<p>Cali - great job! As an outsider looking in, the thing that pops out the most in this thread is that the Andover posts have a spirit of fun, warmth and Letterman-esque quality about them. The Exeter responses are just plain humorless. Assuming that both places offer a great education, I’d choose the happier path any day of the week. Life’s too short.</p>
<p>Seikuu,</p>
<p>Andover is more rigorous than Exeter. And Exeter is more rigorous than Andover. Deerfield is more rigorous than Exeter. And Exeter is more rigorous than Deerfield. What I’m pointing out is that it will all depend on the classes you choose to take (though no matter what classes you choose to take at Andover you will not be able to “chill all day everyday”). Additionally, seikuu, I’d curious as to how you’d come to such a conclusion. How many people do you know personally who’ve gone to both schools and can therefore compare their experiences firsthand? As a tour guide, one thing I was taught never to do with prospective families is to conjecture about other schools, and I’m disappointed that this is exactly how you’re choosing to sell your school.</p>
<p>That’s also why I’m not entirely comfortable with alilies’s conjectures about Harkness. Exeter kids do extremely well on math and science standardized tests, so I’m guessing Harkness works for them, adjustment or not. Additionally, and I just have to correct this one, alilies… The teacher does use the blackboard, as do the students. Before class starts, students go and write up a problem each on the blackboard and explain how they did it themselves. That’s very visual.</p>
<p>I’m totally onboard with you on dining, though! Let me link the Commons menus. I’m not sure the site will be populated with anything at the moment as it’s spring break, but we’ll see.</p>
<p>[Welcome</a> to CampusDish at Phillips Academy!](<a href=“http://www.campusdish.com/en-US/CSNE/PhillipsAcademy/LocationsMenus/]Welcome”>http://www.campusdish.com/en-US/CSNE/PhillipsAcademy/LocationsMenus/)</p>
<p>Transportation is pretty much the same, mall and movies/stop and shop on saturday, walmart on wednesdays (NH state has no sales tax :)), shopping trips organized by the school. </p>
<p>A big difference in dorms for Andover and Exeter is that when people are put into dorms in Exeter they rarely leave. From alilies’s post seems that dorms change every year in Andover and you generally live with your friends. I think which system is better depends on the individual–living with friends or living with a bunch of people. I’m not really sure what girls dorms do (each dorm has their own traditions) but the dorm I live in has snowball fights with a rival dorm down the street, dorm wrestling, a pool table/pingpong table/video game consoles, dorm mafia, a ball game called quadball (played in our courtyard), etc. </p>
<p>I remember visiting Andover’s campus a long time ago and thinking that the campus itself was kind of a bubble–I might be wrong, but iirc there aren’t any roads that cut through the Andover campus. Exeter’s campus is slightly different–from the south end of campus (where most academic buildings are) to the north end (gym) there are 3 streets. The school is more a part of the town than a separate entity. </p>
<p>The idea of harkness math/science is kind of misunderstood by many… there are blackboards/whiteboards in every single classroom at Exeter. For math you do problems as homework, and then in class you might decide to present a problem to the class–you put up your work and then talk through it, and your peers/teacher might ask questions of you, and talk about/put up other methods. For science you might present some homework problems, and then there will be a period where the class talks about the theory behind an experiment/reading, asks questions, etc.</p>
<p>@tom
I’ve been on cc for 4 years now and I’ve seen the attitudes of people who want to go to Andover vs the attitudes of people who want to go to Exeter. To quote this recent thread (<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/prep-school-admissions/1100492-exeter-ask-student.html?highlight=starbucks+andover+soccer[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/prep-school-admissions/1100492-exeter-ask-student.html?highlight=starbucks+andover+soccer</a>), the poster “originally wanted to go to Andover for the gorilla, soccer team, Starbucks, no saturday classes, and dress code.” If that’s not chill then I don’t know what is. </p>
