@Isichitiu my daughter and I were searching for schools last year and so we’ve toured more than a few of them. It’s exhausting but it will pay off in the end!
She applied to 10 schools (a mix of art schools and universities with strong art programs) and waited for the acceptances to see what kind of offers she would receive. Most gave good merit aid, but some were just more generous than others. In the end, it was the accepted student days that convinced her of what she wanted. She chose Tyler at Temple U based on the impressive faculty and facilities and the campus vibe and the city life. If you haven’t visited, you may want to add it to the list. It was honestly not even on our radar until we attended NPD and learned more about it. I believe their sculpture program is quite good, but you’d have to judge for yourself since my daughter is focused on graphic design.
Others she applied to/toured/considered: Pratt, RISD, VCU, NHIA, MICA, CalArts, OTIS, RIT, University of the Arts and Hartford Art School
just a note of interest. at VCUARTS the highly ranked sculpture department (#1 as per USNWR) BOTH graduate and undergraduate use the same facilities and instructors .
There are no established rankings for undergraduate art schools. Stones3 has consistently, in the face of correction by dozens of responsible cc members, cited rankings for VCU graduate art programs when discussing undergraduate art programs. Ridiculously, again in the face of numerous corrections, stones3 also persists in the wholly unsubstantiated claim that because there is/may be an overlap between graduate and undergraduate professors at VCU, that this makes ratings for the school’s graduate program applicable to its undergrad. Hogwash.
@stones3 will insist otherwise but graduate school fine arts rankings are not very helpful when looking for BFA programs.
We found talking to the faculty and students at the accepted students days was key to her decision. Plus the merit aid made a big difference. Temple gave her great aid, VCU gave her practically nothing. Pratt gave her loads but she didn’t like the vibe there. NHIA kept offering her more money as we got closer to decision day.
So my suggestion is apply to as many as you can handle and wait for the merit aid letters. Pratt sent hers with the early decision in December. Temple sent it a few weeks later. And you do have until May 1 to officially commit.
may I weight in? with 100% certainty the grad school rankings(as there aren’t any undergrade usnwr rankings) are absolutely applicable and important. I have stated a number of times now that the grad and undergrade use many of the same facilities and same faculty! Any reasonable person would make the connection, but go visit and see for yourself. It is a top notch facility, great town and diverse friendly student pop. Most importantly its highly successful in the recruiting department. . Other schools like RISD, Pratt, Mica etc are also highly rated some are in fact highly rated grad programs does that disqualify them? of course not, its a plus.
Our D had many opportunities to choose from and decided (with just a little merit /acadmic scholarship) to attend VCU from OOS - and loves it. PS many of the vcuarts students are OOS , unlike the overall VCU pop. and its nice that even paying OOS its 2/3 the cost some other schools not as highly ranked. Good luck to all.
Instead of creating one’s own reality, we should really be talking about facts; documented, empirical data upon which parents and students such as the OP can make well-informed decisions.
There is no data to show by any stretch that highly ranked grad programs impact the quality of undergraduate programs. The fact of the matter is that the VCU Arts graduate program is quite small with only about 180 students. In any case, this is purely speculation on the part of the poster claiming such a correlation.
However, in terms of opportunities both while at school and post-graduation, student:faculty ratio and postgraduate job placement are very important. It is interesting to note that nearly every school on the OP’s list of potentials for his/her daughter have about 50% of the student:faculty ratio of VCU Arts. While the latter is at 17:1, schools such as RISD, Pratt, MICA, CCA, KCAI, and Cooper Union are all under 10:1. MCAD and SAIC are close at 11:1. Tyler at Temple University is below 14:1.
As far as job placement (most schools provide their hardest numbers within a year post-grad), VCU hovers around 80%. This is in marked contrast with other schools on the OP’s list including RISD at a staggering 96%, and Pratt also in the 90’s for postgraduate job placement.
Another totally made up “factoid” is the wholly unfounded speculation that there are more OOS students at VCU Arts as opposed to the larger VCU community. This is total bs. There is only one application to VCU with no separate application for the Art school. VCU as a whole consists of 87% in-state students. So roughly 9 of 10 students are Virginia residence. To the extent to which the school is required under Virginia State law (in return for State funding and other benefits) to maintain a certain percentage of in-state resident students, it is simply not plausible that VCU carves out an exception to this percentage, stocking the Art program with OOS students. This would have also have the effect of ballooning the in-state population in other disciplines. VCU Arts only has 2700 students. Without falling too far foul of VCU in-state student requirements, how many OOS students can there reasonably be? If there are 25% OOS, double the percentage of the larger college, there would be 675 OOS students.
VCUarts Sculpture has been the top-ranked Sculpture M.F.A. program for over a decade and attracts students from around the globe who are drawn by its state-of-the-art facilities, generous financial support, reputation of its celebrated faculty, and the ever-increasing visibility of its alumni. Obviously , by ANY measure the top program in the nation.
VCUarts is widely recognized as one of the nation’s great schools of the arts and design, with more than 3,000 students from 35 countries and 39 states. ___FACT!!!
Here, artists become part of a thriving community, collaborating with faculty members known across the world. Visiting professors bring real-world guidance and insight into the learning experience. And students are able to reach across disciplines, to work on projects that fuse interests to solve problems.
So a graphic design student might work on a special education project. Fashion designers might join forces with VCU Medical Center. Sculpture students might help create a new bike rack design. The journey is up to you, and the possibilities are unlimited.
Ten VCU School of the Arts professors and alumni have received Guggenheim Fellowships since 2002, including two faculty recipients in 2012 — one of the highest totals of any university in the nation
You forgot the source-attribution and copyright credits…
"VCUarts is widely recognized as one of the nation’s great schools of the arts and design, with more than 3,000 students from 35 countries and 39 states.
