Are Japanese people really that racist?

College Confidential Community
41

<p>
[quote]
The point, however, is that this was an active form of discrimination that is less present in other societies.</p>

<p>This is, at least to some extent, contrasted with someone living in the US or another more "heterogeneous" society. I know, I know, we have discrimination here as well, and blah blah blah, but I rarely see Americans (at least in major cities) freak out and act like there's a werewolf standing next to them if a Japanese person steps on a train car.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>And my point is that merely being pointed at or given curious looks isn’t really discrimination.</p>

<p>I’ve gotten the same traveling the rural parts of France, the Czech Republic, parts of Africa, Mexico/Latin America and even parts of the US.</p>

<p>It’s a common complaint of white expats – since they don’t have the same experience that minorities do w/ these issues.</p>

42

<p>futurenyustudent,</p>

<p>"Kind of sort of xenophobic" pretty much translates into a form of bigotry.</p>

<p>And your mom is incorrect. Citibank had a hard time succeeding because of regulatory pressures that it hadn't faced in other countries. </p>

<p>k&s,</p>

<p>It isn't? So when an Arab is sitting on an airplane and every other passenger is staring at him, glaring, and whispering to each other about his presence, that's not discrimination?</p>

<p>That's what you get in Japan, except that it's supposedly "benign." To be honest, I don't often side with Debito Arudo on his pet issues, but he is right on one thing: Japan is EXCEPTIONALLY closed when it comes to non-natives. Even those who naturalize face a lifetime of discrimination.</p>

<p>Yes, I know, it happens in the US. However, the degree to which those few naturalized citizens of Japan face discrimination is far far worse than what occurs in the US. It's gotten better in the last decade, but it's still FAR behind other states.</p>

43

<p>
[quote]
But I'm a little worried that some people will be outright racist and say rude things about me

[/quote]
No, they won't. Unless you travel to the countryside where they're a lil less educated. Otherwise they wouldn't be rude, because Japanese people are very polite to foreigners. It's in their culture to be really nice and polite to foreigners, guests, and elders.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Sorry - but you're pretty ignorant about this issue.

[/quote]
i grew up in asia.</p>

44

<p>I'm an american and have been living in japan for the past year and a half. I would say that the Japanese can be quite racist, especially towards Koreans and Chinese. Even my mom's private students (she teaches english) have said, straight-up, that they don't like Koreans. I have korean friends here who definitely feel at odds with the Japanese.</p>

<p>I think that the japanese people's racism, though, dates back about a hundred years, to the conflicts they had when they colonized korea and had a war with China.</p>

<p>Racism towards african americans...that's probably because most of the black people here are mobsters from Nigeria who run the bars and get in gang-fights.</p>

45

<p>Lol Chinese ppl and korean ppl hate japanese ppl more than vice versa.</p>

46

<p>@ k&s: you call other people "ignorant", when really you're also sort of ignorant. Japanese pop culture sort of idolizes caucasian features and celebrities, and that translates into business and politics. The US has had a huge impact on Japan. And yes, anime does feature "caucasian" characteristics. Big eyes, prominent brow bone, curved noses, t&a (coming from an asian, it's just true). Ever wonder why getting the "double-lid" plastic eye surgery is insanely popular in Korea/Japan? </p>

<p>And if you think because asians treat someone well they like them, you really don't know anything about asian culture. lol</p>

<p>Granted a lot of asians accept whites more than blacks/hispanics, but they'd still be disappointed if they saw their daughter/son marry a white rather than another asian. Asian parents would even be disappointed if their kids married someone not of their specific ethnicity (i.e. Korean marrying Japanese). </p>

<p>Overall, every country is racist, but I feel comfortable saying that Korea and Japan are more racist than others. The ethnocentric nature of Japan is a huge part of their culture... it's sort of dumb to try and defend them from things that are true.</p>

<p>@ Narcissa:</p>

<p>Lol, QFT</p>

47

<p>UCLAri, being bigoted and being afraid of that which is not familiar to them is two different things. One is actual bigotry that must be corrected and the other is a self-defense instinct.</p>

<p>As for Citibank, my mom worked customer service there. She might have some validity....when the Japanese see Citi as "an outsider company" and Japanese are kind of suspicious of "outsiders", Citi won't get any clients.</p>

48

<p>Does any of you have any good Japanese friends whom you could ask this?</p>

49

<p>
[quote]
The point, however, is that this was an active form of discrimination that is less present in other societies.

[/quote]

Agreed. Like you don't see anything as explicit as this:
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xCeK0Trz9E0&feature=related%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xCeK0Trz9E0&feature=related&lt;/a>
Granted, maybe some of those signs are up because foreigners have more tendency to get into troubles over there. Not sure. I found the one that says:
[quote]
The following custmoers can't enter out pub. 1. Fillipinos or people from other countries; 2. The group of only foreigners" particularly interesting.

