<p>My kids’ school typically has 7-9% make NMF. That is rather high for the area. Only one other school in the area usually does that well.</p>
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<p>No, the NMSF paperwork doesn’t have such a req’t. And, if a school is requiring such, I’d make a huge stink (unless the school requires all of its students to have community service hours).</p>
<p>Actually, many kids can sign up for the PSAT at any private school. So, if your hs limits the number, then contact a local private and ask if your child can take the test there. It usually doesn’t cost much.</p>
<p>My nephew’s school didn’t offer the “practice” PSAT for sophomores, so him mom paid to have him take it at another school.</p>
<p>However, you have to ask the other school well in advance. They have to order the right number of tests and submit student names. Many homeschooling families take advantage of this option. Some schools only allow those in the “honors track” to take the PSAT…so other families seek the test elsewhere.</p>
<p>"Well, now I wonder no more. I got this information directly from National Merit Scholarship Corporation. Only 4603 out of more than 22,000 high schools in the country have at least one National Merit Semifinalist. Since PSAT scores track SAT scores very well, I have no doubt there are many high schools out there with either severe grades inflation or very poor quality of education. </p>
<p>It’s important to realize that only college-bound students take the SAT/PSAT, and those students probably don’t include students planning on going to community colleges or to low ranking colleges that don’t require SATs . An average SAT score is only about 1500. Yet that 1500 is higher than the average would be if all students were taking the test. </p>
<p>Consequently, it’s not surprising that the majority of high schools in the country don’t have any NM scholars. It’s only on CC where one would think that, for instance, a 2000 SAT score indicates one is stupid, and having a 2.5 high school average reflects stupidity. Most people in the country would be delighted to have the scores and grades that people here make fun of. Most people in the country would be proud to be sending their kids off to colleges that CC people turn up their noses at.</p>
<p>Most people in this country don’t know any NM scholars and would consider someone heading to a four-year university of any kind to be highly successful.</p>
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<p>Our school actually does require the students to do community service hours (the school coordinates it all) but it has nothing to do with the PSAT or any other eligibility requirements. They just want the kids to learn to ‘give back’ to the community.</p>
<p>Momlive-- at son’s school, the first 100 to sign up and pay the fee (I vaguely remember it being $13) take the test. The guidance counselor nags all of the IB students into signing up. You are absolutely right that it makes no sense. This is much more an ACT state, all juniors here are required to take the “PLAN”, which is a sort of PSAT equivelent for the ACT.</p>
<p>I am confused by the comments about service being required. My son is NMS at AU now, when he took his qualifiying PSAT, only Juniors could complete. He did have to complete an application and write a very bried essay to advance to finalist. I believe the principal also writes a recomendation letter.</p>
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<p>Yep, this place does paint a distorted sense of reality. Some days my 3.8 GPA/ NMSF/ 31 ACT kid looks downright less than average here at CC! Then I remember it’s a ‘self-selective’ group of parents/kids.</p>
<p>momto2-- True, you can take it elsewhere (and son did in 9th grade when he was selfschooled), but the reality is that most kids aren’t going to bother, most parents don’t really know what benefits could acrue from scoring well on the PSAT.</p>
<p>From [National</a> Merit Scholarship Corporation](<a href=“http://www.nationalmerit.org:%5DNational”>http://www.nationalmerit.org:)</p>
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<p>Emphasis mine.</p>
<p>The number of students who can be NMSFs each year is artificially capped; the number of students who can memorize all the steps of the conjugation of paramecia (to cite one task of my 10th grade biology class) and score well on a test of same is not.</p>
<p>Wow, our district has taken an approach opposite to what some of your districts have taken. This year for the first time, every single student in grades 9-11 is required to take the PSAT and the school district is paying. Each year out of a class of roughly 600, our “wealthy competitive suburban school” will have between 2 and 5 NMSF. The average doesn’t even approach 1% of the students. I think our district is ashamed.</p>
<p>The fact that America’s NMSF’s come from only 20% of all schools shouldn’t surprise anyone. Let me guess that most of those NMSF’s did not come out of poor inner city schools or poor to average rural and suburban schools.</p>
