App Nuts and Bolts -- If not Online, then how?

Parent Cafe
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<p>As the thread title indicates, this thread is about application "nuts and bolts," specifically, whether to type or handwrite the application, or whether it simply doesn't matter at all.</p>

<p>I won't bore you with my daughter's stats, EC's, and the like. For purposes of this post, suffice it to say that she's pretty much in the 99th percentile across the board (GPA and testing), good to excellent other admissions factors (EC's, Recs, etc.), and really likes all of her college possibilities (she loves one safety, likes another, adores all of her matches, and is hoping for some luck with her reaches -- probably three in all, and all of which are attainable and have been attained by similarly or lesser qualified kids in our district).</p>

<p>To cut to the quick, the nuts and bolt app issue comes up because my daughter has zero interest ... I mean absolutely ZERO ... in applying to any of her schools online. She's no Luddite and far from a technophobe (she's actually very good with technology and generally uses it liberally), but when it comes to her writing, a presentation, or an important project ... and a college app is definitely all of the above ... she apparently wants the tactile comfort of physically seeing the finished product on paper ... signing off on the aesthetics and the formatting ... having the opportunity to proof ... and once satisfied, then and only then getting her finished product into the hands of the decision makers. She's always been this way so I don't think it would be worthwhile to try and change her opinion. I view this as a personal idiosyncrasy (I've got a friend who is a prominent literary agent and he tells me that many major authors are similarly afflicted) and I can't believe it will hurt her chances in any way. I know colleges often encourage online apps, but I've never heard that not using an online app is in any sense prejudicial (and we've specifically asked this question to a fair number of schools).</p>

<p>So, if the online app is not an option for her, then how should she fill out the application? I've heard many people suggest using various computer programs to convert the app into a .pdf file and fill in blanks through these programs. She's not likely to do this because we don't have such a program, nor do we want to spend time that could be productively employed elsewhere in learning to use a program. This leaves the typewriter, handwriting (printing actually), or some combination thereof. Michelle Hernandez claims typerwriters somehow suggest that daddy's secretary typed the document (truth be told, daddy himself would likely be doing most of the physical typing, but not the composition). Hernandez also claims that admissions officers react favorably to handwriting (assuming of course the applicant has pleasant, legible handwriting).</p>

<p>I understand that this isn't life or death and might be a lot of sound and fury, signifying exactly nothing. But I'm curious what our learned, experienced parents have to say. She's leaning towards filling out text boxes, grids, and blank lines by hand (she has neat, rather cool left-handed printing), but TYPING (via computer generated attachments and exhibits) all lengthy essays, short answers, activities lists, etc.</p>

<p>Anyway, thanks in advance to all who contribute their $0.02. Much obliged.</p>

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<p>I disagree with Michele Hernandez' opinion on typing -- as far as I know, these days most kids are pretty adept with the keyboard. Comes from all that practice with IM'ing. But if "truth be told, daddy himself would likely be doing most of the physical typing" - then daddy himself is far too involved in the college process. Whatever gets submitted, paper or onine - daughter needs to be the one doing all the typing, writing, or data entry. (Exceptions allowed only for those with real physical disabilities - and for entries of parental financial data, usually on the Profile or FAFSA). </p>

<p>I also disagree with Michele Hernandez' take on handwritten applications. It may have been true when she was working in the Dartmouth office, but right now every single college admissions site I have looked at makes it very clear that they prefer online submissions. I think when it comes down to it, paper makes a lot more work for the office staff. </p>

<p>With a very few exceptions, all colleges will accept paper applications and if your daughter's handwriting is clear and legible, it probably won't count against her. I don't think it's a problem if she fills out the forms by hand -- my own daughter was doing that with the first college app she received until I explained that the particular college waived the application fee for online apps (Basically, I made it clear that my $45 isn't going to any college that offers free online apps -- I'm the cheapskate who started the thread on that very subject). </p>

<p>But otherwise -- I see no harm. But as noted, IMHO, a parent typing an essay for the kid is way over the line.</p>

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<p>I'm no admissions officer, but I do occasionally have to type in forms as part of my work. It is almost impossible to get everything spaced and lined up right. The self-correction does a pretty good job, but not perfect, so the inevitable corrected typos can look pretty bad if there are very many. Heaven forbid, don't do the old-school Liquid Paper corrections. </p>

