^^then this whole exercise is a great first experience for this student in managing the “business” of a college education. He/she really needs to drill down to the hard facts. Take the emotion out of it, what mom wants (though I personally Iike when mom rules the roost LOL), what Greek life is like, nostalgia about IU, etc.
Money is money. Facts are facts.
I love that CC helps people tease out the factors to consider.
@ClarinetDad16 I suspect Mark Cuban would have been a success wherever he went to school and if he had these same two options back when he decided I am certain he would have considered the $80 k difference as part of his decision. I don’t know which he would have ultimately picked (nor do you).
OP - you have 2 very good alternatives. If debt is a real issue, I believe Bama is likely the choice. If not, then you should consider the dollars and determine if Kelley is “worth” the extra cost.
Rather than anecdotal information, here are some hard numbers about career outcomes at each school shortly after graduation.
Kelley - “Of the 1,260 Kelley seniors who utilized the UCSO this year, 851 were actively seeking as of three months post-graduation. Of those, 95% reported a full-time job or graduate school acceptance with 72% of graduating Kelley seniors reporting their status.” So 72% of graduates reported their status 3 months after graduation and of those 95% were employed or in grad school.
Alabama Culverhouse - For December 2014 class (most recent grad info available), 63% reported their status 6 months after graduation and 95% of those were employed or in grad school.
Links below (including salary info which shows Culverhouse Finance Grads with median starting salary of $63,250 vs. Kelley Finance Grads with median starting salary of $60,000):
http://kelley.iu.edu/UCSO/Statistics/salaryStats/page40582.html
https://career.sa.ua.edu/wp-content/uploads/sites/4/First-Destination-Report-CBA-Dec-2014.pdf
This is just one other data point to consider.
I would only attend Alabama if you can get into the Honors College. Otherwise you will not be surrounded by the same caliber of students that you would be at the Kelley School. The other big benefit of the Kelley School is that it keeps you closer to Chicago so you can more easily find internships and post graduate employment, given that you would unlikely want to stay in Alabama after graduation.
Did you ever stop to wonder why there are so many Bama cheerleaders here? Why that school gets more glowing support on CC than any other college?
After everything that’s been said I think I’m now leaning towards Alabama… The debt would just be too much of a burden. I will check on the IU website for a more accurate estimated cost but I don’t think it would be very different from what I have already said.
ClarinetDad, if you moved the goalposts any further in this discussion they would be on the 50-yard line.
“He could qualify for $20K of financial aid that he conveniently didn’t mention in any of his previous posts. And I somehow know his Mom’s mind so much better than he does, that I am sure she will kick in another $20K that she hasn’t told him about in all their discussions about family finances. That’s just a little secret between me and her. Now that leaves $40K left to cover, but if he gets a $5500 yearly loan, according to MY math $5500 x 4 magically equals $40,000 !!! Ta-da, it’s all paid for! But you are forgetting he will almost certainly run into Mark Cuban at IU, and he will be so impressed that he will cut him a check for $100K and immediately offer him a job at $500K per year. So CLEARLY Indiana is the right choice !!”
@LucieTheLakie looking like $29k after this year, but we hopefully won’t need any more loans after this year anyways. But the debt would have been EXTREME at Quinnipiac or Hofstra.
But it’s not just a point of debt. I think most people would rather live in Indiana than Alabama…I know I would.
OP, only go to Alabama if you get into the Honors College; THEN I can say that it’s a better choice than Indy.
@clarinetdad16 I sincerely hope that your child’s application process is simple, straightforward, and actually meets your family’s financial and academic needs.
However, you need to realize that “need” in terms of a family and “need” as defined by a school are not one and the same thing. The op’s parents may meet the first definition and absolutely not the second. You cannot just assume the student will receive any institutional grant $$. That is a leap based on no given facts.
If my child had come on here as a sr posting his accomplishments (which are actually pretty amazing, and not just parental pride) and stated that his budget was similar and also listed the schools he was accepted into, I imagine many posters would have posted very similar comments. But, his budget was rock hard. He had no leeway for extra $$. Period. I could have wanted him to attend another school all I wanted, but the $$ simply is not there to pay the bill. Schools expect us to contribute 2-3 times what we can. We can’t.
@Chardo yes. I have wondered and I still wonder. It’s the most overrated school on this site by a long shot. Yes, they are generous with money, and I respect that. But they still can’t reach 4 stars for me. That’ll take a few convincing years for me to upgrade them.
^^^
He automatically qualifies for Honors College by virtue of winning a Presidential Scholarship.
Students at IU and other schools can qualify for merit and need. The OP originally said $25k cost for IU including the $11,000 annual scholarship. That would signal financial need.
