<p>Since freshman year, I wanted to go to Michigan. I worked really hard in high school, got mostly A's (except a few B's in AP classes) and a 30 on my ACT. I was accepted into UMich and I was seriously set on going there. However, my other top choice is University of Miami in Florida and I am so torn. I am worried that it would be a lot harder to get a good GPA at Michigan than at Miami. I try very hard, but it seems like getting a high GPA is nearly impossible unless your a near genius (which I am DEFINITELY not). The other major concern I have is the weather. I have lived in Southern California my entire life and so the snow is completely foreign to me, and I don't want it to make me depressed. Where should I go!?</p>
<p>Is money an issue at either? What are you going to study? Why do you assume you have no chance at getting a high GPA if you work hard. Michigan wouldn’t have accepted you if they didn’t feel you were capable.</p>
<p>The weather may resolve it for you. If that is important to you Michigan won’t work - of course maybe it will be exciting to experience snow for a while (maybe for one storm anyway)</p>
<p>Everyone I know here from warm-weather states (three from California, two from Texas, two from Georgia, one from New Mexico) has said that the weather turned out to be less of a big deal than they expected. They don’t complain about it anymore than anyone else. Weather turns out to be less of a factor than you’d think, unless of course you have seasonal affective disorder.</p>
<p>cheergirlie45 - you wouldn’t have been accepted if you were not qualified to do well. Have a great attitude coming in and work hard and you’ll achieve everything you seek. Umich is at another level than Miami. AND, don’t worry about the weather. Enten is completely correct; you’ll be fine (as is most everyone) with the weather. If the cost is close to equal, you shouldn’t pass on Michigan.</p>
<p>Also: I echo the sentiment of the previous posts in that you would not have been accepted if you weren’t qualified to excel, especially since admissions has only gotten tighter and tighter. You said you are a hard worker, and this is key. Work ethic is much more important in college than in high school, and those who are accepted to UMich and don’t do well are typically the ones who either do not work hard or they have habits that hinder them from achieving well. Very rarely is someone accepted and then does not have the capability to meet their own expectations.</p>
<p>You should go where you will be happiest, which in turn is probably where you will do the best. There is a presumption that all things being relatively equal that kids should always choose the “best school possible.” But often happiness, which admittedly can be hard to gauge in advance, gets left of of the “all things being relatively equal” equation. Yes, UMich is the “better” school with the better reputation but Miami is certainly “good enough” and on the rise. By the way, almost none of us listen to the advice in the first sentence. The societal, familial, and personal pressures generally lead to just picking “the best school possible.”</p>
<p>In my opinion, Michigan is a better overall academic institution than Miami. Unless you have serious concerns about your ability to cope with the academics or fitting in at Michigan, the choice is simple. </p>
<p>If it is any consolation to you, I grew up in a country where 100-115 degree temperatures with 65%-100% humidity is the norm 5 months of the year. I never saw snow or even temperatures cooler than 50 degrees before my first winter in Michigan. I had no trouble adjusting to the weather. It may be gloomy and cold, but you will be way too busy studying and socializing to notice.</p>
<p>I hardly think this choice is simple. Even if it were between harvard and Podunk U, I think you should always go where you see yourself being the happiest and doing your best. I do concede, however, that university reputation does usually play a significant factor in where one ultimately decides to attend, and it should be taken into account.</p>
<p>Do you know what you’d want to be studying? </p>
<p>Ultimately Michigan is the better school, but Miami isn’t second rate, or drastically inferior. It is a well respected, on the rise school. In fact, it has risen more than any university in the top 50 (USNWR) has in the last decade.</p>
<p>allcapella, I do not really trust the USNWR. Even according to the USNWR, Miami’s academic reputation rank is significantly lower than most other universities in the top 50. Fiske, whom I trust more when it comes to rating universities’ academic quality, gives Miami a 3 star rating (out of 5). He gives Michigan a 5 star rating for academics. I agree that Miami is a good university, but it is not in the same league as Michigan. </p>
<p>In terms of fit, I do not see a serious difference between the two. It is not like Miami is a conservative, tiny and rural LAC. Both are research universities, both are large (yes, Michigan is significantly larger, but Miami does have 10,000 undergrads), both have major athletic programs, both are located in nice areas etc… If the OP were pondering Washington & Lee or Georgetown vs Michigan, I could see fit creeping into the discussion. But with the exception of the geographic location and weather, I do not think there is enough to make one university a great fit while the other a complete mismatch. If one of those two universities is a good fit, the other will likely be more than satisfactory.</p>
<p>I do agree that Michigan is the better school, but I don’t think the discrepancy between them is as large as you do. </p>
