Angry over the college admissions process

Parent Cafe
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I’ve tossed out plenty with typo’s because …

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<p>Not sure it required a capitalized “yikes” with an exclamation point no less… but FWIW, I got a new computer and for some reason it auto-corrects now in CC. I find it disconcerting to be honest because if I hit the r instead of the t for it, it auto corrects to “is” for some reason. Also, if I want to type waitlist as one word, it makes it two and if I hypen, it makes it two words OR I have to go back and manually change the word to make it one word (which it highlights as misspelled). Of course, this leads me to believe that it is two words, although on CC it’s just easier to make it one word. The point is: I’ve already gone to college, received a 2 BA’s and started an MA before I found myself pregnant with S who is a Jr on this crazy ride we call college. So, I don’t hold people too accountable for their spelling and grammar mistakes on a website; Intention usually trumps typos.</p>

<p>And the sample size any one of us can gather and then relate to all kids applying (and remember all other applicants would have to be the exact same too) in a certain year over the next year… you just can’t know. It’s impossible.</p>

<p>Obviously, some kids have better odds than others, and included in that is their particular make-up overall (Socio-economic, talent, interests, scores, etc), toss in varying needs of financial aid - even within a singular family over time - and you’ve got another whole can of worms to open.</p>

<p>Yes, it sucks when you get rejected from college. It’s heartbreaking for us as parents when it involves our own or their friends. It’s a one-shot deal, more or less. But I read a study recently about resiliency. And resiliency is the stuff life is made of. (And if you want to get really correct:) Resiliency is the stuff of which life is made. :)</p>

<p>But basically the gist of the study involved kids going into therapy around 25 or so who seemingly come from very stabile, loving families who were supportive throughout. But they never really let their kids suffer much in the way of disappointment. Therefore, they don’t NEED to bounce back as often and therefore, just aren’t very good at it. It wasn’t all a about the gift of failure, but it definitely touched on that a lot. But weirder still… it wasn’t as if these kids were failing either. They just felt unsure of their own lives because they never have been left wanting for much of anything in life. We (Parents) indulge and save them from disappointment or cheer them up or commiserate vs saying, “sometimes this is just the way life is. Best thing you can do is not become jaded by what you imagine is “unfair” or somehow personal against you so you can go out there and do good things in life.”</p>

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<p>Some years ago, my neighbor’s daughter applied to 20 something schools, all very selective. She was accepted to 3 of them, along with the state schools that are not in that 20 count. Surprising where she was accepted and not. Had she applied to 10, she would not have been accepted to any of her choices. What she did was apply to 10 schools she liked the most, and then did a round of 10 more. One of her acceptances was more selective than a number of schools where she was not accepted. The other two were also “out of order” in selectivity, but not as strikingly so. I’ve seen this enough times to say that, yes, the number of apps can help you. If you are in the running but not way up there, there is some statistical advantage. </p>

<p>However, with many schools, the demonstrated interest takes a hit when too many schools are in the picture.</p>

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<p>I just want to add one thing to those parents whose children have won the brass ring by getting accepted everywhere… please don’t let your child believe that because he earned a lot of great choices, he is now the smartest person in the room. I have heard lots of stories of kids who show up in college having been the best and the brightest their entire lives. Their parents never really pushed them outside their comfort zone (probably to save them from any sense of failure or level of incompetence). But then they get to this completive college and sit among two dozen other kids who were exactly like them in HS. But in the more immediate future, by telling them they were simply the best of the best and the college was divine in their wisdom, what are you saying about the kid who didn’t get in? Just saying, try to keep it humble folks. :)</p>

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<p>The admitted class of 2016 at Vanderbilt has a middle 50 percent SAT (CR + M): 1470 – 1590. That’s pretty high - 25% are ABOVE 1590.</p>

<p>[Class</a> of 2016: highest academic profile in Vanderbilt history - Inside Vandy: Administration](<a href=“Inside Vandy: Vanderbilt University's student news source”>Inside Vandy: Vanderbilt University's student news source)</p>

<p>The admitted class of 2014 had lower SATs: middle 50% SAT (CR+M): 1440 – 1540</p>

<p>These are accepted students - matriculated students stats may be much lower, but there is a clear trend towards accepting higher stat students.</p>

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<p>I think those Vandy stats are meaningless unless we also know what level of STAT kids applied each year. I have the impression that Vandy is becoming a more desirable school over the past few years and could very well just be accepting the same percentage of kids from the top stats in whichever application pool they had for the year.</p>

<p>YMMV</p>

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<p>Daughter has perfect 36 ACT, Perfect AP scores of 5s and Perfect SAT II Subject test scores of 800s. 1000 Hours of Community Service, Piano, US House of Representative Page, US Senate Youth Program. 4.44 GPA, Class Val. SHe is first student from her high school do attend an Ivy. Most people in our area don’t even know what an Ivy is! Princeton rejected her, but Brown and Dartmouth want her!! Where should she go? Heard bad news on hazing at Dartmouth.</p>

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<p>Brown and Dartmouth are opposite experiences. It’s like if the jocks from high school built a school, that would be Dartmouth and if the artistic, slightly off-beat set built a school, that would be Brown. </p>

<p>These two schools should not be hard to differentiate. So, unless one financial package is much better than the other, it ought to be pretty easy to choose which school for your daughter.</p>