<p>The best thing to do is try it one way on the first one, and if not completely satisfied, then try it the other way, and decide which technique she will use going forward.</p>

<p>I seem to recall that some of the online apps have the option to print at the end, then mail it in? Maybe that would satisfy her need to manicure the applications.</p>

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<p>DD, Filling out the application on a computer and transmitting it on line through the internet are two different issues. You can do both or just the first. </p>

<p>Although I can appreciate that the world is on-line, right or wrong, we felt the same way about going totally paperless. Wanted to feel the heft of the whole package, staple it, put in order, say a few magic words over it.</p>

<p>You can access the common application, fill it out, print it and send a hard copy with all your flotsam and jetsam attached. You can make copies and adjustments for each college you apply to without re-entering the information. You can also do this for many college specific applications. (I know my son did it this way for Williams.)</p>

<p>This procedure is very easily accomplished. Yes, it may involve a new program on your computer, but even for world-class Luddite, it was doable. We followed the very simple instructions on that someone posted on the old CC board. I'm sure they can be resurrected.</p>

<p>Do not even think about typing or handwriting. It will cause you extreme aggravation and it would be viewed as weird.</p>

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<p>Many schools prefer that the application be submitted online as stated in their literature. We were told flat-outright at several information sessions that applying ONLINE was the PREFERRED method. As an added incentive, many schools waive the application fee, if you apply online.</p>

<p>Have you checked out the new common application? D has started it and I was amazed at how vastly improved it was from my last go-round with older D. There are additional pages (more than I remember) and better directions. It actually looks like there is enough room for D's entire activity resume to be incorporated - which would be great, less paper to lose!</p>

<p>I've told D to take it slow and we will all recheck her work before pressing the "submit" button. I'm thrilled at the idea of sending one complete package online.</p>

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<p>The thing that concerns me is the idea that what you type on-line doesn't necessarily appear to the reader as you have intended. There was a recent thread that mentioned that the on-line app had a seemingly small space to include EC's or some such list . One poster commented that you could scroll well over into the supposedly small box left and right and get gobs of space you wouldn't know was there. Man, that would scare me.</p>

<p>I'm tending toward computer generated app's, no hand writing , but hard copies printed out and double or triple proofed for spacing and appearance issues that I just don't trust on-line. I hate losing the online app savings but D has fee waivers at 3 of her schools already from visits, so it won't be that bad. Consider me a Luddite,too. But hey, the adcoms may see our post mark and the hoofprints from our mail carrier and be impressed it's even typed.</p>

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<p>Curmudge, I haven't worked with the current online forms, but 5 years ago when my son was applying, all of the various online submission sites had utilities to let you view the application as the college would see it & to print, basically in PDF format. That was in 2000-2001 - I'm sure that if anything the technology has gotten more sophisticated.</p>

<p>However, the changes in technology have limited my ability to explore the sites in depth. Back in the stone age when my son was applying, my desk top computer was the only one connected to a high speed line - so everything had to be finalized on my computer. So that basically gave me access to my son's account to explore everything there. But nowadays, we have more computers than people in the house, and we use our laptops to connect via wireless. So my daughter will probably do all essay writing & cutting & pasting from her own computer, as well as the account creation & log in stuff. She doesn't even need me to make payments for her, as she has her own credit card. I'll be lucky if she gives me a chance to proofread. </p>

<p>I am very glad that we used online submission when my son applied, though. Some of the busier, colleges were not very good about communication or confirming that they had received the application. The online system gave us a confirmed date-stamped receipt -- as well as the ability to download the entire application in PDF format - which in turn could be retransmitted as an attachment to an email. This came in handy when one college reported that it had not recieved the second part of the application weeks after it had been submitted. (They eventually found it ... but it felt good to be able to send them an email with the date-stamped file attached)</p>

<p>I know it feels better to have something to stick in the mail - but unless you also send things by certified mail, return receipt requested - or by a delivery service like fedex - you don't have any proof that it reached its destination. And I can tell you - as much as you would like to have that receipt in hand, the staff at the admissions office HATES having to sign for deliveries (imagine you work in an office where you have to sign for dozens or hundreds of deliveries every day - not fun). So most people send in a stamped, self addressed post card for the staff to use to mail back an acknowledgment.</p>

