A story of Berkeley's disgusting bureaucracy...

Colleges & Universities A-Z University of California - Berkeley
1

<p>I just felt like I should share a story, not looking for sympathy but I need to share a personal anonymous short story related to UC Berkeley's bureaucracy and why you should not go here...</p>

<p>First off, I have this generalized anxiety disorder, it flares up every once in a while but it isn't too bad that I can't control it, and have had the condition since 2005. I didn't want to register it with the DSP since my counselor said it may cause more trouble than needed, and it hasn't hurt my academic progress ever (I did get into UC Berkeley after all)...</p>

<p>This last winter was particularly hard on me. Socially, academically, etc, I wasn't doing too well. Lots of things collided, berkeley was becoming unbearable, and in January I made a rash decision to overdose on my pills to attempt to hurt myself. It caused me a lot of psychological as well as physical duress, and I was basically incapable of doing a lot of things for a couple weeks during the spring 2010 semester. </p>

<p>This particularly affected one class of mine, and I decided to drop it even though I was at 13 units. This would lead me to 9 units. I figured I could petition for a drop of the class even if it was below the required amount just to get through the semester, and my counselor and parents commended me for sticking it out with a light load to keep on track to graduation even after such a traumatizing event.</p>

<p>I just got a call today from the L&S advisor. She said I could not take the drop and I would immediately fail the class instead, even after all I went through. She used a bureaucratic loophole: I did not register my condition with DSP, even though it NEVER hurt my academic progress until now. My counselor, parents, and myself are disgusted by their need to use bureaucracy in light of such an occurrence, so I'm most likely going to take this semester off even though I tried my hardest to get SOME credits in light of what happened.</p>

<p>Again, I don't care if you have no sympathy for me, I understand some people don't really "Get" generalized anxiety disorder and manic depression and think it's just a character flaw. I just felt like venting my frustration at what I feel is unnecessary bureaucracy. </p>

<p>Thoughts? Suggestions? Just curious as to your input, positive or negative...</p>

2

<p>I think it’s time to petition to the dean and get everything fixed up.</p>

<p>Personally, I wouldn’t fault the campus too much here because there are certain procedures, and they have to ensure fairness. The lesson here is basically - register with the DSP, because you have a legitimate condition. Sure, it may be a lot of trouble, but just for things like this, it’s worth it.</p>

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<p>Maybe withdraw for the semester, which avoids the failing grade?</p>

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<p>Berkeley is a very large public school, so they don’t really have a choice. They have to do it this way.</p>

<p>Think about it. The L&S advisor does not know you. She has no idea about what has happened in your life. The only thing she knows about you is that you would like to drop a course 2 months into the semester, bringing you down to 9 units, because of a psychological disorder you have never before told the school about. It’s unfortunate, but she has absolutely no way to distinguish you from the kid who fabricated a problem to drop a course he didn’t like.</p>

<p>That’s why I give people the advice I do. If you have problems which need special attention, you need to think very hard about going to a large public school. They will not go out of their way to accomodate you; you have to make it happen yourself.</p>

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<p>yea ive decided to withdraw, also just to let you know the dean made this decision…I petitioned directly to him/her</p>

<p>I guess it’s not so bad now that I withdrew, but it’s just so annoying that I tried to stick it out and got caught up in this.</p>

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<p>I came to this thread expecting to read how someone was harmed by excessive bureaucracy through no fault of his/her own. Instead, I got a story about someone who got burned by their own mistakes. I can understand why you made those decisions, but you should have realized that something like this could have happened when you made those choices. The rules are reasonable; it makes no difference if you coin them off as “bureaucracy.”</p>

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<p>is it too late to register in DSP now?</p>

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<p>I can sympathize with the OP - I haven’t had any handicaps but in general the bureaucracy at Berkeley blindly follows poorly reasoned rules. Being systematic isn’t a bad thing especially when the process is beneficial and efficient, but there are some silly guidelines that they put more effort into enforcing for the sake of enforcing rather than working around them. Even as a student who thrives in a Berkeley-style environment, I find the bureaucracy to be a visible defect of this place.</p>

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<p>So that’s why you are so butthurt about UC Berkeley. Should have been DSP. YOU HAD IT coming c</p>

