<p>completely mess her up for the rest of her life
Omg, can those of us who have dealt with this please respond.
Meds saved D2. They allowed her to breathe. And then, over time, with guidance, to gain some perspective. It took time to get the right combo and dosage. Now, that she’s in a better place, emotionally, it has been very carefully and understandably been made clear to D2 which meds have an issue with weaning or any long term effects. She gets it. More to say, later. Thanks for the openness and honesty. Best to you all.</p>
<p>FID,
I’m glad that your DD has an appointment with a psychiatrist. A psychiatrist has expert training in major depressive disorder, anxiety, cutting, etc along with medication therapy. It’s better to get your DD evaluation from an expert than merely the pediatrician (no offense to pediatricians out there). Keep a very close eye on your D during the first 2 weeks of a new antidepressant, when risk of suicide is the highest.</p>
<p>I also think you need a new therapist. Her blasé attitude about cutting is akin to “ah, well, girls will be girls.”</p>
<p>I personally think you need a new therapist. She told you your daughter has been cutting herself regularly…but it’s no big deal. She told you your daughter should “just do the work”? Ahem…if she could do that, you would not be asking the questions you are asking now. </p>
<p>Find another therapist. Perhaps,the psychiatrist can help. Insist on FAMILY counseling as one competent. If I were a betting woman, I’d guess that what your daughter is sharing with the therapist does NOT encompass what you parents are seeing.</p>
<p>And again I say…do NOT expect a 504 plan to solve these mental health issues. The plan could ease the burden for your daughter, but it will NOT address the underlying causal issues.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>None of the therapists we have dealt with would say this. Suicide is unpredictable. Please ask the psychiatrist for a recommendation for therapy.</p>
<p>OMG, ditch that therapist. I’m aghast. Did s/he get his/her degree from a diploma mill or what? Anyone involved with children knows cutting is a way to relieve stress that very sick people find because their pain is so extreme they have no other way to deal with it, and that needs to be converted into another way to relieve stress because it’s such a serious signal. Seriously, I’m appalled. Any child attacking his/her physical integrity (inflicting bodily harm to himself/herself - think of “integrity” as in “integer”) is doubly in pain and in danger, and screaming for help through blood.
Stop going, stop sending your daughter there.
No matter what the daughter is sharing (I agree with Thumper that she’s probably not saying everything to the therapist - but then again, she may be reasonably wary) the therapist’s response is not correct, professional, or helpful (understatement).</p>
<p>It’s good you have an apointment with a psychiatrist tomorrow. Hopefully s/he’ll be able to help.</p>
<p>What kind of therapist is this?<br>
Maybe you can have the psychiatrist be the therapist, as my D2 has.
Everyone will say, one way or another, the rest of what’s on my mind, right now. But I want to add this: if your D has trouble with scrutiny, people breathing down her neck, don’t be on her case every day/week, asking her if she’s better now, staring her in the eye and asking, how she feels today. Watch that Mom doesn’t make the Rx to be a new excuse to get on her case (you have pills, why can’t you do your homework? Why are you sad, you have meds.) Right now, this is about breathing and working toward a result. </p>
<p>Definitely time to find a new therapist! Her response was appalling!</p>
<p>
???What does this mean??? Medication may be just what your D needs to enable her to get to a stable place. Some levels of depression need a jump start to begin the recovery process.</p>
<p>I hope you are ALL attending your D’s appointment tomorrow. The psychiatrist will probably speak to parents and child individually and together. Please, please be honest and convey all you observations. The best course of treatment can only be determined with the psychiatrist’s full understanding of the current and past situation. Good luck.</p>
<p>Find out what you can as well from National Suicide Prevention Lifeline 800 273 8255 (TALK) available 24/7, also web site (I found via google). Maybe you have some local programs. They may be able to put some additional resources at your fingertips.</p>
<p>Look into local support groups and ask the psychiatrist about. Also ask the psychiatrist about couples therapy or family therapy recommendations. ALSO a new therapist for DD. You might ask psychiatrist if after a session or two if you can get a strong letter to deal with the school.</p>