<p>Michigan and Umiami have a lot of similarities, but they also have tremendous differences, too. Coral Gables/Miami vs Ann Arbor? I couldn’t think of two more different environments to go to college in! With such drastically different locations and geographical cultures, I could absolutely see Umiami being a good fit for a student, while Michigan is not, or vice versa.</p>
<p>allcapella, it is not close, and I am a big fan of Donna Shalala. We are practically family. We both belong to the same tribe (Maronite Lebanese). But the evidence is glaring:</p>
<p>USNWR Academic reputation rating
Michigan 88 (schools within 3 points include Brown, CMU, Dartmouth, Duke, Georgetown, Northwestern, Penn, UCLA, UVa and Vanderbilt)
Miami 69 (schools within 3 points include BYU, Clemson, Fordham, Lehigh, Northeastern, Pepperdine, Pitt and SMU)</p>
<p>Peer Assessment Score
Michigan 4.4 (peers include Brown, Columbia, Cornell, Dartmouth, Duke, JHU, Northwestern and Penn, UCLA and UVa)
Miami 3.2 (its peers are obviously nowhere near the same league)</p>
<p>Undergraduate Business rank:
Michigan #3
Miami not ranked in the top 50</p>
<p>Undergraduate Engineering rank:
Michigan #7
Miami not ranked in the top 80</p>
<p>Biology
Michigan #20
Miami #82</p>
<p>Chemistry
Michigan #16
Miami #94</p>
<p>Computer Science
Michigan #13
Miami not ranked in the top 100</p>
<p>Earth Sciences
Michigan #9
Miami #39</p>
<p>Economics rank:
Michigan #13
Miami not ranked in the top 80</p>
<p>English rank:
Michigan #13
Miami #82</p>
<p>History:
Michigan #7
Miami #74</p>
<p>Mathematics
Michigan #8
Miami #98</p>
<p>Physics
Michigan #11
Miami #122</p>
<p>Political Science
Michigan #4
Miami not ranked in the top 80</p>
<p>Psychology
Michigan #4
Miami #52</p>
<p>Sociology
Michigan #4
Miami #84</p>
<p>Endowment
Michigan $7.6 billion
Miami $720 million</p>
<p>If you factor in state funding, Michigan operates as a private university with an endowment of $13.5 billion ($300k/student) compared to Miami’s $720 million ($50k/student).</p>
<p>In no way are Michigan and Miami in the same league. Two very different caliber institutions. </p>
<p>As far as fit goes, I also disagree that one could find one university ideal while the other horrible. I can see liking one more than the other, but there is enough in common to make one university perfectly acceptable if the other is ideal.</p>
<p>Departmental rankings and peer assessment rankings aren’t the only metric for undergraduate excellence used in USNWR, though. You can’t selectively pick the components of USNWR which Michigan fares favorably in (Peer assessments rankings, ect), and discredit the other components where it is weaker. </p>
<p>Acceptance rates are similar both UM and Umichigan reported acceptance rates of about 37 in their last common data set. </p>
<p>Strength of student bodys between the two schools are comparable. </p>
<p>% of Miami students with 3.75+ GPA: 77
% of Michigan with 3.75+ GPA: 71</p>
<p>ACT Composite 25-75 for Michigan: 28-32
ACT Composite 25-75 For Miami: 28-32</p>
<p>Classes are also, on average, a bit smaller at Umiami. </p>
<p>Large publics almost always have more consistently strong academics than privates, especially when your looking at a public of michigan’s caliber. For instance, Berkeley has more consistent academic excellence across a broad range of disciplines than Yale, Columbia, and MIT. That doesn’t, however, mean Berkeley is a better school. </p>
<p>Make no mistake, I firmly believe Michigan is undeniably a stronger university than Umiami. But to say that UMiami is drastically, and ridiculously inferior to Umichigan is a bit of an exaggeration. There is a clear, evident difference, which should be considered when a student chooses between the two universities, but it’s not so drastic the student should choose Michigan without exception.</p>
<p>“Make no mistake, I firmly believe Michigan is undeniably a stronger university than Umiami. But to say that UMiami is drastically, and ridiculously inferior to Umichigan is a bit of an exaggeration. There is a clear, evident difference, which should be considered when a student chooses between the two universities, but it’s not so drastic the student should choose Michigan without exception.”</p>
<p>I think this is a reasonable take on the comparison between these two schools.</p>
<p>I did not say that Miami is drastically and ridiculously inferior to Michigan. I said they are not in the same league. Comparing Miami to Michigan would be like comparing George Washington to Northwestern or Lehigh to Cornell. Those universities are all major research universities, but Cornell, Michigan and NU are in a different league than Lehigh, Miami and Northeastern. </p>
<p>There are only two reasons why one can reasonably choose Miami over Michigan:</p>
<ol>
<li>Cost of attendance favors Miami bu a significant margin thanks to generous aid or scholarships</li>
<li>Interest in a field that is non-existant at Michigan, such as Marine Biology</li>
</ol>
<p>The OP has not indicated an interest in a unique field of study that is only offered at Miami, nor has she expressed a concern about cost of attendance. </p>
<p>It should also be noted that while Miami’s freshman class has similar standardized test score averages to Michigan (1230-1400/28-32 at Miami vs 1260-1460/28-32 at Michigan), there are other indicators of student quality that point to Michigan having a stronger student body. For example, 90% of Michigan freshmen graduated in the top 10% of their high school class vs 70% of Miami freshmen. As for the percentage who graduated from high school with GPAs over 3.75, I find Miami’s percentage hard to believe. Check whether or not they use weighed GPAs. Some universities list weighed GPAs to make themselves look better. Michigan’s GPA data is based on unweighed GPA.</p>
