Second Bachelor's vs First Master's - Business Major - College Confidential Forums”>Second Bachelor's vs First Master's - Business Major - College Confidential Forums;
<p>Ema,</p>
<p>When I read your posts I get the impression that you believe that we adults can not possibly understand because we’ve never had it so bad.</p>
<p>When my son was born I was working as a temp with no benefits or paid time off. My then BF was also working as a temp making about $9/hour. We were in the midwest, where the cost of living was lower than NY, but we supported a family of 3 on $9/hour for several months, when we both had college degrees.</p>
<p>When we struggled with bills, the first thing to go was the cable TV, for awhile I lived in an area too far away from a city to pick up network TV, so spent a lot of time watching PBS. The next thing to go was the phone. This was in a time when there were no cell phones…and no land line also meant no internet. Once I lived for a month without electricity (yes, it IS possible - the lack of hot water is the most difficult part). We abused credit in ways credit agencies don’t even mention - of course using one credit card to pay the bills on the others, then used those to pay the bills on the first the next month, but it was also much easier then to buy big ticket items on credit and then return them and ask for cash so that you could use that money to pay your rent.</p>
<p>I have a sister who is 10 years younger than me. When her family was starting out they also struggled. I made the above suggestions. Eliminate anything you don’t need to survive from your budget. It’s amazing how long you can live on a loaf of bread, a jar of peanut butter, and a 2lb box of pasta if you’re really motivated. However she kept paying for their internet service - her husband HAD to have it to look for a job, she kept paying for both their smartphones - he HAD to have his phone so potential employers could call and she needed hers…well, I don’t remember why, but she had some reason, she kept paying for their cable TV and…their Netflix subscription??? She told me it was the only ‘luxury’ they could afford. I told her when you’re struggling with bills, you don’t get luxuries. Then she’d complain how they didn’t have the money to pay their credit card bills or that they were having trouble paying for their heat in the winter… I didn’t feel sorry for her.</p>
<p>kleibo, sorry I misattributed those comments to you-- I was frustrated. </p>
<p>To answer your question, when I was job hunting I was willing to relocate and looked all over the country (and in a few other countries, actually), but I ended up not being able to afford to move out of my parents place to go for any of those jobs-- I could PM you specifics if you like but I would like to avoid having my finances picked apart by the masses here. 
I was more than willing to do whatever it took, I applied to anything and everything I seemed remotely qualified for-- even receptionist and fast food joint jobs-- but I honestly don’t think I am qualified to be making very much more than I am right now in this market, all the jobs I was getting interviews for paid even less than this. I didn’t find anything better in other states, either. But if I can stay afloat for a few years, I think I’ll be okay… I just need to pay my dues for a while. Unfortunately, there isn’t a lot of upward mobility where I am at and once I have a bit of experience under my belt I am going to have to figure out what to do about that. For the moment, I think I am stuck for a little while. Maybe I am wrong about that.</p>
<p>Things have changed since I first graduated, and I am tied to the area now. That is because I am probably going to be engaged within the year and boyfriend and I are doing fine together so I’m not as worried about it, otherwise I’d be more than willing to relocate for my next job. It would be different were the relationship not so serious, but it is. We are choosing where in the state to live based on proximity to his work and centrality to all of the cities I might like to work in in the future, so I will have quite a bit of flexibility but will have to stay in the Metro-Detroit area. </p>
<p>I don’t care what I have to do, I just want the peace of mind of knowing that I can pay my bills by myself. I’ll get there. Apart from taking out my student loans in the first place, I think I’ve been doing all the right things. I most certainly am not letting my boyfriend pay the rent by himself so I can drink starbucks and have a data plan. I have never lived with those kinds of luxuries and don’t ever expect to.</p>
<p>jrcsmom-- I absolutely don’t believe that you can’t understand because you’ve never had it this bad-- no way! I know better than that. Struggling is nothing new, and I’m not even struggling that badly since I do have support. The tone in my messages that I think you’re picking up on is stemming from the idea that people here seem to think if I just get rid of the iphone and gym memberships I don’t have, everything will be fine-- and that’s simply not the world we live in. It is possible to cut out the non-necessities and STILL be in trouble, and maybe I’ve misinterpreted the posts here as you’ve misinterpreted mine, but the impression I am getting is that posters here think that’s not possible.</p>
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You will absolutely get there! Of course you will, and sooner than you think. I know it’s hard, but just be a little patient and sooner than you realize you will be where you want to be. You are doing the right things and you are fortunate to have someone else help you. Nothing wrong with that. Over the course of your lifetime you will be the one helping and it will all even out. Just hang in there and don’t forget to enjoy your life.</p>