<p>Something you may want to do (which I did) was type out the snapshot details about your DD and family situation - the progression of her illness. Any family history. Reasonable information to give a fairly good idea of what you are seeing and the relevant facts. Things that you would want the psychiatrist to know which would be helpful to know. I spoke initially one on one with the LPC and the psychiatrist. Most therapy sessions were DD and therapist, but sometimes DD wanted me in there. Our psychiatrist always met with me for a few minutes after session with DD present - review meds and any refill or med needs.</p>
<p>I saw this somewhere on CC, but psychiatrist also said it when I asked about some of my DD’s thinking – “who knows how teenagers get these ideas”. No way to make sense out of nonsense is my gist of it, just pick up the pieces and move forward.</p>
<p>Your pediatrician is speaking outside of their specialty - although you ‘trust’ this person, your DD’s life is at stake. My GYN would not move up my mammogram 10 weeks (I found a lump; he was adamant it was a ‘harmless cyst’, but he didn’t know what the h— he was looking at with in office ultrasound; 90% of breast cancer is ductal and HIGHLY DETECTABLE by mammogram; my breast cancer was aggressive and went from stage I to stage IIIa in 10 weeks, decreasing my long time survival chances from almost 100% to 50%; because I was able to survive very aggressive treatments I am still here). Advise you to listen to your gut and also need to hear opinion of specialists. Current therapist has a blind eye to how serious your DD’s situation is, and I would find a better therapist!</p>
<p>Talk to the psychiatrist about lining up a better therapist. This therapist has not grasped the seriousness of your DD’s situation, and it is also troubling not looking for getting a psychiatrist to get DD on meds. Why go so long without using the tools in the toolbox?</p>
<p>Your pediatrician does not have a clue that many people with depression and other psychiatric issues sometimes do not need a lifetime of meds. My two sisters and my DD are examples of women I know very well who have been helped during a critical time with meds and no longer are on any meds (two were treated in HS, one sister was in her late 20’s). Our pediatrician started my DD on an anti-anxiety pill, then a popular anti-depressant; I got a LPC involved at that point. Then we added the psychiatrist (It was fortunate that the LPC who was recommended by a knowledgeable friend in the field, started working with the Psychiatrist with excellent credentials - board certified in both adolescent and adult; we also knew this Psychiatrist as his S use to go to school with DD). However if your DD does need to be on meds for several years, need is an important word; would someone needing insulin not be on insulin?</p>
<p>Weigh out advice with MDs by specialty - for example a cancer survivor was told by a surgeon ‘he got all the cancer’, when the fellow should have been seen by a medical oncologist; no, not all the cancer was contained, kidney cancer, at a very prestigious medical center - still hanging in, but living with stage IV disease and disability.</p>
<p>Encouraging that your family is moving forward getting DD in the hands of the right professionals.</p>
<p>Fighting Irish Dad - Hugs to you. It’s obvious that you love and care for your daughter - but in this case, your therapist sounds like an idiot. If your D had cancer, what would you think of an oncologist who said, “We shouldn’t do chemotherapy because those drugs can be bad for you”? </p>
<p>Good luck.</p>
<p>FIdad-
I’m glad you’re going to be working with a new psychiatrist, hopefully one who can help you get a handle on the medication issue. Cutting and suicidal thoughts are nothing to fool with.</p>
<p>A close family member went through something like what your daughter’s dealing with as a high schooler. Her cutting was discovered when a teacher noticed blood leaking through her shirt after she cut a little too deep. Her parents got her into a great in-patient program and she spent a week there getting a full assessment. She spent the next few months in outpatient care (attending school but checking in with her doctor and attending group sessions) and on antidepressants. That seemed to be enough to jump start things for her and today, a few years later, she’s doing very well, having successfully graduated from a great school. She wrote her application essay on how she spent her xth birthday in a mental hospital.</p>
<p>Hang in there. It’s a tough fight, but with the right care there’s light at the end of the tunnel. </p>