<p>Me - I prefer the e-submission. With one caveat: do not allow your kid to wait until the last day to submit online. If you do, your computer is sure to crash or your internet connection is sure to go down (or both) that very day.</p>

<p>On the other hand, if it IS the last day, and the computer is working, you may need it. One problem with mail: a lot of the colleges have a silly thing they do with mailing - they say that everything has to be POSTMARKED by January 1st. Well, January 1st happens to be a holiday - the post office is closed - so its not possible to get something post marked January 1st. Some colleges - such as Columbia - say that its ok if the app is postmarked by January 2nd. Well... in 2006, January 1 falls on a Sunday, so the national holiday of New Year's Day will be observed on Monday, January 2.... so basically for those colleges with January 1-2 deadlines, if your envelope isn't at the post office and postmarked on Saturday, December 31.... you've got a problem. Now I'm not saying that the colleges are going to toss out applications received with January 3rd postmarks -- but if it was my kid's dream school I wouldn't want to risk it.</p>

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<p>Momrath, both my kids (classes of 2005, 2009) typed their aps..it was a good quality self correcting electric typewriter, and judging from the outcomes, I don't think it was viewed as weird. (essays, resumes, of course, were done on the computer and printed out). When there was a problem with an imperfect correction, a xerox copy was made which made it invisible. The reason for typing was 1. the small, neat font allowed more information to be fit in the space, and allowed putting two lines in one space when needed 2. Lack of familiarity/comfort with special adobe programs that allow greater flexibility with the pdf format. In order to get good at using a typewriter this way, they made a copy of the common ap to try it out, and then did a final version.</p>

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<p>There are many schools, including S's, that do not let the kids submit the apps online. This is because the school submits the app in a nice package in a folder with ALL the paperwork together- including the school profile, references, transcript etc. So-online is not an option for many kids.</p>

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<p>On the common app there are many supplemental computer configuration recommendations. Some essays have to be submitted via "notebook" and in some cases the user has to use internet explorer, not aol. A good deal of this is beyond MY area of expertise!</p>

<p>We've run some "print-preview" tests and yes, it takes some refining, but D will be the tech maven, and I'll help with proof-reading...</p>

<p>And yes, the control freak in me is a little nervous, but after hearing 10 out of 10 colleges tell us to apply online, I'm not going to do otherwise.</p>

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<p>My d's HS likes to "process" the application. So it is sent out through the guidance office as a complete package-application- Teacher Recomm.- Secondary School Report-etc. Therefore- we DO NOT submit on-line applications. It seems to work. We're getting our kids into really fine schools including H-Y-P. Depending on the application format of the school, you can sometimes "type" in the info on the application and then print it out. (That's the best & easiest). The Common App. works that way too. Sometimes we had to download the application and use a typewriter. Yes I still kept an electric Smith Corolla (?) in the house- and I was able to get a ribbon cartridge for it at Staples. (at least 2 years ago I could). I personally do not think it is over the top for mom or dad to type out the application. My d doesn't need to line up the paper to type in what college I went to and where she was born. Luckily most of the essays and "meatier" parts of the application can be "typed" on a computer as an attachment- so my kid will concentrate her efforts on those aspects of the application. So do not worry about what the colleges think. If the application is neat and properly presented, she'll be ok.</p>

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<p>S filled out Common App online by stages, revising and adding to it as he went along; he then printed out a hard copy and attached supplemental materials, including catalog description of college classes he'd taken and a cv.</p>

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<p>Donemom, OK I wish I hadn't used the word "weird" in relation to typewritten applications. I guess I was projecting my own extreme all thumbsness when it comes to typewriters. :) Didn't mean to offend. </p>

<p>The point is to achieve a clear and neat application with minimum aggravation. To me that would definitely mean using a computer, but obviously this isn't universally true.</p>

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<p>Just weighing in with a different take on
[quote]
daddy himself would likely be doing most of the physical typing, but not the composition