<p>What I intended to say is that the culture of Exeter is a more serious one–dress code, Saturday classes, etc. Exonian parents forced KFC (once within walking distance) to close that store. Also by what rebelangel pointed out that the andover posts were fun and lively, and that our Exeter posts were humorous–I feel that if what I write [in some way] represents my school, then I should be serious about it.</p>
<p>Exeter’s part of the town? What town? ;)</p>
<p>CaliPaki,</p>
<p>“Ouch” is right! I hope I don’t have to enter a witness protection program now! As for my item 10, you summarized it best when you said that you don’t want to “bash” yourself for selecting the wrong school. Of course, you have a great choice either way. Good luck with your decision!</p>
<p>I see you have a third option. Go to EXETER-PREP to the South and come home to Exeter next year. :D</p>
<p>Seikuu,</p>
<p>Exeter parents forced the KFC to close? That seems a bit big-headed. I guess Andover parents actually trust their kids to make their own decisions and actually be independent.</p>
<p>Also, why do you think humor and seriousness are mutually exclusive? Don’t you think high school age kids want to believe the kids at their future schools are fun to be around and aren’t just miniature adults? Also, as other posters have pointed out, Andover’s college matriculations are slightly more prestigious in a traditional sense of the word and Exeter’s average SAT score is higher by what amounts to getting two more questions right on the entire, 4-hour SAT. If you expect kids to want to sit through class on Saturday, wear formal attire six days out of every week, and have their parents shut down every last vestige of informality in the town, up to and including the KFC, all for poorer college matriculations but a 10-point higher SAT score, I believe most kids will choose Andover where apparently we get an education of equal quality that will send us to apparently the same places after high school. Andover’s yield versus Exeter’s (78% vs. 63%) proves that this is, indeed, the case.</p>
<p>This discussion seems to have headed in a much better direction…I’ll add to Seikuu’s and Tom’s description of Harkness (this is based on my kid’s description of class and my two days of observation during parent’s week-end, so students correct me if I’m off base). </p>
<p>Think of Harkness as a more student-centered, rather than teacher-centered approach. So in math, for example, almost all of the work is done on the blackboard, but rather than a teacher demonstrating sample problems, the students “present” problems from the previous night’s homework, writing out their solution to the problem, presenting it to the class, and answering questions from the teacher and the other students. Science classes are a combination of teacher presentation and class discussion around the Harkness table and lab work. In a foreign language, students might write out translations on the board and, again, explain them to the class. In English, they might all write out a quote they thought was particularly meaningful, and then use those to launch discussion. All these things probably happen at a school that’s less Harkness-y too. The main difference is that teachers don’t lead the discussion–they guide it sometimes, ask probing questions, sometimes, offer correction/info. if it’s really needed, but mostly let the students learn from one another.</p>
<p>That system is definitely not for everyone–but as a teacher, I feel that people learn best when they’re actively engaged in the learning process and that there’s no better way to master a concept than to explain it to someone else (I didn’t really understand parts of speech until I had to teach them to a summer school class as a student teacher.) So I think Harkness is great, especially with smart, motivated kids. </p>
<p>I’d agree that there’s a big advantage to entering as an upper and being surrounded by experienced students who have been at this Harkness thing for a few years. While it’s true that many students take a term or two to reach their full potential, many others adapt quickly. Depends on your orientation I think. Do you tend to participate in class a lot? Do you learn best by doing? Are you the kind of kid who tends to volunteer to go to the board when the teacher asks? Do you find it hard to just sit back and listen while a teacher–even an engaging one–lectures? If so, you’ll probably take to Harkness like a fish to water. If you learn better by sitting back and absorbing or if you find speaking out in class difficult, you’d probably do better at another school.</p>