<p>Not that it matters. Even if Miami’s student body is as accomplished as Michigan’s, and class sizes at Miami are similar to those at Michigan, Michigan thoroughly trounces Miami in virtually all other ways. That may explain why even though Miami students are supposedly as good as Michigan, it places far fewer students in top graduate programs, even on a per/student basis. </p>
<p>And I cannot understand how one can so easily dismiss faculty ratings, department rankings, and academic reputation. Those matter immensely. You cannot rank universities based on statistics. Attending a top 5 business school as opposed to a business school that is not even ranked among the top 50 matters. Attending a top 10 college of engineering as opposed to one that is not ranked among the top 80 also matters. </p>
<p>While factors such as weather and locale should be considered, ultimately, those are not drastic enough to justify choosing Miami over Michigan. Michigan winters are cold, but they are not unbearable. Ann Arbor and Coral Gables are different, but both are perfectly agreeable. etc…etc…etc…</p>
<p>The 3.75+ stat for Miami is unweighted.</p>
<p>Is the weather/social scene (or any other subjective locational criteria) enough to choose Miami over Michigan?</p>
<p>I think that is up to the individual who is deciding. For some it could be, for others it isn’t. </p>
<p>My point is simply that of a student clearly preferred Florida/Miami, or had a preference for warm weather/beaches, I don’t think it would be foolish for the student to go with Miami. I think the discrepancy between these two, though evident, isn’t substantial enough to choose Michigan without consideration of other factors or at the expense of your preferred college environment. You may not agree, but that’s fine. We can disagree here.</p>
<p>There’s no disagreement that there is a clear difference in quality between the two schools (although in exactly what ways undergrads actually experience that difference I think may be debatable). That said:</p>
<p>1) Is there a presumption that all things being relatively equal, a student should always select the “best school” possible?</p>
<p>2) Can an argument be made that a student might do better at the lesser school and thereby actually enhance grad school chances?</p>
<p>3) Clemson, Lehigh, Northeastern and Pitt are all pretty good schools.</p>
<p>4) Is it possible some of the Miami rankings, including peer assessment, have not caught up to the improvement and rise of the school?</p>
<p>I think where the debate lies is at what point is the discrepancy between two schools not significant enough to where you’d actually factor in other criteria. For example, I think we would all agree if a student was choosing between Stanford and Boston University, even if the student loved BU, it would be almost unfathomable not to choose Stanford. The gap narrows between schools like, say, Duke and Syracuse, and perhaps then it would be justifiable to choose Syracuse over Duke on a rare circumstance, and if the student truly loved Syracuse. Narrower still, is Umiami vs Umichigan. Clearly Michigan is stronger, but I would agree with allcapella that the difference isn’t enough to where you’d go with Michigan at the exclusion of all other criteria (fit, social setting, ect, ect)</p>
<p>On an unrelated note:</p>
<p>I do think Umiami is still somewhat unfairly dubbed a party school and “SunTanU”. Those days are long gone and the school continues to make strides and improvements. I wouldn’t be surprised to see Umiami in the top 35 of USNWR, being compared to NYU, Boston College, and Rochester, in the next 5-10 years. </p>
<p>So, Finalchild-going back to your #3- I wouldn’t be surprised if certain reputation rankings and assessments aren’t entirely reflective of what UMiami is as of 2013.</p>
<p>For what it is worth, I just had a friend choose Rochester over Duke for personal reasons. (liked the snow, felt it was a bette fit, ect)</p>
<p>Michigan has a strong national reputation for academics. I am a Michigan grad, and live far from the school. Just a couple of months ago I got a compliment in a job interview on having a degree from Michigan because it is a strong academic school. Miami is certainly a reputable state university, but not in the same category as Michigan. If I had a dollar for every time I have heard people describe a school that they like as “on the rise” in the rankings, I could have retired years ago. Michigan is there already, no need to take a gamble on how the world views the quality of your degree. The OP has valid questions about their ability to keep a high GPA at Michigan. There are a ton of smart people there. But if you have a lot of self discipline and make sure you get help immediately if you are having trouble in a class, you will do fine. I say go to Michigan – being surrounded by super smart people like that is an education in itself.</p>
<p>intparent, fyi I think Miami is private, or am I wrong on that?</p>
<p>jakey, agreed, although I think your last example of Duke vs Rochester had the least distinction of all the ones you cited. I am biased though as UR is one of kid’s final two choices. Also interesting because most would prefer the Duke weather A LOT. </p>
<p>In terms of “on the rise,” I think there is difference between definitely clearly has risen vs. a school showing some promising signs. Miami and Northeastern really have risen. Whether they can break through the next barrier is a legit question.</p>
<p>Yes, sorry, I think it is private. But the fact still stands that it does not have a national reputation academically like Michigan does.</p>