[/quote]
. I see no problem with this whatsoever, and that's what I did for S and gS, after requiring them to complete one app with their own personal little fingers. They each composed AND typed their own short and long essays (on-line for some; off-line for supplements). But once they had typed their name, rank, serial #, activity lists etc. on their own for the first app, I had no problem being the "typist" for repeats.</p>

<p>To me, this is a non-issue. Kid can do all the typing;mom, dad or Aunt Tillie can do some of the typing. This is a clerical job, imho, and the assignment depends on who is the better, more interested or more available clerk. Just mho.</p>

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<p>Be aware that on many of the on-line applications, there is a character limit to most of the text boxes. Many kids last year found out after they submitted that there is no warning that your essay is being truncated. It let's you type it, but doesn't save it all. D downloaded all of her apps and used Acrobat to edit them, then printed for proofing and submittal. You never know on-line what the reader on the other end is seeing. Errors in transmission and programming do happen.</p>

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<p>We found the same thing as Bandit_TX, which is why S printed out for submission. We followed recommendations on CC and bought Adobe Acrobat Professional with a student discount.
Also, since S had to send out his application himself, rather than in a bundle through the GC, he wanted to minimize the number of different pieces of his application coming in separately, which would increase the likelihood of things being misfiled (highschool profile/GC rec/high school teacher recs/high school transcript; application/essays/cv/catalog description of college courses; college transcript; college prof's rec).</p>

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<p>Back in the 'ol days, when I was reading applications, it was usually best if the essay or other attachments were typed. Just made for easier reading. And in filling out the application forms, the main thing was for the student to print legibly.</p>

<p>I think it would still hold true today - it's just most kids now can print an essay from their computer file. And if a school receives thousands of applications, (whether hand-printed, or common app), much of the information is scanned into the college's application system. So the main thing is to have it legible enough to be picked up by the scanner. Though paper files are always maintained, usually ad. counselors are doing a lot of the "reading of the application" straight off the computer screen.</p>

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<p>DudeDiligence- your daughter must be related to mine. She also wanted to handprint her app, which she did. (I had no say in this matter - she consulted her counselor, who told her that was an ok option). She did use Word for her long essays and her activity list, which she included on separate pieces of paper. For the short essay, she wrote it on word, cut it and pasted it onto the app. I took her app to Kinkos and had it duplicated for each college she applied to. Once it was copied, the typed part blended in nicely with the handprinting.
Her printing is wonderful and as readable as the typewritten word, but I would never suggest that my son follow her method.(horrors) I think that most kids would be better off using the word processing method either online or processed and then mailed. But for some kids - maybe the creative/writing obsessed kind with beautiful printing, the handwritten app can work.<br>
She was very pleased with the way the whole thing looked, and it didn't hurt her in admissions at all. This was a couple of years ago, but if she were applying today, she probably would do it the same way.</p>

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<p>Thanks to all experienced posters---this is so helpful!!!</p>

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<p>Printing is neither bad nor good (unless the printing isn't neat of course). </p>

<p>My D submitted most of her apps in hard copy (well, except UCs and maybe one other college). We did do the pdf thing--seriously, the Adobe program can do some very nice things (the one I like the best is the ability to make a pdf out of a web page, with just a click or two, or a scan). As for apps, the program had an auto-fill feature so that if you wanted to put in your name, you only had to type the first letter or 2 and it would fill the rest in.</p>

<p>But I think it would be perfectly acceptable to neatly print or type (where do you even find a typewriter? I have to borrow from my 80+ year old neighbors) to fill out any boxes and word-process the essays and short answers. D liked the ability to fiddle with the font, size and margins to make her essays fit the space on the app in a pleasing way. Cutting and pasting is perfectly acceptable. My D would print her essays directly onto the app page.</p>

<p>One thing you might want to be on the look out for: many colleges ask that you fill out "Part 1" of the application and send it in right away. That way, they can start a file for you early on in the process. Many colleges will ask that you do that part on line, but you can submit the rest of the app by mail. But some will require you to continue as you started--if online, then you must continue on line. Check in the literature for each school.</p>

<p>The thing I like most about current technology is that you can download most school apps off the internet and print them out. That way, you don't have just one or two copies of the application, which you have to work so carefully with.</p>