AP Course Workload

Applying to College
1

Hi, I’m a freshman. I have planned out what classes I’m going to take the next three years. Please tell me if this is a manageable workload and if colleges will be impressed. Also, just tell me what you think of these classes in general. I will also put the classes I am taking this year.

9th grade(currently):
GT Algebra 2
Honors Biology (I would’ve taken GT Biology but the GT teacher is bad)
GT English 1
AP Human Geography
Honors Spanish 2
Health Science (1 year of a “career class” is required in my state)
Band

10th grade:
AP Cal AB
GT Chemistry
GT English 2
AP World History
Honors Spanish 3
AP Biology
Band

11th grade:
AP Statistics
AP Environmental Science
AP English 3
AP US History
AP Spanish 4
AP US/Comparative Gov
Band

12th grade:
AP Cal BC
AP Physics 1
AP English 4
AP Euro History
AP Spanish 5
AP Macro/Micro Econ
Band

Also, I’m thinking of replacing AP US/Comparative Gov (11th grade) with AP Psychology and then AP Euro History (12th grade) with AP US/Comparative Gov. Pls tell me what you think of this as well.

Thank you!!!

2

Yes, colleges will definitely be impressed with you taking 16 AP courses over your 4 years in high school. However, if you are aiming for top schools you are going to have to get A’s in the majority of your classes, whether they be AP or regular. What I’m trying to say, is that make sure you balance obtaining a very solid GPA, with the rigor of your course load.

Replacing AP psych with AP Gov will definitely reduce your workload. However, Junior year does not look like it will actually be that tough of a year for you. Sure, it will definitely be a lot work, but Stat, Environment, and Psych are all on the easy side for AP classes. However, having a slightly easier course load isn’t a bad idea considering that junior year is the year you will be taking standardized tests.

Also, what major are you considering in college?

3

Thank you for the advice! I’m hesitant about taking AP Psych because one of the teachers is pretty much the worst teacher in the school. The average for her class is about a 78. This is why I’m still debating on whether or not to take psych.

As for majors, I haven’t really thought about them, but I would like to be a surgeon (neuro or cardio) when I grow up.

4

No, colleges will not be “impressed.” Once you’ve done 6-8 AP’s, the law of diminishing returns kicks in, and any additional AP will not significantly strengthen your application. Additionally, colleges will certainly not be impressed if you overextend yourself and do not do well in the classes. Colleges are looking for more than just an AP junkie, but as a freshmen, you have plenty of time to modify your plan.

5

I did 5 APs my first three years and then 5 my senior year and got into many tops schools such as JHU, Cornell, and UNC-Chapell Hill. I actually decided to reject these schools and choose a BS/MD program instead, so in short you have to find the right balance for you that also allows you to participate in extracurriculars and actually enjoy the high school experience.

6

AP class workload depends almost entirely on the teacher.

As for # of APs, well, I’ve definitely seen kids do 16+ (in three years–Korean high school is grades 10-12). Most I’ve seen is 18.

7

@skieurope

Not to boast, but I’m pretty smart and I think I’ll do fine with all the APs I’m taking. Also, I do extracurriculars so I am a balanced person. :slight_smile:

8

@Undecided3494

You were accepted into Cornell?!? That’s amazing man! Were you in a lot of extracurriculars because, to be frank, I’m surprised that a person with only 10 APs under their belt was accepted into an Ivy?

9

@supbro123 Im cringing at your last reply

10

I agree with @encadyma . The vast majority of students at Cornell (and the other Ivies!) have 10 or fewer APs, and–GASP!–some have none. You may think you’re smart, @supbro123 , and you may even be smart (for some values of “smart”), but you’re a little kid, a 9th grader, and you’re rapidly exposing your inexperience and lack of knowledge in this thread. In cases like these, sometimes a little self-awareness and humility are called for.

11

(I’m sorry, @supbro123 , that was a bit more lecture-y and harsher than I meant it to be. Best of luck to you with all your goals.)

12

The reason I believe I got in was because by taking only 10 APs, which in the context of my high school is probably the most I could possibly take. I was able to spend time playing three sports and becoming good enough to be a captain on all three teams my junior or senior year. I also participated heavily in Science Olympoad and held an officer position every four years and ended up president my senior year. The best thing on my app though was 300 hours of volunteering and a 6-week research internship at the local state university. These activities along with a 3.9 GPA and a 35 on the ACT are what I believe made me competitive at top colleges.

13

Plus even though I did all these things I never felt like I didn’t have time for friends or just relaxing at times.

14

I never said you couldn’t handle it, but that was not your original question.

15

As @skieurope (who is not a Super Mod for nothing) pointed out, there is a law of diminishing returns on APs. SternBusiness is simply wrong about tippy-top colleges being “impressed” by numbers, whether it is the # of APs or the number of 800s on SAT subject tests or your perfect SAT/ACT or your 4.0 UW GPA. Ask all the people on CC every spring who had perfect numbers and didn’t get in to their top choices. All those numbers matter, but they are data points- useful, but not what makes or breaks your application.

Fwiw, SternBusiness is completely right in saying that many of the APs you are planning to take are relatively easy APs (easy enough that many students self study them). But guess what: the selective colleges also know that they are relatively easy. Once they see Calc (esp BC), a science or two, a history or two, a language- after that it’s less interesting. Not sure how you are doing AP Spanish twice (there is only 1 Spanish AP), or why you would put Stats between AB & BC, but a year each for Lit & Lang is not impressive to AdComms who see many kids take both in the same year (though I know that many high schools separate them).