It is fairly normal for families to place different values to different schools. Especially if a mom is trying to get her way. For example - I will pay $12,000 per year at UA and $17,000 a year at IU. In either case the kid has skin in the game.
Go through the numbers and it is clear if you only budget $12,000 for UA over and above Tuition you will fall far short when all the other costs of college come into play.
It is important to be conscious of the dollars and cents. What would I do if it was my kid and I could only afford to pay $60k for college out of my pocket? And IU and UA were my top two choices?
This way my kid got the best education at the lowest cost and hits the work force early with minimal debt.
OP, please, take @ClarinetDad16’s suggestion. It’s the best one yet.
I remember being in a somewhat similar situation myself this time last year. I wanted to attend UNCW (an OOS public), my parents wanted me to choose either Quinnipiac or Hofstra (expensive privates, also both OOS). They wanted to pay a TON more money at either of the latter two. It wasn’t that QU or Hofstra were better than UNCW (they’re not…at all…especially not Hofstra). But they wanted me to stay closer to home. Thankfully, they budged in the end.
And for the record, Cameron is better than Culverhouse.
@ClarinetDad16 Do you know if taking classes during deferment is allowed? Some schools will no longer consider a student a freshman if they enroll in classes after high school they are considered transfer students and freshman scholarship ineligible. That is not something to recommend without a thorough understanding the consequences.
@ScreenName77
keep us posted on your decision and how it works out for you. best wishes for your future success.
I find the reference to Mark Cuban, the IU alum, sort of ironic. He’d probably be the first person telling the OP to go to Alabama. Here are a few quotes of interest from Cuban on his May 13, 2012 post on Blog Maverick, The Mark Cuban Weblog:
“As an employer I want the best prepared and qualified employees. I could care less if the source of their education was accredited by a bunch of old men and women who think they know what is best for the world. I want people who can do the job. I want the best and brightest. Not a piece of paper.”
“IMHO, the biggest problem the economy has is the enormous student debt new college grads and those leaving college find themselves with. In the past leaving college meant getting a job and getting a used car and/or an apartment with some friends. Yes there was student debt, but it wasn’t any where near your car payment. You could still afford the car and the apartment. Now its the exact opposite. Today, the minute you graduate college you face the challenge of debt against a college education whose value is immediately “underwater.” As a result spending habits have changed dramatically. Now when you leave school you move back home. You take public transportation or borrow your parents car. The only thing new you buy is the cheap work outfit you need. Savings ? Forgettaboutit. It’s not happening. Your entire focus is on hitting your monthly nut for school debt , credit card and maybe a car or apartment. The crush of college debt has taken an entire generation of graduates, current and future out of the economy. Which is exactly why the economy hasn’t grown and won’t grow beyond microscopic growth rates we have seen so far."
Mark Cuban the billionaire IU grad has a different world view than he did as a struggling 18 year old to afford college. He went to college locally for 2 years and then chose the only top 10 business school he could afford. And hustled every minute so he could to pay for a top b-school and launch his success.
UA has never been a top 10 b-school.
@LBad96, you’re $29,000 in debt after one year? Please tell me I’m misunderstanding! Quinnipiac and Hofstra are irrelevant. Did you even bother to APPLY to any schools you could afford with just Stafford loans?
And you’ve visited both states when exactly? And who says he has to live in either state after he graduates? Are you stuck in NC when you finish your studies?
Of course he’s admitted to the Honors College–he qualified for the Presidential Scholarship. It’s automatic as long as he submits his application.
My kid has zero debt after one year at Bama. I’ll take that over $29,000 at UNCW any day of the week, even if I have to somehow live without your “four-star rating.”
@ClarinetDad16, you do realize that most merit scholarships awarded to freshmen can’t be deferred while they pick up credits at community college, don’t you?
it’s not a good suggestion if IU does not allow you to defer a scholarship. many scholarships are for first-time freshman only – you lose it if you start at community college after high school, then that plan falls apart.
I doubt that a student who has earned a full-tuition scholarship would be on board with starting their college journey at community college. how about it ScreenName77? is three semesters at community college cool with you?
@ClarinetDad16 I think the key word you used is “hustled.” Mark Cuban is especially successful because of his profound work ethic. I imagine he would be successful no matter what school he attended.
@LucieTheLakie I was referring to where I’d rather live during college…but I would rather stay in NC than go back up to NJ anyways. Rider (my in-state private safety) whittled the cost down to $3k per year, but there were a few loans mixed in with lots of grants and scholarships and such. Looking back on it, I definitely should have had an in-state public as my safety lol.
But, I’d MUCH rather take on a little bit of debt to attend a school where I’m happier than ever. That to me sounds a LOT more appealing than to be unhappy at a school that was cheaper and ending up having to transfer after a year or so.