Assessing individual states' university systems..

College Search & Selection
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<p>Here's a map I made on Facebook of the top-half of states when it comes to the quality of the university system (marked red). The states not marked red have improvement to do. Obviously states like SD and ND aren't going to be competitive with states like CA and TX, and I know for a fact that ND does an awesome job with their university system for what they have, they're just at a natural disadvantage. That doesn't mean other rural states like Kansas and Iowa aren't competitive with CA and TX..they definitely are.</p>

<p><a href="http://chart.apis.google.com/chart?cht=t&chs=440x220&chtm=usa&chf=bg,s,336699&chco=d0d0d0,cc0000&chd=s:9999999999999999999999999&chld=ALARAZCACOFLGAKSIAINILNCMDMIMOTXWICTMNWAVAOKOHPASC%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://chart.apis.google.com/chart?cht=t&chs=440x220&chtm=usa&chf=bg,s,336699&chco=d0d0d0,cc0000&chd=s:9999999999999999999999999&chld=ALARAZCACOFLGAKSIAINILNCMDMIMOTXWICTMNWAVAOKOHPASC&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>California
Props: Excellent comprehensive system with many great schools, all among the nation's best public universities, and other large comprehensive campuses that make quality education accessible to everyone who wants one.
Cons: nothing</p>

<p>Texas
Props: Top-notch flagships, and some pretty good Tier 3 schools, as well such as Texas Tech, UTD, UTEP, UTA, A&MC, etc etc..makes education available and affordable to everyone who wants it. Probably the best graduate programs of any state system (Texas Medical Center).
Cons: The top 10% rule doesn't give UT and A&M much room to recruit top students on their own and prevent OOS applicants for the most part</p>

<p>Illinois
Props: International exchange + quality of the Urbana Champagne campus, as well as other large UI campuses spread across the state
Cons: The only "great" school is UIUC</p>

<p>Florida
Props: Quality of UF and FSU + other huge schools..the size of UCF (50,000) and USF (35,000). Dominant over private schools in-state.
Cons: The college towns leave much to be desired</p>

<p>Georgia
Props: One of the south's best systems, UGA and GT are top-notch, while GSU and others offer affordable and easily accessible education to the masses. Schools are attractive for OOS students.
Cons: None, really</p>

<p>Alabama
Props: Seriously underrated schools (Bama and Auburn). Auburn is competitive with other state flagships. Both are tops for tradition. In-state schools offer affordable education to economically depressed areas of Alabama.
Cons: None, but I don't know too much about Alabama to critique</p>

<p>South Carolina
Props: Features a premier state flagship (Clemson) with many top-notch programs and several other good state schools, such as USC. Clemson is very attractive to OOS students.
Cons: Some of the smallest endowments among flagship universities</p>

<p>North Carolina
Props: UNC, NC State..nuff said. Many don't realize that UNC also has good campuses in Charlotte and Greensboro.
Cons: None really</p>

<p>Virginia
Props: Large array of top-notch schools, like UVA, VT, W&M, Old Dominion, VCU, VMI, W&M, and so on..
Cons: Seems like schools may either be difficult for average students to get into or undesirable for them to attend. Not sure if VCU is a desirable alternative to not getting into UVA considering its office park-like campus.</p>

<p>Arkansas
Props: Donations from Walton family and others have made UA pretty good, a stellar flagship with many top-notch programs
Cons: Anything beyond UA's Fayetteville campus aren't going to be competitive with other universities</p>

<p>Oklahoma
Props: Good flagships (OSU/OU) with some top-notch programs and some decent tertiary campuses, very desirable to OOS students. Huge endowments.
Cons: Too many tertiary public colleges (closing some campuses and moving students to other campuses would be a good idea). Flagships are better known for their athletic prowess than their academic programs.</p>

<p>Kansas
Props: Flagships are good (KU/KSU) and somehow they made their system of mundane community colleges work. The community college system is rich recruiting grounds for transfer students and D-1A athletic programs..somehow Kansas made something work while other states are struggling to make the community college system something other than a money drain.
Cons: Awful financial aid make it almost not worth the applicant's time if he/she has other options to consider</p>