<p>I can’t remember the last time that a NMSF came out of our local schools. Not that our top grads can’t compete anywhere. A lot of them go to very good and very demanding colleges and do very well there once acclimated. But the culture in this part of NYS does not demand the type of prep support provided to wannabe Ivy Leaguers in Westchester County and its counterparts. This year was the first time in recent memory that the guidance counselors at our school even mentioned that the PSAT had any connection to the NMS program – and that was just in passing. Virtually no one takes prep courses for the SAT let alone the PSAT. Kids, even those in the top 20% of the class, commonly pass on taking the PSAT so they can go on a class field trip or participate in a sporting event. I am certain that our top students could raise their scores significantly if they put any effort into prepping for the test but that is just not done. Matter of fact it is looked down upon by much of the community, including teachers and some guidance counselors, to get “worked up” about standardized tests.</p>
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<p>It’s been my experience that educators who weren’t that stellar of students themselves tend to “pooh pooh” standardized tests and NMF, because they were never good in those areas.</p>
<p>My Quote:
And, if a school is requiring such, I’d make a huge stink (unless the school requires all of its students to have community service hours). </p>
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<p>Please don’t misunderstand…my kids’ school (Catholic) also required 100 hours of community service for all of its students…I have NO PROBLEM with that… BUT…if it ONLY required NMSF students to do the hours, I’d put up a HUGE stink since that is not part of the NM process. No school should set up artificial parameters for its students to qualify for NMF.</p>
<p>There are also a large number of very small high schools in the West anyway. In a high school of 100 students and 25 seniors it would not surprise me to not see any NMF at all. Stats work against you in raw numbers.</p>
<p>One thing I don’t like about limiting the juniors that take the PSAT is that it artificially changes who the top 1% in the state are. </p>
<p>If every (or nearly every) junior took the PSAT, then being in the top 1% would include more kids. By only allowing the “best of the best” to take the PSAT, you are “screwing” some of the best students who now aren’t in that top 1%.</p>
<p>That would be like taking the top students, putting them in an AP Cal class and telling them that only the top 1% in the class would get an A. That would be very unfair, especially if there were little difference between the top 5%</p>
<p>If our school weren’t in NY we’d have a lot more winners. We never have more than 2 or 3 finalists, but there are aof dozen or so commended students. For a big comprehensive school I think we don’t do so badly, but my younger son, in particular, is surprised that his friends don’t do better. Their grades are often better, but when it comes to tests (SAT, APs) he blows them away. It’s not just the teaching.</p>
<p>I’m not surprised either, but we had 9 semi finalists last year and generally have a one or so NMS in the middle of ACT land in a place few have heard of. We have a small rigorous system. The school pays for all students to take the PSAT and it’s becoming more difiicult to find an SAT test location but obviously those that make the cut drive somewhere and take the SAT in hopes of the scholarship. I think it’s great that we give the opportunity to the kids to get the scholarshp. It’s not Lake Wobegon, it’s just a system of very dedicated and involved teachers, parents and kids - that’s how you grow kids that are high percentile on standardized tests. No test prep fever, few take ACT tests more than once for practice and twice to count. Little college ansgt here in the heartland and lots of great colleges universities. No complaints.</p>
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<p>I was WRONG - I hate when that happens. I was mistakenly thinking of National Honor Society. Sorry guys.</p>
<p>I don’t find this shocking at all. Yes, most of the schools that people on CC attend are good schools that produce high scoring students. However, not everyone has the luxury of attending a “good” school. Many students go to schools where they’re are not even finishing high school, let alone thinking about college. A survey last year showed that nearly 50% of students going to HS in US large cities are dropping out. The national dropout rate was 30%, which means nearly a third of high school age kids are dropping out. Many of these kids aren’t taking the SAT, let alone the PSAT. And they’re surely not scoring high enough to be NMSFs.</p>
<p>You have to remember that the whole country isn’t like CC. It’s an elite group of student who come on this forum. Not everyone has it as easy as we do. At my school, we had about 30 NMSFs this year. A could miles down the road in Los Angeles, I’m sure the same can’t be said for their public schools.</p>
<p>For the first time this year our HS is giving the test on Wednesday and requiring all juniors to take it (and paying for it). Previous years, it was on Saturday and optional, and we paid. I believe they are trying to up their numbers to look better. I don’t think, as someone commented, that not having any NMSF means grades are inflated. I can’t get my kids excited to prep for the PSAT. My oldest did not do particularly well on the PSAT (180-ish), but did better on the SAT (2060) and even better on the ACT (33). Plus she had numerous 5’s and 4’s on AP exams. I have been working with 2nd child for next week’s test, but I don’t expect him to make NMSF, just want him high enough to snag a corporate scholarship from H’s company.</p>