<p>I hope now that the application season is in full swing that students have a better feel for where they want to apply. I hope students PM’d Kali22 if they are interested in Princeton so they can get an insider’s view. Hopefully, no one applied to all the Ivies in the hope of being “that” student come spring that can boast they got into all of them. No great feat in my opinion since all the Ivies are not a fit for any one student.</p>
<p>D is interested in 2 ivies: Y & UPenn and I would just like to get an idea of ACT/SAT scores of the 2014 freshmen and any other AA currently attending these colleges. My kid scored 30 composite ACT & 2080 SAT – her best areas were E & R on ACT and CR & Writing on SAT – Math score is just o.k.</p>
<p>My AA D is a freshman at Penn (she was rejected from Yale EA.) Her SAT (superscored) was 2150, ACT 31. She also had 2 SAT subject tests in the 700s - good luck!</p>
<p>Thanks Picktails! It’s so important to receive info from real students – school statistics and the “holistic” approach can feel so elusive. </p>
<p>My D is at Penn with a 2250, applied ED.</p>
<p>I hope it works out for you. You’ll be impressed with the access to so many opportunities once there.</p>
<p>D chose Pomona but did get into Dartmouth. Wait listed at Yale and Princeton. 2250, English Lit 780, Bio 730. Current freshman. Pick tails - hope your daughter is enjoying her 1st year.</p>
<p>Hi akiddoc, can you speculate on reasons your D was waitlisted at Y & P – did she apply early to either schools?</p>
<p>Thanks! </p>
<p>Applied early to Stanford and deferred, eventually rejected in RD. </p>
<p>Reasons for waitlists: 1. Junior grades. Several (6 over a 2 semester period) B+'s. 2. Has had every advantage in life so ethnic advantage was minimized. I’m a Stanford grad. We live in a very high end neighborhood. Went to one of the best high schools in the country where the average SAT last year was 2210. Rides equestrian. Etc. (Her application was superb except for the 11th grade hiccup. Published a research project in a medical journal among other activities.) 3. Didn’t rank in the top few kids at her school. 12/89 kids had SAT’s over 2300 at her school. 3 had 2400’s. She was probably #25/89 in GPA, although it isn’t published. She was the top AA student in her high school class and got into the best schools of the AA students. Those families are also well off.</p>
<p>The lesson is that grades are the #1 factor in admissions. You need the other stuff, but grades are #1. Because of her AP’s her GPA was 4.37, but these schools know who the top applicants are from each school, and they want the top few. And everyone at her school was applying to the Ivy’s.</p>
<p>She basically got into the exact same schools you would expect if she was white. If admissions thinks you have had a privileged life, there isn’t really a huge ethnic advantage at the top schools. They are looking for kids who are in circumstances that are not ideal because of race. Of course, a huge percentage of URM’s are in those circumstances. They are also looking for kids of any race who have overcome poverty, are first generation Americans, first generation college, etc. The common data set for colleges now includes a line for first generation college kids. They want a good number to put in that slot. </p>
<p>We were not surprised by any of this. She really wanted Stanford or Yale, but Pomona was her third choice. Great school, and maybe a better fit for her anyway. More cooperative than competitive, impeccable academics, much smaller class sizes, and much more access to professors.</p>
<p>“The lesson is that grades are the #1 factor in admissions.”</p>
<p>Sorry, but I think it’s important to push back on this. Grades/Sat scores are very important, but the personal statement and supplements are EQUALLY important. In my opinion, they are often even more important than superb grades/SAT scores (which you do need) if you’re not an URM. This is how admission officers distinguish between all of those 4.0s/2400s. </p>
<p>I mention this not to assume anything about your daughter’s writing, but to point out a problematic notion that is pervasive in college admissions discussions. </p>
<p>@Kali22 I don’t know…do you really feel that an essay that could have been ghost written(not yours, just in general) should trump 3 years of grades, test scores, awards, and ecs? </p>
<p>No, I don’t think ghost written essays should trump 3 years of hard work. But I, like admission officers of very selective institutions, do feel quite strongly that personal statements are just as valuable as grades, test scores, etc. And it’s not just because “they’re interesting to read” or something, but that they help distinguish between thousands and thousands of applicants with high scores. It literally wouldn’t work to focus solely on numbers, because then you could fill a class several times over: “Of the [26,664] applicants, 10,225 had a 4.0 grade point average, and 13,945 candidates had scores of 700 or higher on each of the three sections of the SAT.” That’s from a news article following admission decisions for the Princeton Class of 2016.</p>
<p>In regard to the ghost writer thing, though, I have very little confidence that those essays can produce the non-formulaic, particularly individual type of the personal statements that admission officers are looking for. So I’d be wary of them if anyone reading this had something like that in mind. </p>
<p>The fact of the matter is that everything in you application matters, especially your writing, which is often not given the attention it deserves. Therefore, it would be sooo foolish to think that as long as you have the numbers you’re set. That’s all I’m trying to say. </p>
<p>Additionally, if anyone would like to me to read anything, feel free to PM me. I’m always happy to help.</p>
<p>@akiddoc </p>
<p>I think your generalizations are a bit too over-simplistic. HSCs want unique kids with a story. There are plenty of poor AA kids who get HYPSM rejections as well. There were many of DDs classmates who had a less than stellar transcripts who were rejected from Yale. </p>
<p>NewHavenCTmom - I totally agree with you. My AA D is a freshman as you know, just like yours. The Class of 2018 is full of AA students that cover the whole spectrum - from first generation college students that overcame homelessness to privileged legacy kids like mine.</p>
<p>I do alumni interviews and I know for a fact that the Adcoms take all parts of the application very seriously, including your essays and LORs. Do not take this lightly and put all you can into them. Your numbers alone will not make you stand out - there are plenty of 4.0 and 2400 SAT students who are rejected. There are also plenty of AA students who are rejected - poor and otherwise.</p>
<p>All of the classes at Yale are very well rounded. There are writers, magicians, mathletes, nerds, jocks, musicians, actors, scientists, party animals, drunks, conservatives, uber liberals - the list goes on and on. My daughter has been amazed (and sometimes shocked) at the variety of people she has met during her first semester.</p>
<p>So, listen to the advice of those that have gone before and pay special attention not only to your stats (which at this point you can do nothing about) but to the intangibles that you can control. Holistic means just that - HOLISTIC!!</p>