<p>I have never heard a med professional say meds could “mess you up for life.” True, they may not work in the situation, but I have never heard they could cause long term harm. And of course there is the very real possibility that they will IMPROVE things, as they are designed to do.</p>
<p>I also agree with other posters that cutting is very serious. It does not indicate suicide, but it does indicate the depth of pain your daughter is feeling. She needs help to find ways to lessen the pain and/or handle it in a more appropriate manner. </p>
<p>What is the background of the therapist? What types of degrees, clinical experience and specialties?</p>
<p>I agree that cutting is not a suicidal gesture but a stress reliever, maladaptive but not dangerous as it may seem. However, the therapist’s position that your daughter should “just do the work” is absurd. </p>
<p>And I cannot believe the comment about meds messing her up for life. They are life-saving and can be used as a jump start whenever depression hits, or for longer term help. In fact, using an SSRI for a year can help heal pathways in the brain, we have been told. That said, be aware that the standard advice to taper off by cutting in half, then cutting in half is not good for many: some people have to wean very slowly, over a few monhts- but certainly not everyone. And there are ways to ease the tapering (low dose Prozac, which has a long half life, can be used actually). Zoloft can cause nausea for some; Celexa and Lexapro are good ones. Some SSRI’s are activating and some are sedating, so the MD will fit the med to your daughter’s needs. It sounds like she would need a more activating one but she would take it in the morning so as not to affect sleep.</p>
<p>Yes, the Dad can write the 504. I did that for 20 years. It saves time and makes sure everything you want is on there to start. The 504 form is a one pager but add some pages if needed. The school may make changes but basically they have trouble getting the process started and the darn thing written, so doing it yourself, asking for a meeting, and getting it signed speeds things up. Takecan advocate with you if that helps.</p>
<p>I would not get too hysterical about potential self-harm, at least in a way that communicates it to your daughter. These ideas are contagious and appeal to anyone who wants attention at all. At the same time, though, it is definitely a good thing that you are taking her pain so seriously.</p>
<p>Plenty of kids have senior years like this. Just know that she, and you, are not alone. The ones I know who have had these difficulties have found a path, and frankly, are better off in some ways after having these troubles. Just think if a depression developed for the first time in freshman year of college, far from home. This way, she will have a tool box when she goes.</p>
<p>Here’s a bit of wisdom from a young person I know: “Freedom comes when you accept your limitations.” Pretty good, don’t you think? I know that thought helped me!</p>
<p>Well, I think I know why the school didn’t provide any accommodations based on the original therapist letter.</p>
<p>Ok, for the ped who said that the meds might mess her up for the rest of her life. Poppycock. I guess benzos, used to treat anxiety, are addictive. However, I can’t imagine a pdoc using them right off the bat with an 18 year old. SSRIs are some of the most commonly prescribed of all medications. I’m thinking top 5. That’s a heck of a lot of people who are going to be messed up for the rest of their lives. This is why you don’t see your GP for psychiatric problems.</p>
<p>Psych meds don’t work quickly and sometimes not at all. They work better for severe depression than for mild to moderate, so if your therapist is correct, and the depression is not severe, you may not see much of a benefit. You need to give them 4-6 weeks to see if they’ll work. In that time, expect some side effects. If the first doesn’t work, you start again. You might cross taper, you might have to let one clear the system before trying the next. It is a slow process. You won’t be posting back here in a couple of weeks that everything is good. However, even for people with the worst side effects (and I do know someone who had some paranoia and hallucinations from Zoloft), it’s hardly a drug that messes someone up for the rest of her life! You get one with a bad se profile, you try again. They’re definitely worth pursuing, and can quite literally save lives, but you just can’t go into it thinking these will work like antibiotics. You don’t take them and get better and go on. You take them, you feel well enough to function, and then you have to work in therapy because these diseases are episodic and recurrent. You need to change behavior and thinking if you want to keep the black dog under control in the future. CBT is the most recommended therapy for someone with depression and anxiety. Doesn’t sound like this is the kind of therapist you have. </p>
