I applaud discussion. But when offenders are censored and censured, there is no discussion. There is just selective outrage that drives discussion underground.
IDK @moooop maybe it plays into negative racial stereotypes in a certain way, particularly when paired with a bunch of students getting drunk on tequila? Something about lazy drunken Mexicans? A sombrero worn alone, while, say, gardening, hardly seems offensive. Maybe silly, but not offensive. We don’t know what went on at this party.
One of my favorite reddit responses to “why would it be offensive”:
“Imagine if it were common for huge numbers of non-Christians to dress as Jesus and get drunk at bars on Easter. Why might that bother Christians? Don’t they want people to celebrate Easter?”
“it’s nonsense like this that makes the rise of buffoons like Donald Trump possible.”
There were racist and xenophobic political movements a long time before cultural sensitivity was a thing.
Do we even know that it was Hispanic or Mexican students who complained? I got the impression it was just PC students who were just generally taking offense on behalf of the world.
No fun allowed on Bowdoin campus. Pirates must take their rum elsewhere.
Ohmom, or perhaps that’s YOUR perception, and you’re projecting it on them?
When students drink tequila they are supporting Mexican economy, don’t they?
A Mexican wearing a sombrero is the cultural equivalent to Jesus? Cinco de Mayo, a holiday that’s virtually ignored in Mexico, is the cultural equivalent of Easter? Do you think Mexican’s care about some college students wearing sombrero’s and drinking tequila on Cinco de Mayo? Do you think Mexican’s would care if a huge numbers of non-Christians decided to dress as Jesus and get drunk at bars on Easter? 8-|
From the WaPo column:
@moooop Given that we don’t have detail or context, I’d say it’s likely we’re ALL doing some projecting onto a pretty blank canvas.
The anti-PC contingent is mostly here saying what they always say- America is going to heck in a handbasket because…oversensitive college students. White people can’t do anything in fun anymore. Etc.
It might be the case here that this party was completely inoffensive by any rational measure, but it also might not.
It is also true, I believe, that if the students - actually on campus and knowing much more about the situation than we do - want to have different people representing them in student government, then that is their right. Not “now everyone shut up it’s their right”, but “it’s their college, it’s their right and maybe they even know better than a bunch of random adults on CC getting all fired up by an article”.
This feels like deja vu to me. 25 years ago, this happened at my school and it made the NYT:
http://www.nytimes.com/1990/10/14/style/campus-life-brown-parties-on-ethnic-themes-are-halted.html
"After a complaint about a ‘‘South of the Border’’ Mexican party, the mostly white residential fraternities and sororities at Brown University have voted to end ethnic-minority theme parties…
In ‘‘Thatch,’’ a comic strip in The Brown Daily Herald drawn by Jeff Shesol, a senior history major from Aurora, Colo., a character called Politically Correct Person insists on referring to 9-year-old girls as ‘‘pre-women.’’ Like Superman in the presence of kryptonite, P.C. Person, crumbles to the floor when faced with an argument.
In Jest, a ‘Water Party’
In a strip printed last week, P.C. Person tried to stop a fraternity from holding an offensive theme party. The fictional fraternity, in an attempt not to offend anyone, held a ‘‘Water Party,’’ but the party turned controversial when the ‘‘Artesian Community’’ became shocked and offended, putting the fraternity at peril of losing its housing. "
“Imagine if it were common for huge numbers of non-Christians to dress as Jesus and get drunk at bars on Easter. Why might that bother Christians? Don’t they want people to celebrate Easter?”
Why don’t Irish people get worked up over green beer and drinking on St Patrick’s Day? How come towns have Oktoberfests?
Clearly some people do, even in this very thread.
Even if the students want to oust these folks from leadership positions, they need a significant and rational reason to back them up…they can’t just invent a reason or next time it will be “we don’t like his religion” or "his pigment is all wrong.’’ And you’re saying a …HAT … is that reason?
@moooop Like I said, if you’re not on campus you probably don’t have the full picture.
If you read the Bowdoin student newspaper, you’d find that the two student gov’t members in question supported an official statement about this after a similar issue this past fall - a “gangster” (dress “black”) party (which followed a “Cracksgiving” the year before).
