<p>^^I got the name of her minor wrong, here is the link: [Academic</a> Advising](<a href=“http://w4.stern.nyu.edu/uc/currentstudents/academics.cfm?doc_id=100662]Academic”>http://w4.stern.nyu.edu/uc/currentstudents/academics.cfm?doc_id=100662)</p>
<p>KatMT, I think you were very kind in suggesting fineartsmajormom had her tongue in her cheek she made her pronouncement about “the best MT schools…”. Yeah, well, ahem. I will take absolutely nothing away from the superb conservatory-style training program offered by CMU, but it was indeed a bit shocking when, in response to a question from my son at his audition, the auditor informed him, “there is a good chance you will graduate from Carnegie Mellon UNDEREDUCATED.” (emphasis mine) Yes, this is how the school portrays itself. That works for some and clearly does not for others.</p>
<p>I guess the “tongue in cheek” part was in reference to “any other approach will mean that you have effectively chosen to pursue MT as a hobby and you are fated for community theatre”… </p>
<p>There are so many different routes to a professional career, and even the “best” MT schools differ in their approach and attitude towards students balancing their major course work and course work outside of the major. I believe that ALL college programs have students take academic based courses inside of the major (theatre history, script analysis, etc…), but some also require students to take courses outside of the major. This is generally NOT to ensure that kids have a “back-up” plan, but rather because these schools believe that taking courses outside of the major contributes to the overall development of an artist, and the university that houses the program requires students to take a certain number of general education classes.</p>
<p>The good news is there are so many different programs, and each one has something different to offer. Some students are looking for a program where they will not take many courses outside of their major. Others are looking for a program that encourages them to do so. Ultimately, students need to find the educational/ training environment that appeals to their personality and educational goals. A student who does not want to take classes outside of their major will most likely not be happy in a program that requires them to do so. A student who would like to take courses outside of their major most likely will not be happy in a program where this is not possible. No way is BEST overall… what is “best” for one may not be for the other. It is all about what is best for the individual. :)</p>
<p>It was tongue in cheek…or at least cheeky…I thought it was very funny how CMU portrayed their MT program as a single minded pursuit while at the same time really pushing the image of a multidisciplinary approach at the other schools at the University. For example, they are really proud that they push the Techies to take one or two humanities courses. For some reason, they treat MT kids as different–do they think more education is wasted on them? the mere fact they chose MT indicates they are already living in an unrealistic bubble? It just stood out as weird the way they admitted and treated the MT students. No academic hurdles to get in and none, outside of MT, to graduate. I didn’t mean to insult anyone; I am not an parent of an MT student but see many of the same dilemmas for visual art students too…</p>
<p>no offense here :)</p>
<p>Or here. Thanks for clarifying.</p>
<p>A bit here … since I know the current MT kids at CMU and the faculty. The department head strongly encourages both MT and Acting majors to take challenging academic courses, and the kids enrolled are far from being academic slackers or brain dead (they were admitted on talent but that doesn’t mean they bombed the SAT or got poor grades in HS). It may be tempting to 'dis a school like CMU or others with such tough admission stats but it’s worth realizing the students are glad they have the opportunity to learn from outstanding drama faculty, master teachers (stephen schwartz yesterday), and yes–great “academic” profs, too . And, they will have earned a CMU degree to be proud of in the event they don’t pursue Broadway or LA careers. I’d hate to think kids reading this forum and hopeful of attending CMU would think they could not be “real” students if they attended the school. They can and they will work very hard if they do.</p>
<p>Kedstuff, I appreciate what you are saying, but will reiterate that it was a CMU professor, herself, who categorized the potential for “undereducation” to us. One of my son’s MTCA coaches is a supremely talented CMU grad. She heartily agreed with the assessment. This is not to say that students can’t actively search for and seek out opportunities, just that they are not necessarily required of them.</p>
<p>It comes down to what you want for your education. If you are looking for a well-rounded liberal arts education then yes, you could say CMU leaves you “undereducated.” If you are looking for the opportunity to double major, or minor, in something non-MT then yes, you could say CMU leaves you “undereducated.” If you are looking for a conservatory education focusing solely on MT, then you could say you can’t get any better training than CMU and you will leave extremely “educated” in the MT field.</p>
<p>My D is a freshman at CMU and frankly, has no time to actively search for and seek out other opportunities due to the extremely demanding MT program. She spends way more time in class and studying then I did in law school.</p>
<p>I cannot dispute what a CMU professor may have said about “undereducation.” I can only report what I heard at the audition, at orientation, and at parent’s weekend – and it certainly was not that our kids would be undereducated; quite the opposite. I can only guess that such a comment came in answer to a question about education opportunities (honors courses, liberal arts foundation, etc) outside of the major.</p>
<p>KatMT said it best: “The good news is there are so many different programs, and each one has something different to offer.” CMU is the perfect program for my D. I am not at all worried about where she will be four years from now.</p>
<p>I will make the same point here about Penn State. It was very important for my Son to attend a nationally recognized University and he chose PSU over more possibly more prestigious Conservatories. Part of that wasto get better academics but there is so little time outside of the curriculum to actually pursue other majors. He is so happy to be there but it is not about the academics.</p>