<p>My experience with accommodations is at the college level. They’re very different in that they only level the playing field. </p>
<p>Also note that, as with many Rx, so often the number of people who actually have bothersome (or worse, of course) side effects can be small. We talk about it because it can happen, not because it necessarily will. Sometimes the fix is very easy- eg, take the pill with a meal or lots of water. It’s another benefit to having a psychiatrist who is expert with this age group, who will prescribe and monitor accordingly. </p>
<p>I am shocked at the advice the OP is getting from the “experts”. Shocking, shocking and so detrimental. (I’m talking about the doctor and therapist, in case anyone is confused). </p>
<p>I haven’t commented before as I don’t have any information or advice. And the posters on here have been so helpful. </p>
<p>I did want to impart something from my own experience. My H suffers from an autoimmune disease. When he was suffering but no yet diagnosed he went from doctor to doctor. He got no help and in fact had a doctor say he didn’t believe in the symptoms H had. It was unbelievable! When finally H found the right doctor, it took him 10 minutes to diagnose what H had and how to treat it. What H has was textbook and something that should have been caught many doctors before. </p>
<p>I want to say, keep looking. You know your D has something and it needs to be treated. She is not getting the help she needs from the people in charge right now. Don’t wait, find a new therapist. It sounds like you are on the right track and she is seeing someone new. Don’t accept advice you know is wrong. </p>
<p>Also check out what resources your state has. In NJ, we have Mobile Crisis Response where they come to your home and evaluate and also meet with you. For example,
<a href=“https://cpcbehavioral.org/index.php/child-and-adolescent-programs/mobile-crisis-response”>https://cpcbehavioral.org/index.php/child-and-adolescent-programs/mobile-crisis-response</a></p>
<p>Meds saved my life. Literally. I couldn’t have controlled the depression without them and I was having suicidal thoughts (never attempted but had you given me a few more months in the dark and I don’t know… don’t want to think about it). </p>
<p>I have been battling depression for a decade now and it’s still a daily struggle. Sometimes I need meds, sometimes I don’t (note: I don’t mean that some days I take them and some days I don’t, I mean I’ve been on them before and weaned off more than once). It all depends. I just battled an upper respiratory bacterial infection. I wouldn’t go without antibiotics anymore than I would go without anti-depressants when my depression rears its ugly head. </p>
<p>That doctor is a moron. You need a new one ASAP. No shame in changing doctors. When the doctor no longer meets your needs, you get a new one- same as any occupation. Get a new one, NOW! </p>
<p>You absolutely should not rely on a pediatrician for advice about psychiatric meds. He’s out of his league. </p>
<p>You need to forget about college and do what it takes to get your daughter well. Colleges aren’t going away. Her health is the most important. Good luck.</p>
<p>"Ok, for the ped who said that the meds might mess her up for the rest of her life. Poppycock. I guess benzos, used to treat anxiety, are addictive. "</p>
<p>And I say, so they are addictive, so what? Better happy than dead.</p>
<p>so glad you will get an MD involved soon. please keep in mind that your daughter may have a partial explanation for her distress re her parents’ splitting. I was heavily exposed to very toxic complaints and worries by each of my parents before during and after their divorce in my college years. Way too much information for me to process. My parents moved on eventually and some of that misery lifted as everyone rebuilt their lives. But the first year or two are mighty tough. Very pleased you and her mother recognize that she should not be on trial and error meds without parental oversight now…which should make eventual use of a psychiatrist when she does go to college much more routine and viable for her. Please do all you can to heal as individuals and to consult with professionals to cushion your daughter as much as possible during the very disruptive times associated with the end of a marriage and the attempts to get back on your feet solo. I mean this in the most not guilt provoking way, but only to point out that divorce is a major stressor. Make sure that you and your wife have adults to vent with and that your daughter is spared as much as you can spare her re your ups and downs.</p>