<p>Ema - see that’s why we’re rooting for you. You are sacraficing for hopefully a better future for you and your DB - dear boyfriend LOL. Good Luck. Maybe some angel will shed some good news on you soon.</p>
<p>As a graduating college senior who has found a FT job offer in a “liberal arts” field aka my “dream job,” here is what I’ve learned and observed (it’s pretty long):</p>
<p>1) As an earlier college senior posted, I really have observed that many of my classmates really stink at looking for jobs. These are smart people - good students with decent work histories and communication skills that employers are looking for, but somehow they just haven’t gotten jobs. This is for a couple reasons: </p>
<p>a. They still don’t know what they want to do for a career. If you are so indecisive on what you want to do for a career, it makes it a lot harder to find what jobs you think you’re suited for. In this case, I’d suggest to look to something that is temporary but gives you great, marketable experience no matter what career field you go into i.e. teaching english abroad or Americorps positions (finding a paid internship instead of a full time position might be a good option here too). </p>
<p>b. They are inflexible with what they want to do for a career. They have to be in certain cities, have to have a certain salary, aren’t applying to jobs that would otherwise interest them because they are picky for various reasons. You cannot be inflexible and have unrealistic expectations of the job market, especially if you are a liberal arts major. Applying to your 10 dream jobs and not hearing back from any of them should not discourage you from applying to others. </p>
<p>c. They failed to take advantage of the academic things at school that set them apart from other students. i.e. leadership positions in student organizations, submitting papers for review at academic journals or conferences, interesting specializations and minors and double majors. You pay so much for tuition - why aren’t you doing other things that supplement a good education? </p>
<p>d. They want to switch career fields completely after they’ve already gotten a degree. So you spend 4-5 years getting your bachelor’s degree in poly sci. Then you discover you want to work in business and you have only taken a couple related business/economics courses. Why would an employer choose you, a poly-sci major interested in business, over someone who stuck with business from the beginning? If you are intending on switching fields so soon after you graduate, you better have a good answer for this. </p>
<p>e. They have applied to tons of positions - have interviewed for a couple - and are still waiting. Holy cow be patient friends. Some jobs can take upwards of a year in the hiring process. APPLY EARLY!!! Don’t wait until graduation or a few months before graduation to start panicking. A lot of apps close in August, September, and October (particularly in the most competitive business and government jobs) the year before you graduate. Job hunting is a continuous process, not just a “I sent out 10 applications, now lets watch the job offers roll in” kinda deal. </p>
<p>Note: these are all criticisms of students with decent work histories (i.e. at least 1 relevant work experience, multiple random part-time jobs). If you do not have a work history at all and you are graduating college right now, you don’t deserve a full time job offer, period. I have no sympathy for students who don’t know or understand the value of working/earning your own way. </p>
<p>Other things: </p>
<p>2) In most fields you do NOT have to take an unpaid internship. I’ve had anywhere from 1-3 different jobs/internships at a time since I was a junior in high school, each one gradually progressing into the career areas I’m most interested in. I’ve only taken an unpaid internship once (and I got high school credit for it). Yes, paid internships are harder to find, and tend to be a lot more competitive, but they are definitely out there and rather plentiful if you are willing to relocate, especially if you have had other jobs/leadership positions in the past. </p>
<p>3) Networking can only get you so far. I come from a working class family - my dad worked in construction and now is a driver’s ed teacher, while my mom worked as a bookkeeper and now is a flight dispatcher for an airline. My family’s friends of friends of friends do not work in anything related to what I want to do - and even if they did, they likely wouldn’t be able to help me beyond getting my resume considered. Networking is great for certain career fields, but in others, it might be better to control the tangibles. i.e. the number of applications you send out to companies, making sure you send thank you notes after interviews etc. </p>
<p>4) A lot of it is luck. I would say of the jobs that I’ve gotten (including my full time one) at least half of it is luck. The persons perusing my resume overlooked my average GPA and average major and for some reason saw that I would fit into their organization better than others. My internship is the place that offered me a full-time position. So just put “luck in your favor” - as a student, it is your responsibility to make the best of any given situation. That means apply to jobs that you are qualified for that you wouldn’t otherwise consider, talk to a lot of different people about career stuff - get them to check out your resume and application materials, go to every career event/fair that you can and even if you don’t get a job out of it, you might gain knowledge about the field that you wouldn’t have known otherwise.</p>