[/quote]
Why not just "no foreigners"? It's like they are making a point as to whom they don't want the most (in this case, Fillipinos). :rolleyes:</p>

<p>

The correct word is "resent". Many people would naturally feel the same if they are the victims and the aggressors seem to be happy to "massage" or even outright deny any wrong-doing (or at least perceived by the victims as such--let's not get into the discussion if and how they did apologize or not here). </p>

<p>Few years ago, I was with my friend and his bf at the time at a Korean restaurant in NYC. My friend's ex-bf was from Japan but he's actually half Korean. He'd only "come out" to a few people he trusted that he's half-Korean in Japan. Interestingly though, he appeared to be very demanding and agitated with the Korean waiters at the restaurant. I asked my friend later about his behavior and he said he's like that when he's at a Korean restaurant. ;)</p>

<p>One of my best friends in LA has a Japanese friend (not American-Japanese) whom my friend went to USC film school with. My friend and he would sometime go to this particular Chinese restaurant east of LA. My friend told me he would refuse to answer or talk to any of the waiters there. But then my friend said he dislikes Japanese (his own people) too!</p>

50

<p>This happens in every country of the world. Only in USA, where discrimination would mean constant civil wars and disorder, the discrimination cannot flourish.</p>

51

<p>
[quote]
This happens in every country of the world.

[/quote]

What does "this" refer to? You mean in England, you'd feel the need to hide that fact that you are, say, half Irish or half French? You mean there are signs that say "no XYZ or people from other countries foreigners" or anything like that posted on the doors of restaurants/pubs in China or Hong Kong (which I know it doesn't).</p>

52

<p>question:
when ever you are talking about World War II in class do people ever single you out and ask questions like, "what do you think about _______" simply because you are Japanese/People think you're Japanese?</p>

<p>i'm black and this sort of thing ALWAYS happens whenever we talk about African/African-American stuff. lol just wanted to see if Asians have a similar experience...</p>

53

<p>yeah the rape of nanjing was pretty bad and f***** up/hard to recover from</p>

54

<p>Hmm, i always wonder why we have required Holocaust education when most people don't even know what the rape of nanjing is...</p>

<p>dot dot dot</p>

55

<p>gkc4,</p>

<p>You're confusing the reasoning for the eyelid fold surgery to an extent. While there is an argument that it's to "caucasianize" the eyes, there is also significant evidence that the double eyelid was considered desirable long before Western influence.</p>

<p>futurenyustudent,</p>

<p>The line you describe is not always so clear. </p>

<p>As for Citibank, I'm afraid that you're still wrong. Regulation was the problem, not the name. The name, to this day, is still "Citibank" in Japan. The Japanese couldn't care less about English names-- if they did, none of their OWN businesses could flourish! Citibank had trouble, however, with the rather onerous regulations that Japanese banking was subject to prior to the "Big Bang" reforms in the 1990s. Their model did not work in Japan like it had in other countries.</p>

<p>The fact is that NO Japanese banks are really what we would call "successful" in recent years. I mean, look how far the IBJ has fallen since the 1970s and 80s.</p>

<p>Narcissa,</p>

<p>I don't mean to marginalize the atrocities in Korea or China at all, but I think it's a FAR greater crime how the Armenian Genocide gets even LESS discussion in American schools than the Rape of Nanjing. While I obviously believe that Nanjing is under-discussed, at least it is at least somewhat present in academic and popular discourse. Armenian Genocide? Not at all.</p>

56

<p>


</p>

<p>Even if it was popular before western influence, there is no doubt that Asians admire the caucasian double-eyelid. It makes your eyes appear bigger, and that's what they really want. Now, they associate big eyes=caucasian=pretty, regardless of what it was before.</p>

57

<p>Hmmm... but isn't that more a matter of aesthetic taste rather than racism?</p>

<p>I mean, also all Europeans go and have a sun tan so that they get darker skin...</p>

58

<p>
[quote]
Even if it was popular before western influence, there is no doubt that Asians admire the caucasian double-eyelid. It makes your eyes appear bigger, and that's what they really want. Now, they associate big eyes=caucasian=pretty, regardless of what it was before.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Have to differentiate btwn Asians in Asia and Asian-Americans and other Asians in the West.</p>

<p>About 60% of SE Asians and 40% of NE Asians have natural double eyelids (which is different from the Caucasian double-eyelid).</p>

<p>In Asia – women want to look like the Asian female celebs (who generally have natural double eyelids) – while in the US (and other places) Asian-American women often undergo the surgery b/c they mistakenly think it makes them look more “white” (due to the limited and often stereotypical portrayal of Asians).</p>

<p>
[quote]
I mean, also all Europeans go and have a sun tan so that they get darker skin...