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<p>Thought #1: the wonders of superscoring!</p>

<p>Thought #2: Wait a minute. Vandy accepts about 4,000 students. Can there really be at least 1,000 students who applied who received an 800 on the CR on one sitting, and an 800 on the M on another? </p>

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<p>It certainly hurts at public universities, which are more stats-driven. For other grade-deflated high schools, it may depend on how well-known the high school is to the adcoms. Look at one of the Wall Street Journal’s lists of high schools that are known feeders to tippy-top private colleges. At least some of those high schools deflate grades, yet it doesn’t hurt the students applying to those tippy-tops, because the adcoms are intimately familiar with the schools. If the school doesn’t rank students, that helps too. And a well-crafted high school profile, specifically noting the school’s grading distribution and policies.</p>

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<p>From what I have noticed through our kid’s outcomes, each top school does their own thing and so unless your application is one of those without a shot, you could be admitted to a 6-7.5% admit rate school while a 12-15% admit rate school waitlists or rejects you (actual outcome). </p>

<p>So it comes down to what they are still looking for when they see your app and if a slot is still open for your type. OTOH, it could be the mood of the adcom on the day your app was read.</p>

<p>cpt - I could be your neighbor this year based on post 222!</p>

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<p>Thanks, I have never heard of both schools in that light. I am thinking once we visit she may get the "feel " for which one is right for her.</p>

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<p>tfairy, she will.</p>

<p>Those schools are so different from one another the only thing they have in common is their athletic league. Let us know what she decides.</p>

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<p>tfairy,</p>

<p>Your daughter has 2 great choices. I would recommend that she attend Dimensions at Dartmouth and College on the Hill at Brown. Both schools are more similar than they are different. </p>

<p>I would not put to much stock in the hazing because of the 27 students in the frat accused, all but 3 were cleared (ironic the student in the article was also charged and not cleared). Should your child decide not to go greek, she can and will find her niche because there are so any other things to do that do not involve being part of the greek system.</p>

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<p>tfairy, I think your daughter will have a clear preference. The schools are both strong academically, but different in just about every other way.</p>

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<p>tfairy - both schools are excellent, yet completely different, certainly in terms of the campus environs. Brown has an energetic, small city appeal, and Dartmouth is in a rural setting. Because they are so different, your d will probably have a clear preference after visiting. Both of my kids applied to Brown, but never considered Dartmouth, primarily because of the location.</p>

<p>Also, a great many of the students at both schools are hs valedictorians with perfect scores, so your d may feel that she is just an “average” student when she gets to college.</p>

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<p>Update: All 27 were cleared. [TheDartmouth.com:</a> UJAO drops all 27 SAE hazing charges](<a href=“http://thedartmouth.com/2012/03/30/news/sae]TheDartmouth.com:”>http://thedartmouth.com/2012/03/30/news/sae)</p>

<p>Excerpt:</p>

<p>The first 24 individual charges were withdrawn after SAE provided “physical evidence that proved specific claims by Lohse false,” Mahoney previously told The Dartmouth. The remaining three charges were rescinded for the same reason, he said today.</p>

<p>“In the current case involving alleged hazing by individual members of the Sigma Alpha Epsilon fraternity, information initially presented to the UJAO supported the charges,” Anderson said. "Information received subsequently, however, indicated that the initial information contained inaccuracies and was not a sufficient basis for the charges to proceed to hearing. Accordingly, all those charges against individuals have been rescinded.”</p>

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<p>Meaningless data unless you know the stats of the applicant pool. I see this over, and over, and over again on CC and it is driving me batty. You cannot make any conclusions by looking at the characteristics of an acceptance pool without knowing the characteristics of the applicant pool. </p>

<p>Of course, those of us not on the coast have long known Vanderbilt to be an excellent school that a high stat student wouldn’t hesitate to apply to. It’s hardly as though Vanderbilt has been some huge secret, except to those who chose not to open their eyes to anything not on the coasts.</p>

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<p>The one thing that seems to be shattered for us is the idea of a true safety.</p>

<p>S got in 1 reach (rolling) and 1 match (EA) early so he did not apply to that many schools in total. He applied to 3 reaches, 2 matches and 1 safety but was waitlisted at his safety.</p>

<p>He was shocked to be waitlisted at the safety as he was WELL above their middle 50% stats.</p>

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<p>“Heard bad news on hazing at Dartmouth.”</p>

<p>I wouldn’t worry about this for a daughter. Drinking culture, yes, everyone at Dartmouth has to cope with that in her own way, but most Dartmouth women are not hazed.</p>

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<p>Proudpatriot – that is just BIZARRE, waitlisted at his safety! What on earth…? Probably doesn’t matter to him as he will surely choose the reach or the match, but are you curious as to why the safety waitlist? Tufts syndrome?</p>

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<p>Supposedly, Tufts doesn’t do it anymore, but the name has stuck. </p>

<p>For anyone who is not familiar with it, it is when a private college does not believe a student will attend if offered admission, because the student is overqualified. It particularly happens when a student shows little measureable interest in the college, such as not visiting and not having contact with an admissions rep. If a student doesn’t seem to put much effort into that particular college’s essay, it could also be an indicator. </p>

<p>The college then waitlists the overqualified student, which keeps the college’s admission rate low and their yield high. In some cases, if that student agrees to be put on the wait list, then are instantly admitted.</p>