Here, artists become part of a thriving community, collaborating with faculty members known across the world. Visiting professors bring real-world guidance and insight into the learning experience. And students are able to reach across disciplines, to work on projects that fuse interests to solve problems.
So a graphic design student might work on a special education project. Fashion designers might join forces with VCU Medical Center. Sculpture students might help create a new bike rack design. The journey is up to you, and the possibilities are unlimited."
“Ten VCU School of the Arts professors and alumni have received Guggenheim Fellowships since 2002, including two faculty recipients in 2012 — one of the highest totals of any university in the nation.”
VCUarts is widely recognized as one of the nation’s great schools of the arts and design, with more than 3,000 students from 35 countries and 39 states. ___FACT!!!
debunking ANYONE suggesting otherwise about the diversity of the art school. If not, then who are all these OOS kids
I’ve met while visiting our D. LOL. Anyone interested in actual factual and first hand experience feel free to private message me I will help if I can.
VCU Arts freshman class for 2016 is approximately 660 students. About 575 of these are from Virginia. That leaves 85 students, roughly one from each State in the US + 1 student each from the 39 countries outside the US to which you and VCU Arts statistics refer.
If you expand to the entire VCU Arts school, there are 2,885 undergraduate students (the 3,000 number to which you refer includes the 180 graduate students reported by the school). Approximately 2,510 undergrads are from Virginia, leaving 375 OOS students.
Projecting from the freshman class to the entire VCUArts school (4x to account for the upper classes), 1 from each State in the US (200 students) + 4 from each of 39 countries outside the US (156) = 356. Quite close to the 375 OOS students the school’s own statistics report. Plenty of OOS kids for you to meet while on campus.
one of the problems with this site is the IGNORE feature doesn’t kick in until you sign in . So unfortunately I’ve been sucked into reading the one person who has the esteemed pleasure of being on my ignored list (and rest assured that’s where they are staying) BTW just one thing , is it just maybe possible that there are more than one OOS kids from the same state? Whatcha think? Might explain the home state club our D is in for art student freshman to meet
others from their home state…Oh no…what just happened. Debunked again. Its a great art school , you don’t have to agree but almost everyone else in the industry does. #2 ranked with UCLA !
Of course there are more than 1 student from individual States. Remember, my projections assume at least 1 student from each of the 50 States. As you cite, UVA Arts only reports students from 39 states. So if there are approximately 375 OOS students (VCU Arts reported numbers, not mine) and as many as 2 from each of the 39 foreign countries (some more, some less), there could be upwards of 8 or even more students from any one of the 39 States reported by the school.
Btw, there is no shame in attending a school with a high percentage of in-State students. Many of us (my daughter included) do so for economic and other reasons. The shame is in misrepresenting facts and data while randomly championing a particular school even in the face of empirical evidence to the contrary, and even if the information has no relation to the OP and/or is carried to such an extreme so as to render the opinion and the information worthless.
“shame” ??? where do you get off? VCUARTS #2 ranked art and design school in the united states along with UCLA and behind Yale. #1 ranked public art and design school in all of America. Fact as ranked by USNWR best grad programs in America. And I can see why you have such a difficult time with this as it doesn’t conform to YOUR view but then again I’ll take a peer ranking over your view any day. As for your foolish account of OOS vs ISS , your
arguments don’t hold any water and you leave out any proof. At least I am talking from personal experience and in fact most of the kids I have met at the artist colony are OOS . Just a fact. But its really neither here or there and in no uncertain terms should anyone choose a school based on how many OOS or ISS it has. That would be foolish.
Rather look at the depth of its course offerings, facilities, rankings (yes I said rankings), cost, ROI and for goodness sake go see the school in session over a couple of days. BTW there is no shame in attending any of the top ranked schools, for anyone.
Your back must be in a perpetual state of fracture due to your absurd bending over backwards to justify your choice of schools. You interject pitches, backed with all manner of distorted, inaccurate and plain false statements, regardless of relevance to the thread or to posters. It is due to this extreme overjustification that I made my statement regarding attendance at OOS public colleges. There is definitely a stigma for many parents and students in connection with in-state schools as well as at OOS public schools made up of predominantly in-state students. Otherwise, why the urgency on your part to inaccurately cite the abundance of OOS students? Of course you are doing this, however inaccurately, to bolster what you perceive as a lacking at VCU Arts.
And, of course, you once again cite and champion GRADUATE school rankings. Don’t you get ever get tired of citing these irrelevant stats and then justifying them through all manner of tortured rationalizations? There are NO generally accepted rankings for dedicated art school UNDERGRADUATE schools.
Am curious though (as I think this goes toward your irrationality in this area) as what exactly you think my “view” is? What exactly are you talking about? Seriously, doubt you will post a cogent, let alone accurate answer.
My calculations of the number of OOS students are based on the numbers and percentages provided by VCU Arts (and, ironically, by you). It is straightforward math and quite dispositive. Approximately 9 of every 10 VCU Arts student are OOS. This is not in conflict with anything you have posted about your personal experiences. There may still be a significant number of OOS, certainly in excess of 375 or so. There are also international students added to the mix. Your opinions regarding the proportion of OOS students is totally anecdotal, e.g., who you met while you were visiting the school. But more, your opinions do not disprove the facts based on the statistics provided by the school itself as well as by you.
Again, while it may be “foolish” in your estimation to select a school based on public vs. private or based on the proportion of OOS to in-state, the FACT is that many parents and students make such a calculation. I don’t find this foolish at all and can cite many valid reasons, both personal, academic, social and otherwise, as to why people might make such a choice based on such factors.
I feel much better now that we have mutually reassured each other about our choice of schools.