The students themselves supported “the reason” - this statement: http://students.bowdoin.edu/bsg/files/2015/10/Statement-of-Solidarity.pdf
I find it difficult to believe that party goers and party planners were unwitting participants in what is otherwise a wholesome fun party. There have been far too many ethnic theme parties and subsequent fallout in the news for anyone to hide behind ignorance or entertainment as an excuse. There are many, many themes from which to choose when planning a drinking party that involve no racial elements. And yet, the Bowdoin group chose one that has repeatedly been highlighted in the news. These students may be brazen. Or these students may be in denial. But they are in no way naive or ignorant of the possible consequences.
Cinco De Mayo or St. Patty’s day celebrations are examples of “laughing with us.” A “Redneck Appalachia” party, on the other hand, would be an example of “laughing at us.” It’s really not that hard to discern the difference.
We have no way of knowing the intent of the party planners and attenders. That said, as pointed out by the GMTplus7/The Washington Post, it seems a bit much to punish students for essentially recreating a Mexican restaurant scene similar to what many of us could find in our hometowns, and often in establishments owned and operated by Mexicans. And yes, it IS hard to discern the difference at times between what is fun and what is hurtful, in part because the group in question will have members who are offended and others who are not. Remember the case of the black chef who planned a dinner for an African-American organization that included soul food and then was accused of being a racist?
This is not the incident I remembered, but similar and the chef was also African-American: http://www.eater.com/2015/1/20/7862837/is-it-racist-bogarta-atlantic-city-soul-food-menu-mlk-jr-day
I wouldn’t go so far as to say that I get “worked up” over the travesty that is St. Patrick’s Day in some places, but it des annoy me. Generally I don’t say anything about it.
Irish culture is grossly caricatured here, even by those who profess to be friendly. Next time you say “St. Paddy’s Day” recall that calling someone a “Paddy” is an insult like wop or kraut or spic. Next time you cook corned beef and cabbage and think you’re honoring the Irish national dish be aware that it is almost never eaten there, anymore than real Mexicans eat platters of nachos:
http://www.businessinsider.com/authentic-mexican-food-vs-tex-mex-2014-8
What the sombrero-wearing Mexican snoozing under a cactus and the drunken Irish leprechaun have in common is that they portray those “lesser” peoples as drunken, shiftless, and lazy, as opposed to the superior Anglo Saxon. Just like the dumb Polacks, the dumb Swedes (check out Sinclair Lewis), and so forth.
It really isn’t a very pretty picture.
Why is it so hard to discern laughing at us from laughing with us? When has an ethnic-themed college drinking party ever been embraced by the subject ethnic group as “laughing with us?” How many protests does it take to get across the point that such parties are “laughing at us?” When was the last time that a “south of the border” college drinking party served as a cultural celebration, an homage to Mexican culture? The answer is never. There is literally no such thing.
When it comes to college drinking parties, there is no ambiguity. I’m surprised people insist on not knowing the difference. It seems to be willful ignorance, an attempt to blur the lines so as to obscure the real issue.
Introducing the decor of a Mexican restaurant or the costuming of a mariachi band into this conversation is insulting. Come on, people. A NASCAR-themed restaurant is not the same thing as a “Redneck moonshine party” even if the decor and music is similar. And you know it. Do you really believe that a fraternity throwing a redneck party, replete with overalls, wife-beaters and dueling banjos, is really just celebrating southern pride?
We all know what is offensive. We even agree that the offenders have a right to offend.
Our disagreement boils down to one question, which is really the issue here: How forcefully should such offenses be challenged?
Some people think these offenses are harmless. I happen to think they should be rigorously challenged because such offenses typically don’t happen in a vacuum. They are normally part of a larger environmental issue and not challenging them sends the wrong message that such bigotry is tolerated, or worse shared. And, if you aren’t laughing along, you don’t belong here.
Label me as politically correct or whatever. I’ll wear that badge proudly.
“This has to do with our social code and the context of other issues we’ve been dealing with as a college,” he said. “It also has to do with the facts and circumstances of this situation, which I can’t speak to for privacy reasons.
This statement is what bugs me, why not explain the situation?
Mount St. Mary’s tried this. It didn’t work out so well. Of course, that’s just a sample size of one. But I think a leader is more about the type of human being he or she is and the kind of people skills employed, rather than coming from a particular background (i.e. business vs. academic).