<p>I also agree that there’s a difference in tone in the Exeter and Andover posts here…I don’t think it suggests that Exeter student don’t have fun or are completely devoid of humor. Might be more that they’re pretty well drilled at Exeter to not say anything that they can’t support, and I do think they’re making a better effort to not be funny at the other school’s expense (though you’ve all scaled that back 
) On the other hand, the tone does say something about the two schools. My kid has a good sense of humor and likes to have fun, but I’d describe him as, overall, a serious guy. Would those of you who go to Exeter (not Andover, unless you have a close friend or sibling there) say that Exonians tend to be on the serious side? (serious, note, is not the same thing as dour and friendless!)</p>
<p>Pro and Con lists CaliPaki! They can be your best friend :). </p>
<p>I’m in a slightly different boat as you since I’m entering as a freshman(lower or whatever it’s called) so I’m less concerned about dorms or adjustment periods. But my decision comes down to: A) which school will best suit my academic strengths/needs and (hopefully) allow me to maintain a 4.0 level GPA - or at least relatively close to that; B) which one will allow me to take the most of my favorite class (languages) with (B2) minimal other requirements; C) which one will provide and hopefully let me excel at the extracurriculars I love; and D) which ones dominate in my Varsity sports of choice. </p>
<p>My personal answer came out to be Andover (despite B which was clearly Exeter) so far. But if I choose Exeter I would be in the position of CHANGING the school myself to fit those criteria ie establishing a ChinaCare and becoming the dominant player in Volleyball and shaping my team rather than one of a sea - and maybe that would have been better. IDK. Heck, I might just say eff it all and go for Lawrenceville so I can get into Princeton… wow I’m no help lol.</p>
<p>The point is - what do YOU want OUT of the boarding school experience. Then pick that school that best fits that and go succeed as best you can~</p>
<p>Check out this Exeter thread:</p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/prep-school-admissions/725395-phillips-exeter-academy-exeter-nh.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/prep-school-admissions/725395-phillips-exeter-academy-exeter-nh.html</a></p>
<p>I found it pretty informative and funny.</p>
<p>Zenxan, I’m flattered you’re leaning towards Andover, but I’d advise you to drop the idea that you’ll be able to maintain a perfect (6.0) GPA. A) just about nobody does it and b) it’s not necessary to get into good schools. Johns Hopkins’ average GPA from Andover: 4.5. UPenn: 5.1. Princeton: 5.20. Harvard: 5.19.</p>
<p>Additionally, here’s a link to Andover’s school profile. You’ll notice that only 1% of Andover’s 330-strong class of 2011 has a 6.0 GPA. That’s 3 kids. In a class of 330. Like I said, good luck…</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.andover.edu/Academics/CollegeCounseling/Documents/PhillipsAcademySchoolProfile2010-2011.pdf[/url]”>http://www.andover.edu/Academics/CollegeCounseling/Documents/PhillipsAcademySchoolProfile2010-2011.pdf</a></p>
<p>Haha TomtheCat you misunderstand - I was thinking 5.0 GPA with some special 6s thrown on top. I have no delusions of grandeur~ I think in terms of academics, Andover and Exeter are equal for me. I love the idea of the Harkness table, but I think the culture/life/extracurriculars of Andover is what tipped my scale.</p>
<p>(Plus I look so much cooler in Blue…)</p>
<p>YAY! Well I’m glad to have been of service! And that’s good, 5s are doable! Just get ready to WORK! :D</p>
<p>I might add that people with these low GPAs won’t get into HYP with low GPAs alone, you need to top it with accomplishments in ECs, legacies, children of Presidents and Kings and such. If you are working so hard to maintain a low GPA, do you have time to excel in ECs unless you are the child/grandchild of a President, a Senator, or at least a Congressman?</p>
<p>pulsar - I’ve talked (in person) to kids from both Exeter and Andover who were straight A students all throughout elementary and middle school, and very involved in both comm service and sports; all of them said they struggled in high school and took lower GPAs as a result. But those “lower” GPAs still meant a lot more than a 4.0 from Podunk HS in their acceptances to: Stanford, Yale, and Princeton. (Though the only person I know that went to Harvard, came from TJHSST.) </p>