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<p>It’s a big school. You shouldn’t be terribly surprised, but you’re right - it is a problem. </p>

<p>Best of luck with getting things sorted out.</p>

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<p>This is what happens when you never get to know your departmental advisors at all (I talk to the Department of Political Science advisors ALL THE TIME). You need to kiss some ass if you want to get a break every now and then.</p>

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<p>Make an emergency apptmt at the Health/Counseling Center: 1) you need someone local to talk to so you don’t make another rash decision; 2) you can explain your class dilemma to them and seek their advice/assistance. Take a letter/note from your family physician/family counselor so you can show them your history.</p>

<p>Good luck.</p>

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<p>So sorry to hear about your troubles. Cal is a BIG school and they have all those rules because of that. It would be impossible for them to look at every unique perspective. Cal is known for only having full-time students. I only heard of a few times students were allowed to take less than 12 units, and it was usually after the death of a parent, and only for the remainder of that term since they missed a week or so of school, and it was hard to make up.</p>

<p>I wish you luck, it’s a great school.</p>

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<p>I have no problem with you posting this story as a cautionary tale, but going so far as to blame it on “UC Berkeley’s bureaucracy and why you should not go here” is absurd. This is certainly not a story that should deter anyone from coming to this school, and I find it cowardly of you to argue that when the mistake was your own. </p>

<p>What SHOULD be learned from this incident is what amarkov said. Berkeley IS a big school and if you have a disability/condition/difference/whatever you have to be diligent and seek out what you need yourself. The school isnt going to hold your hand and cater to your every need, but they certainly will be helpful and accommodating when you go through the proper channels. </p>

<p>to the op: it is reasonable that you are upset about this situation and a shame that it turned out the way it did, but to cite your experience as a reason someone should not come to this school is ridiculous.</p>

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<p>Oh seriously, I say SHUT UP to those who say it’s her fault.</p>

<p>You would never know what it’s like to have a psychological condition. It’s so easy to sit back, see the facts and lay out judgment, have we all grown so cold that it’s becoming impossible for us to understand people from their perspective? You don’t have the slightest clue what it is like to have one of these conditions, I’ve suffered from hearing loss in both ears during college and I know what it’s like to have people neglect my disability because it’s so much easier to ignore these people than go through the burden of assisting them, only a few close friends and family would fully understand my situation.</p>

<p>Besides OP did say her counselor RECOMMENDED not registering with DSP, how is being misinformed about DSP her fault? Most people stress through 4 years of uni because of exams as it is, now burden yourself with a mental condition and all that annoying documents you need to get and sign for DSP (I know cause I’ve been through this process before). Fortunately for me, even WITHOUT having to sign up for DSP when my hearing loss occurred my CC (COMMUNITY COLLEGE!) allowed me to drop a class without any problems, I just needed to see my counselor and show proof of my condition/dignosis. </p>

<p>Okay I may understand that shouldn’t be the sole reason not to apply to Berk, I don’t know anything about Berk, but understand these individuals experience an incredible set back with these conditions, the least we can do is make exceptions to the rule for them, don’t you understand some of these disabilities will be there for life? Can you imagine someone using a wheelchair throughout their entire life? Just YOU try doing that for a week, I guarantee you won’t last for a day.</p>

<p>So come on, give him/her a break, it’s so sad how people stay apathetic because they can’t fathom or don’t even want to bother imagining what it’s like to have a disability.</p>

<p>illsyck: “Again, I don’t care if you have no sympathy for me, I understand some people don’t really “Get” generalized anxiety disorder and manic depression and think it’s just a character flaw.” I can completely relate to this, some people just don’t get it and feel it’s just convenient to label it as a character flaw, you have no idea how people have gotten frustrated at me for having to repeat what they have to say, yet when they repeat it, they do it the same WAY! If I didn’t get it the first time, you were obviously not speaking louder and slower, so perhaps you can modify the way you speak the second time right? BUT NO, they just have to mumble really quickly again and get ****ed off because I can’t keep up with them because of my disability, even though I make them know I’m hard of hearing. It’s these little things in life we go through, people have trouble understanding, I mean forget accommodating classroom lectures, I have problems OUTSIDE of class. </p>