[/quote]
</p>

<p>The whole tanning thing has to do w/ socio-economic class. Asians (particularly the women) still generally regard pale skin as showing higher social class – while Europeans (and Americans) have abandoned powdering their faces since (due to work place having shifted indoors from the fields) getting a tan was seen as a sign of living the life of privilege.</p>

<p>Nonetheless, there is a bias against people w/ naturally darker skin pretty much all over the world (South/Central America to East Asia to South Asia to Europe, etc.)</p>

<p>
[quote]
k&s,</p>

<p>It isn't? So when an Arab is sitting on an airplane and every other passenger is staring at him, glaring, and whispering to each other about his presence, that's not discrimination?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>UCLA – the situation you use here is quite **different<a href="glaring%20due%20to%20%5Bb%5Dsuspicion%5B/b%5D%20of%20ill-intent%20as%20opposed%20to%20just%20natural%20%5Bb%5Dcuriosity%5B/b%5D">/b</a>.</p>

<p>I'm not saying that there also isn't the former directed at white expats in Japan (but the same also applies to Chinese or Korean nationals visiting Japan as well).</p>

<p>
[quote]
That's what you get in Japan, except that it's supposedly "benign." To be honest, I don't often side with Debito Arudo on his pet issues, but he is right on one thing: Japan is EXCEPTIONALLY closed when it comes to non-natives. Even those who naturalize face a lifetime of discrimination.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Right – but they are like that to ALL foreigners (albeit w/ a distinct hierarchy in treatment – whites generally at the top - with East Asians, South Asians/Arabs and blacks following).</p>

<p>
[quote]
i grew up in asia.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>That doesn’t mean that you aren't ignorant about this issue.</p>

<p>Yeah, the Chinese, Koreans, Japanese, etc. have a lot of "national pride" – but at the same time, they will usually treat a white person better than an Asian person from another country (there isn't a belief that all Asians are "superior").</p>

<p>
[quote]
Lol Chinese ppl and korean ppl hate japanese ppl more than vice versa.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Uhh, that’s due to Japan’s past aggressions against China and Korea and Japan’s failure to own up to it like Germany has done to its neighbors and to the Jews.</p>

<p>Nonetheless, Japan has a history of discrimination against the Chinese and Koreans (not to mention their own indigenous people such as the Ainu) – even against those whose families were forcibly moved to Japan as forced labor.</p>

<p>
[quote]
@ k&s: you call other people "ignorant", when really you're also sort of ignorant. Japanese pop culture sort of idolizes caucasian features and celebrities, and that translates into business and politics. The US has had a huge impact on Japan. And yes, anime does feature "caucasian" characteristics. Big eyes, prominent brow bone, curved noses, t&a (coming from an asian, it's just true). Ever wonder why getting the "double-lid" plastic eye surgery is insanely popular in Korea/Japan?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>How am I "ignorant" when I am already well aware of the use of white American celebs in Japan?</p>

<p>It seems your ignorance has come to the forefront upon making superficial assumptions about these this topic.</p>

<p>Japan has increasingly used Korean celebs in commercials/advertisements - does that mean that Japan idolizes "Korean features" (besides, the use of American celebs has been declining since its heyday in the '90s)?</p>

<p>Again - women in Asia get double-eyelid surgery to look like their favorite female Asian celeb (usually bringing in a photo of the celeb w/ the facial feature they would like to emulate).</p>

<p>And no - (once again) anime did not originate depicting Caucasian characteristics - but rather the "cutesy look" originated by Disney (as seen in his depiction of animal characters).</p>

59

<p>
[quote]
UCLA – the situation you use here is quite different (glaring due to suspicion of ill-intent as opposed to just natural curiosity).

[/quote]
</p>

<p>k&s,</p>

<p>I'd be inclined to agree with you if it weren't for the ubiquitousness of mistreatment of foreigners in Japan. If it weren't all too common to see manga going out of their way to talk about how foreigners bring wild germs, crime, and degradation of the Japanese lifestyle. If the "curiosity" weren't steeped in stereotypes of foreigners as abject criminals and a danger to self and country.</p>

<p>The depictions of foreigners in Japan are very very often bigoted rather than simply naive. Just look at the works of Debito and the rest of the naturalized community. Just look at the very common articles on foreigner transgressions in conservative papers like the Yomiuri. Just look at official statements made by police about how foreigners are the source of crime in cities.</p>

<p>Just ask the Japanese themselves. They'll even tell you that it's "sabetsu" (discrimination.)</p>

<p>I hate to appeal to authority and experience, but I can't help but do so... This is NOT a case of curiosity. Anyone who reads this news on a regular basis-- and I don't blame you or anyone else for not doing so-- knows how less-than-innocent this all is.</p>

<p>
[quote]
In Asia – women want to look like the Asian female celebs (who generally have natural double eyelids) – while in the US (and other places) Asian-American women often undergo the surgery b/c they mistakenly think it makes them look more “white” (due to the limited and often stereotypical portrayal of Asians).

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Do you have evidence for this?</p>

<p>
[quote]
Even if it was popular before western influence, there is no doubt that Asians admire the caucasian double-eyelid. It makes your eyes appear bigger, and that's what they really want. Now, they associate big eyes=caucasian=pretty, regardless of what it was before.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Evidence? I've seen arguments go both ways.</p>