<p>Missouri
Props: Good flagship with top-notch programs (Mizzou) and system of tertiary campuses has good alternatives, like UMKC
Cons: None that I can think of</p>

<p>Iowa
Props: Excellent system of flagships for a small state, and attractive to OOS applicants. Great endowments.
Cons: None that I can think of</p>

<p>Minnesota
Props: Affordability of a top-notch education at UMN
Cons: Beyond UMN-Twin Cities, there aren't really any desirable schools</p>

<p>Wisconsin
Props: Madison campus is Public Ivy-material
Cons: Beyond the Madison campus, the system goes downhill</p>

<p>Michigan
Props: Michigan is possibly the best public in the nation (either it or Cal, it's debatable) yet MSU is also excellent, and there are other good schools, too
Cons: Serious bias against OOS applicants makes it not worth someone's time</p>

<p>Pennsylvania
Props: Good flagships with Pitt and PSU. Temple is a good alternative for Philly-area students
Cons: Overcrowding at PSU and the unnecessary bulk of the tertiary college system</p>

<p>Connecticut
Props: UConn is good
Cons: UConn is better known for its party scene and athletic prowess, and beyond UConn, the system goes downhill</p>

<p>Ohio
Props: Good flagships..much better than their reputations might indicate. Miami and Ohio are beautiful campuses.
Cons: Ohio State might be better known for its athletic programs, and Ohio and Miami both are far better known for their Greek scenes</p>

<p>Indiana
Props: Good flagships. IU's well-known bucolic campus and Purdue's engineering prowess. ISU is a good affordable alternative for average students.
Cons: None really</p>

<p>Maryland
Props: UMD-College Park is tough to beat.
Cons: System is overshadowed by private schools in the Mid-Atlantic region..makes getting top students difficult (similarly to all of the states north of Maryland which did not make the cut).</p>

<p>Washington
Props: Great system of flagships (UW-Seattle + WSU-Pullman) combined with an ample number of tertiary campuses for average students
Cons: None that I can think of</p>

<p>Colorado
Props: Good flagship with the Boulder campus, CSU and School of Mines are also very competitive.
Cons: None that I can think of</p>

<p>Arizona
Props: Good solid flagships
Cons: Arizona lacks an "amazing" flagship with top-notch programs, but overall, the system is very solid.</p>

<p>Things I considered: States with multiple highly desirable university campuses, the quality of a state system beyond the flagships, accessibility of the universities (do they only let top 10% in, or are they flexible in what they consider the best applicants, are the schools affordable, etc), and how well-funded the schools are.</p>

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Cons: The top 10% rule doesn’t give UT and A&M much room to recruit top students on their own and prevent OOS applicants for the most part

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<p>This is one of the biggest misconceptions about the top 10% law wrt to OOS. Texas is required by state law to insure at least 90% of undergrads are from in-state - a law which predates the top 10% law. It is true, however, that the top 10% law just makes it that much harder to fill the remaining 10% with OOS.</p>

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<p>Good point I forgot. OK, add getting rid of that law as well to my list of cons.</p>

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<p>Con for Alabama</p>

<p>UofAlabama lets in everyone that applies.</p>

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<p>Correction: University of South Carolina is the state’s flagship technically, not Clemson.</p>

<p>Con for Georgia: Beyond UGA and GT, the state university system is pretty sub-par.</p>

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<p>Clemson is the better school in SC.</p>

<p>The point is obviously beyond GT and UGA the rest are subpar because they are supposed to be. Every state is like that. The ones I brought up have (for the most part) two good flagships that are superior and attract the top students of that state, and then beyond that…schools that everyone can get into. Georgia State does a great job of doing that, and has a lot of prominent alumni, including Ludacris.</p>

<p>GSU isn’t a school that I’d kill myself if I had to go to, it is just one where I wouldn’t be fulfilling any of my potential.</p>