<p>Anyway I wish you the best, I felt compelled to write a long-winded one because I’m just appalled at some of the responses here. It looks like your situation is sorted out, but don’t ever take no for an answer illsyck, I’m glad your dean helped you through this. It’s good to see there are plenty of good people out there who would see out the situation with you from a personal level. Good luck!</p>

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<p>The moral of the story is: L/S advisers are ****** stupid. I just want to smash my head on a desk every time I walk out after talking to one. Oh and they discourage kids from going into specific majors too. What the hell.</p>

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<p>I agree with Batman17. At my CALSO last year, the advisers basically had an exhausted list of classes that they tried to scare us into not taking first semester/year. It was ridiculous.</p>

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<p>Hey guys, seriously – I’m with Bumblebee here. Let’s not attack people who struggle with being mentally interesting. I myself suffer from depression, severe social anxiety issues, and ADHD that have made my life very difficult to deal with from time to time. Unless you walk in these people’s shoes, don’t always assume it is completely their fault. These diseases cause impulses and compulsions that are not always easy to control, if at all. I never used DSP and frequently shirked adequate treatment because I was in denial I could have any of that stuff because of the kind of behavior I’ve seen on this board. It happens here, and it happens in the real world</p>

<p>We’ve become such a cold and brutal society that we write everything off as people being weak, defective, and lacking because of things that are results of natural and social happenstance. </p>

<p>These legitimate and very real disorders versus how they are seen by a less-than-understanding public and my response:
Depression is seen as mopey whiner who needs to get over it and get laid – how about you try living your life every day with a crushing burden on you, that you cannot explain, intrusive thoughts that tell you you are worthless and a waste of skin, and the urge to injure and/or kill yourself to escape the pain. That is what life with depression is like, and no, you can’t just will yourself out of it a lot of the time. Stress, other’s ignorance, and other stuff can exacerbate it.</p>

<p>Social and general anxiety is often seen as creeper, no social skills, wimp, overly emotional, coward, and other horrible stuff that people I know with it and myself have been labeled with. Well, great way to feed the horrible feedback cycle there. I am so sorry that I am terrified of people. Maybe I have a good reason to be when myself and others get treated like that. Lots of people are shy and awkward. Get over it. We don’t all have to be smooth and ‘chill’ all the time. A little kindness and understand goes a long way with people with anxiety disorders, so try it sometime.</p>

<p>Attention Deficit Disorders can sometimes cause impulsiveness and insensitivity. We’re not genuinely clumsy, impulsive, rude, or mean, we just don’t think things through or our mouths and hands move faster than our brains. Also, if someone is not listening to you or appears to not be, it’s not that we are being rude – it may be something else has drawn our attention because we don’t regulate our attention as well. We might hear every word you say and come up with a hugely insightful response – all the while we count dots in the ceiling. </p>

<p>What’s even worse, is a lot of these disorders are co-morbid, and social circumstances and behaviors don’t exactly help. Cal does not do a whole lot to help, bureaucratically – because information is frequently wrong or outdated or they find loopholes, and medically, you can go down to Tang and get pills real easy, but sometimes its for the wrong root cause and therapy can only do so much. </p>

<p>If I had known I had ADHD, I could have avoided many depressive and social/generalized anxiety issues I might have encountered later or been far more able to cope with them. I am finally getting the help I need and I personally am doing a lot better, but please – for the love of God people, try to be a bit more empathetic towards others with differences will ya? Cal is supposed to have a reputation for being open-minded and understanding – but instead I see the same bigotry, willful ignorance, and ‘the victim must take total responsibility – even if stuff is no fault of the victim’ crap I hear from Glenn Beck on the rare occasion I tune in to his nonsense.</p>

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<p>Yeah L&S advisors give horrible advice. Especially the retake classes you can skip with APs thing. Worst idea ever.
Better advice: skip Math 1A/Math1B/Chem1A/Bio1B if you can, no matter what your major is. And **** 13 units.</p>

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<p>Actually, some professors I talked to said the same thing about APs. An MechE professor said that “passing out of classes is generally a bad idea.” A math professor told me that high school calculus is “worthless”.</p>

<p>@BumbleBee + andrewtdx: I’m not trivializing the seriousness of her condition. My point is that there were clearly things she could have done for herself, but she chose not to. Having a condition does not magically exempt you from having to take responsibility for your decisions.</p>