I know genuinely dozens of current students at Ivies (all except Brown- oddly, I don’t know any current Brown students) and similar super-selective schools who got in with 6 or fewer APs- but like @Undecided3494 they had a lot of strings to their bow: serious ECs, that showed depth and commitment overtime; externally validated achievements, leadership positions reflecting respect by peers and adults; genuine interests.

And that’s the point that you are missing. Read [url=<a href=“http://mitadmissions.org/blogs/entry/there_is_no_formula%5Dthis%5B/url”>http://mitadmissions.org/blogs/entry/there_is_no_formula]this[/url] and [url=<a href=“http://mitadmissions.org/blogs/entry/applying_sideways%5Dthis%5B/url”>http://mitadmissions.org/blogs/entry/applying_sideways]this[/url]. Again, as @skieurope noted: “The most selective colleges don’t want AP junkies”- because they are building communities. They are explicitly looking for people who will add to the community- who will be on the teams, run the radio station, put on the plays, be active in student government, organize student events, support their peers by showing up at student performances and so on- all while they are getting great marks and doing research in their field. It’s not just about being smart enough to get good marks.

*and fyi, AP psych and human geo get no respect; stats and enviro don’t get much; and if the GT bio course is any good you may find doing it & chem at the same time is tough going, as both are big curriculum courses (ie, just the volume of material takes a lot of managing).

16

I can appreciate being a planner, however, you likely don’t know what you like, what your college plans are, or what your strengths and weaknesses are yet. Your freshmen year looks fine. I would base subsequent years on how well you do your first year and perhaps the direction you’re heading with respect to a college major.

If you are leaning toward engineering then take the courses to get you through Calculus (B/C), Physics © if they have it and most likely Chemistry.

If you leaning towards a health field then still calculus (though A/B would probably be enough to get out of taking college math, check with the school) but load up on Bio and Chemistry. You may consider Physics 1 and 2 (you won’t need the Calculus based physics of Physics C). It’s nice to have some Gen Ed AP’s if you like as they can free up time in college.

Many of the most selective universities won’t accept AP credits so you’ll just have to check. Take courses that prepare you for college or because a subject interests you but not just to impress. I am of the belief that it is best to be who you are and find a school to match you than to attempt to create a student that a specific university might want.

17

@collegemom3717
Oh I’m simply wrong about top colleges being impressed by numbers?The vast, vast majority of kids making it into top schools are impressing colleges with “numbers”. Then, it is obviously other things like strength of EC’s and your story that make and break your acceptance.

Is taking 16 AP courses vs. 6 AP courses more impressive? Obviously yes. Is it worth it in the admissions process to take that many AP course? Depending on the student (if they can handle it) it maybe worth it, but most of the time probably no.

I say if you can handle that many courses go for it. Just make sure the rest of your resume is balanced as well (EC’s).

18

@collegemom3717 You are trying to prove a point, which is true (that colleges value EC activities with leadership roles and genuine interest immensely) but in order to get to these top schools, like Brown, you have to be the absolute top of your class. This means probably taking 10+ AP classes.

It’s obvious that becoming deeply involved in EC’s is important, but if you want to go to a top program, first you have to have the grades and scores.

19

@SternBusiness: you are correct- you have to be at the top of your class to get into these schools. You are also correct that you need very strong numbers. But you are simply not correct about 10+APs being necessary to get into these schools. I know, first hand, of many, many students who are currently enrolled at HYPSM & others who I know do not have more than 5-6 APs.

The point is that good stats are necessary but not sufficient, and simply having taken more APs is not going to impress AdComms, many of whom have made it abundantly clear that they do not like the arms-race approach to applying. For example:

Bill Fitzsimmons, Dean of Admissions at Harvard:

“There are people who arrive at college out of gas,” says William Fitzsimmons, dean of admissions at Harvard College in Cambridge, Massachusetts. “It’s crazy for students to think in lockstep they must take four or five or six advanced-placement courses because colleges demand it.”

Or:

Dean of Admissions at Stanford:

One thing we are trying to do is dispel the myth that a curriculum loaded to the brim with Advanced Placement courses—with no regard to a student’s happiness or personal interests—is a prerequisite for admission to Stanford. Such a course load is not required, nor is it always healthy.
Whenever we talk to students and parents, we encourage them to work with you [guidance counselors] to develop an appropriate course load. Of course we want students to challenge themselves, but we don’t want them to hurt themselves physically or mentally along the way. We try to explain to families that the students who will thrive at Stanford are those who are genuinely excited about learning, not necessarily those who take every single AP or Honors or Accelerated class. We tell students we expect them to take a reasonably challenging load, selecting from among the most demanding courses available to them. And we make it clear that we want students to work with you to exercise good judgment in course selection.

Or:

Matt McGann, MIT

I had classmates who attended high schools that offered dozens of these courses, and, yes, some of them even took dozens of APs. But it is not necessary that you take all of these courses, or as many as possible…There is no minimum or recommended number of AP courses. AP scores are not part of an admission formula…What we are saying is that, despite what you may have heard, college admissions isn’t a game of whoever has the most APs, wins.

Telling the OP- a 9th grader!- that a sure way to impress AdComms at top schools is by taking 16 APs is wrong and misleading.

20

@collegemom3717 But, in order to be top of your class that means you have to take 10+ AP classes. At my school, if you did not take 8+ AP courses you would not be even near the top. For admission from highly competitive high schools this is the only way to get near the top.

From schools that aren’t as highly ranked, and therefore less competitive, then I totally agree that you do not have to take that many AP courses. At those schools, taking 5 AP courses, even though they offer 8, could be more than enough to put you at the top.