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<p>Con for Maryland: [Similar to Knights09’s statement about Georgia] Beyond UMD-College Park, the state university system is very sub-par. And the privates aren’t much better (except for Johns Hopkins and the US Naval Academy in Annapolis)</p>

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<p>lol @ Ludacris as a ‘prominent alumni’ of GSU. I can’t really picture anybody going there because LUDA did.</p>

<p>A bit more on topic, I’d rank the top few states as follows</p>

<p>California
Virginia
Michigan
North Carolina
Wisconsin
Texas
Florida
Washington</p>

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<p>Yeah I live in Washington and I have to say beyond the University of Washingtin (UW or “U-Dub”) there really aren’t much worth noting, I wouldn’t say it’s a great system</p>

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<p>Yeah I don’t know about bigp’s post. I would have to change it up…</p>

<p>1 California
2 Virginia
3 Texas
4 North Carolina
5 Florida
6 Iowa
7 Ohio
8 Georgia
9 Michigan
10 Pennsylvania</p>

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<p>^^^^^You are joking with Michigan having the 9th best public university system in the country right? You seem to hold it against Michigan that they don’t give much financial aid to OOS students. Look at most of the other top states in that list. How many of them allow their tops schools to have 1/3 OOS enrollment?</p>

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<p>What happened to NY and the SUNY system? Its well rounded with Binghamton at the helm, a very solid school that’s getting better.</p>

<p>How about New Jersey with Rutgers and TCNJ? Two very solid schools.</p>

<p>Finally, how about Delaware? UDel may be the only good notable school, but Delaware is also puny. There isn’t any other public school besides Delaware State, a respectable historically black institution.</p>

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<p>Well, given that the purpose of a state university is to educate primarily those who live within the state’s borders, I don’t think OOS enrollment has too much of a bearing on the overall quality of a given state’s university system.</p>

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<p>One con all of these state university systems face right now is money and funding. Dependence on state funding in today’s economy is dragging down or at least creating enormous challenges for each state university system. </p>

<p>What is going to distinguish one state system from another now and in future is the ability to deal with social change and the new fiscal challenges.</p>

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<p>Did you just say that Iowa has a better public school system than Michigan? That’s just idiotic.</p>

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<p>No I’m not. Mich is obviously stellar and I’ve never said anything bad about it, and MSU is still one of the better state schools. But beyond that…CMU and WMU are marginally notable, and Michigan is a BIG state, too. Around 20 electoral college votes I believe.</p>

<p>Iowa on the other hand has Iowa, which is almost as good as Mich and probably the best writing school, and ISU which is equal to MSU…as well as other large state schools, such as Northern Iowa. I’m impressed by the quality of Iowa’s educational system compared to other states, especially considering their size. No matter what you think, it’s impressive for a small state to have a premier educational system. Iowa spends more on education per capita than any other state and I believe their state motto is about education. They have the nation’s top graduation rate and I think top 4 for ACT scores. Plus it is where the ACT is headquartered. So yes…Iowa has a better system than Michigan, and that’s not idiotic.</p>

<p>Michigan is still one of the best in the nation, obviously. It’s just that Iowa is actually one of the nation’s most progressive states, and not just in education, but that’s obviously the best example.</p>

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<p>Yeah I thought it was funny too. Imagine my parents’ reaction if I told them I wanna go to Luda’s alma mater…</p>

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<p>For agriculture and engineering maybe. For everything else, it’s either USC or CofC (forgot to mention them by the way - College of Charleston has the highest SAT scores of any public uni in SC).</p>

<p>Good point about most states being like this, I guess I just get frustrated when I see states like VA and CA that have tons of great public school options. If I ended up at Georgia State, I would transfer as soon as I could. It’s struggling to get out of its’ commuter school image, and I think that negatively impacts the school.</p>

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<p>You don’t offer satisfactory information about your methodology. How are you measuring the “quality” of these schools?</p>

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<p>I laughed out loud.</p>

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<p>^^^^^^Not to mention Florida and Ohio…</p>