The spokesperson for the President at one of our colleges (and former governor) boasted proudly that our state engineering flagship had so many OOS students and internationals due to the fact that they were better prepared than our IS students. I thought it was an odd point of pride, considering that we are a state known for falling wages, brain drain and decreasing tax revenues. The state continues to subsidize those students that will never benefit our state.
Most of the rest of that white paper linked in the OP is not in English. Perhaps someone can translate. It does say that over 450k students are studying “overseas” but doesnt say how many are in countries other than the US.
India also has an emerging middle class but most the students from India do not flaunt their wealth. So where do the rich in India go to college en masses. I know this is a Chinese thread but just wondering since Cobrat mentioned the emerging middle class.
I doubt it’s all China or all prestigious schools. My sister-in-law is a professor at a small religious college (one of the many other Wesleyans). She says that cheating and plagiarism are rampant by international students–particularly rich Arab students in their case. She says that these students are of the opinion that cheating and plagiarism aren’t wrong if they don’t get caught. There is some pressure to keep the students there despite this, because of the money they bring in.
Post #44, I did mention FIFA, if you follow the news, one of the country benefit from FIFA decisions was Qatar. And the other one is Russia. All non Asian countries.
@Bay, I wonder what “other academic salaries” are. Those and “temp academic salaries” are also big.
@MizzBee, a little difficult to say that state tax dollars subsidize OOS when state tax dollars don’t even cover the in-state discount at most top publics these days. If anything, OOS and internationals are subsidizing in-state students.
Graduate student TA’s perhaps? Idk
Why can’t we get smart OOS and internationals to subsidizing in state students?
Purpletitan,
Per your second source earlier, tuition and fees makes up only 20% of total Cal funding. How is it possible that internationals are not getting the benefit of the other 80% of funding? If they are benefitting at all from any of those other sources, then they are being subsidized.
@Bay, note that those numbers are from 6 years ago.
I’m not sure when the UC’s raised rates, but back maybe 13 years ago, even OOS rates at UC’s were a good deal. Back then, no doubt OOS were subsidized. These days, it’s unlikely. Also note that the subsidy is only what the CA government pays. I believe that percentage is substantially lower these days as well. It’s hard to call Federal spending (most of which likely go to research or fin aid for American students) or even outside gifts and contracts as subsidies by CA taxpayers.
Many of the Mainland Chinese students and some from Taiwan and Hong Kong were on scholarships from the college/con or from an outside source.
However, back then it was apparent that the students from the latter two regions of the Sinosphere had far more wealth on average than their Mainland counterparts.
Only exception to the rule were a handful of Mainland students who were sons/daughters of officials/well-connected business people in Mainland China. Most, however, tended to keep a low profile and try avoid drawing attention to themselves.
Ynotgo,
Thats horrible. Pressure to ignore rampant cheating because they are full pay? Slimy and more slimy.
@jym626, welcome to life at a non-prestigious tuition-dependent private.
State flagships, while sink-or-swim, bureaucratic and sometimes impersonal, also generally have few qualms about failing people who deserve to. It seems that at the vast majority of them, the faculty still call the shots when it comes to setting academic standards within the classroom.
Let’s not get too high on that horse now. Swap out “full pay” for “on the football/basketball team” and the statement would be even more widely applicable and readily accepted with a wink and a nod.
well, anomander, most of the athletes are not disingenuous about their scholastic abilities.
“India also has an emerging middle class but most the students from India do not flaunt their wealth. So where do the rich in India go to college en masses. I know this is a Chinese thread but just wondering since Cobrat mentioned the emerging middle class.”
In response to the above I would posit that first, India’s emerging middle class is by no means “wealthy” when they are in the US spending dollars. They still are pinched by US prices. Second, there are very good elite colleges that many choose to attend here because of the connections they will make (not the IIT technical type of schools but more like Indian Ivy Schools.) Third, the REALLY wealthy in India (children of politicians) don’t need to go abroad for an education…they will be fine staying here and benefiting from the wealth.
For 2013-14
http://www.iie.org/en/Services/Project-Atlas/United-States/International-Students-In-US
At the link, you can see the break down by previous years. For example, for 2005-2006, India was #1 with 76,503 (13.5%) while China was #2 with 62,582 (11.1%). Last year, the number of students from China increased by almost 80,000. Wonder how long that trend will continue.
While a bit of a side issue, and I apologize if this is too much of a digression - I never understood taking international students to fill up on “full pay” slots when US citizens could make up many of these spots in the “elite colleges”. However, those slots of course would not equal the hundreds of thousands of students that are international, and explains the large number of international students at non elite colleges. Many must be attending schools all over the US. Also while OOS US full pay students may be willing to pay for UMichigan or UC schools and a few other top publics, they may prefer to attend a private school with more “cachet” than some other excellent publics. I think some OOS publics are attractive for the “college life” aspects that they offer outside of academics eg. sports, greek life etc. In NJ they are trying to improve the reputation of Rutgers with the new Big 10 affiliation. Presumably getting more OOS money is one of the reasons that this is happening.
If it all comes down to the money, there are few choices to close the gap: raise tuition and/or taxes, and/or cut expenses. The internationals who are full pay become a “free money” type of economic crutch. Yes, all students have associated expenses, but if comparing those who will pay more to those who will pay less, all other things being “equal”, take the customers who pay more. Marginal revenue increases. I am no economist, so excuse my simplistic view. Someone creative out there needs to find another solution.
If I recall correctly, there was a federal incentive offered, beginning I think in the GHW Bush administration, to US colleges and universities for taking international students.