<p>The Andover student considered 5 to be an A/A- and 6 to be an A++. She had a 5.4/5.5 or something. Went to Yale, is Asian female so really no extras were afforded her. One of the Exeter students I know came home with a B/C average the first year, then went to a SUPER SECRET ASIAN MATH CAMP (seriously I don’t know a single nonasian who knows about this camp…) over the summer, never achieved a truly perfect 4.0 GPA equivalent, but still went to Stanford for undergrad.</p>
<p>(on a random funny note, the girl I’m tutoring rn, just mistakenly told me that cut meant reproduction instead of reduction… LMAO)</p>
<p>What do you mean by “low” GPA, pulsar?</p>
<p>I wouldn’t try to convince people that they will get into HYP with a 5 out of 6 GPAs etc. without some serious icings on the cake. Colleges are now flooded with PS kids with 4.5 out of 4 weighted averages from equally rigorous PS with many APs. Most people get into HYP from prep schools based more on historical connections as feeders and S/D of famous alumni, power brokers etc. Now their placement to HYP is steadily decreasing over the years and the % of PS grads at HYP is on the rise over the last many years due to their accomplishments in Intel, Siemens competitions etc. Lately it looks more obvious that your chances of getting into HYP is better if you are at the top of your local HS that will give you more opportunities for ECs than being a middle of the pack guy at a prep.</p>
<p>Pulsar - I agree actually. 5 out of 6 from a boarding school is not enough. Hell 5.5 out of 6 isn’t enough. I bet if you got a 6 out of 6, that may STILL not be enough. And 4.5+ GPA out of 4.0 at a PS is certainly not enough either. But boarding school isn’t just about matriculation. If that’s the only reason you’re going then save the $200,000 and go to PS. </p>
<p>If however, boarding school offers something extra for you in terms of academic breadth because of limited options at public (no latin, russian, german, in my case), extra in sport options (my hs’ vball team is lackluster and we don’t even have crew), extra in extracurriculars (let’s not even go into my school’s music program, though speech and debate is a BEAST), AND you are a driven student who enjoys being challenged intellectually - then boarding school is a viable option. </p>
<p>But this isn’t a debate between public vs private (which is hacked to death anyways), calipaki has already decided she WANTS private. So seriously pulsar, what are you contributing to the actual discussion?</p>
<p>I am responding to Tom about the low GPA issue and if the OP is also interested in going to HYP, giving extra info to consider. I know a bunch of people who got burnt at preps who go to mom and pop colleges now and they have nothing great to say about their prep experience. These are top kids at their local schools. Don’t get sold by Tom’s posts alone as he is a politics major, lol, consider other’s views also that went to Penn State.</p>
<p>If you don’t have extracurriculars in your school, you can take the leadership role and start one. You don’t need to run to preps, imo.</p>
<p>Yet again, it is the question of whether you see boarding school as something to help you to the next step or as an experience in itself. As zenxan said, the course options at a top prep school far exceed those at a public school. For example, I could have gone to a very good public school at home, but I still would have had to take classes at a college my senior year. Instead, I go to Andover, where I can take courses beyond Calculus, AP Physics, and AP Chem. Also, I can almost guarantee that the quality of our classes is better. With an average class size of 13 and teachers with degrees in the field they are teaching (not teaching degrees), I am learning A LOT more than my public school friends at home. So I see boarding school as an experience by itself, and if I don’t get into HYP, I’m sure I will excel at whatever college I choose because of it.</p>
<p>As for extra-curriculars, I am involved in so many more things than I would be at public school, and I am so grateful for that. If I had not gone to Andover, I would not be involved in STAND (an anti-genocide club) and I would not be going to DC to lobby against conflict minerals. Also, the orchestra at Andover is amazing and it is something I would have never been able to be a part of at home.</p>
<p>So, if your goal is to get into HYP, then go to public school. If your goal is to have countless opportunities that you would not have even at the best public school, then go to prep school.</p>