<p>xatty’s and jacksdad’s comments are very much reflective of the bulk of the BFA MT programs. With some notable exceptions, such as NYU as an example, the MT curriculum at many, if not most, BFA programs seems to be structured in a manner that between classes and out of class responsibilities, the program leaves little time or scheduling flexibility for traditional academics. At the end of my daughter’s search process, she had narrowed her decision down to a program housed in an arts university and one housed in a well regarded liberal arts university. She had always been an ultra high achiever in h.s. so initially was leaning towards the L.A. university because of the belief that liberal arts opportunities would be much greater. Then we compared the curricula at both schools and realized that neither provided enough time in courses outside of the department to even minor in another subject. She then spoke to students in both programs and realized that the out of class demands were so great that in reality the time slots available during a typical BFA student’s day to take L.A. courses severely limited which courses could fit into the schedule even within the slots allotted in the curriculum. She made her choice based on the match of the BFA program and the “academic” differences between the schools had little or know impact in her final decision.</p>
<p>To punctuate MichaelNKat’s last post. My daughter is a junior at a Conservatory BFA/MT program. She entered the Conservatory with 15 AP college credits and went straight into Sophomore Gen Ed classes. Take a look at the following schedule, then ADD rehearsals from 7PM - 11PM (minimum) 5 days a week then all day on Saturday for shows. Sunday is reserved for either a day of rest or club rehearsals (cabaret, tap, choir) Oh…then through in some work study time. There is little time to do much else even though your student may be brilliant.</p>
<p>MONDAY:
9:30-11:20: Acting
12-12:50: Jr. Music Lab
2-3:20: History of Theatre
3:30-4: Private Voice Lesson
4:10-5:30: Ballet</p>
<p>TUESDAY:
10:30-11:50: Musical Theatre
12-1:50: Voice and Speech
2-2:50: Voice and Speech (Floating Lab)
3-4: Studio Class
4:10-5:30: Jazz </p>
<p>WEDNESDAY:
9-11:50: Musical Theatre
1-2:50: Acting
3-3:50: Jr. Music Lab
4-5:20: Advanced Tap </p>
<p>THURSDAY:
10-11:50: Directing
2-3:20: History of Theatre
3:30-4: Private Voice Lesson
4:10-5:30: Ballet</p>
<p>FRIDAY:
9:30-10:50: Musical Theatre
12-12:50: Voice and Speech
4:10-5:30: Jazz</p>
<p>Hi everyone,
I’m a current freshman MT major at Emerson and I shared the same concern as many of you. I wanted to find a school that gave me great musical theatre training as well as a strong liberal arts education. Even though the course load is very intense for MT majors at Emerson, I still have access to the great liberal arts course Emerson offers. As a school, Emerson values a foundation of liberal arts in every program they have. Also, it is very easy to transfer from a MT major to the BA in theatre studies program which has much more liberal arts classes while still allowing the student to perform on Emerson Stage and take theatre classes. Many student enter into the MT BFA program, discover that a BFA may be too single minded for all of their outside interest and end up in the BA program. It’s a nice option to have. Emerson’s program has. Emerson also offers an Honor’s program for musical theatre majors which is very selective and provides half tuition scholarship. Honors program students take specialized honors seminars and have many additional liberal arts responsibilities. If you view my post on the Emerson MT wall I talk more about the “well-rounded-ness”</p>
<p>I am a junior MT major at Illinois Wesleyan University which is a liberal arts school. If you want a well rounded education in actual core classes, I would say don’t look at conservatories. As a student in a liberal arts school, I would say I have the best of both worlds. We have many general education requirements for the university. In addition to this, we are also getting a liberal arts education for theatre. By this I mean I’m required to not only be on crews, but work a certain amount of hours in either the scene shop or costume shop. And when I say crews I do not mean only run crews. I personally have been a general electrician 3x, an usher, wardrobe crews, run crews, charge artistry, props, sound and/or light board operator, etc. Because I have been taught all this, I know after I graduate I will begin by doing summerstock where everyone is required to work on technical aspects of theatre (yes, even the actors), I am confident that I can have a successful future. Doesn’t it only make sense; why hire an actor and an electrician when you can have one person doing the job?</p>
<p>As a general rule, if a liberal arts education is a priority for you as part of your MT training, then, with a few notable exceptions (NYU as an example), you are probably better off attending a BA program at a school with a strong theater department that offers voice and dance training or a discrete MT program as well as MT performing opportunities (Muhlenberg and North Western as examples). If it is not as much of a priority, then most BFA programs, again with some exceptions (CMU as an example), will probably offer enough liberal arts to keep you satisfied. </p>
<p>Even within BFA programs that provide liberal arts exposure, however, there can be significant differences in how it is structured. In arts universities (what some might loosely call a “conservatory”), all the liberal arts classes may be offered through a generic liberal arts department. At BFA programs housed within a full liberal arts university (what some might loosely call “conservatory style” programs) the liberal arts are offered through dedicated departments each of which run degree conferring programs within the particular area of study. (University of the Arts and Syracuse are examples of this contrast - both build slots in their BFA curricula for 8 liberal arts classes but have very different delivery systems.) Whether that difference is meaningful, though, requires an in depth analysis of whether in practical terms it will make a difference in the level of L.A. education received given the demands of the MT program (see my posts 7 and 31).</p>