I think the difference is that, as @Donadminstrator points out, an Ivy Likely Letter has the same force as a letter of admission. It is a letter saying you WILL receive admission when the letters come. “Likely” is sort of the wrong word in that sense. So I think the level of certainty/confidence is or should be as high with that letter in hand as the actual acceptance letter.
Whereas with NESCAC schools there is still an element of something-could-go-wrong, even if the chances are near zero, until the acceptance is final. Or at least that’s my impression as a person without a lot of NESCAC experience.
But in the end I agree the NESCAC recruits are highly likely to sail through with support also.
If a NESCAC athlete has been offered a supported “slot,” then chances of admission are fairly decent if they passed the pre-read and maintained the same or better grades and rigor of classes they had at that point. However, one has to be very careful to understand what was offered. Not all recruited athletes will be offered a slot (these are typically saved for the top recruits). They might be offered a spot on the team if they are admitted, but this is not a “slot.” A quick Google search on NESCAC recruiting can help to provide further insight on the process. Remember, no NESCAC coach can promise or offer guaranteed admission. Even slotted athletes sometimes do not get admitted.
Xc and track. Not worried about burning any bridges here — what are they going to do, yank his offer?
At the end of the day it’s a business. We get it. What I think coaches don’t always get is that they aren’t just moving pieces around on a chess board. These are human beings, who have often sacrificed any semblance of a normal adolescence just to get to this moment. Treat them with the dignity they deserve.
I’m just glad our younger son isn’t an athlete so we won’t have to do this dance again.
because an LL (1st Oct) pre-dates the submission of an ED application, the applicant who is promised an LL but fails to receive it still has time to correct ship, reinstate dialogue with other coaches, and apply ED (~1 Nov) at another school with strong coach support (NESCAC) or with an LL issue slightly later. at least he doesn’t waste his ED bullet on a school that’s not going to want him
This is where transparency comes into play between the coach and recruit. The recruit can definitely ask the coach where they fall on the recruiting list and if they are being offered a slot vs a tip vs nothing other than a spot if they get in.
my D24 may not be an exception. following your exact timeline, the ED application would be completed and submitted in September, and there would be a call to the coach upon not receiving an LL in early October. The coach can then re-check with admission, and if admission confirms that no LL is being issued despite strong coach support/positive pre-read, then the candidate is entitled to switch the application from ED to EA/RD. Even though time is very tight, the athlete can then restore contact with other coaches and apply ED somewhere else with strong coach support.
The timing my son experienced was a little different from what @skieurope experienced, but the overall process was the same.
Long recruiting process, including emails, texts, phone calls and unofficial visits.
Official visits offered
Official visits taken
Coach(es) offered support
Athlete commits to the application process to one school.
Athlete submits full application EA or ED (depending on the school)
Athlete sweats it out
Athlete recieves likely letter from admissions
Athlete recieves official acceptance.
The likely letter shortens the “sweats it out” phase, but doesnt remove the leap of faith. If things didn’t work out, there wouldn’t have been an opportunity to apply early to another school. My son had some fall back plans who knew they were second-tier choices and were good with that.
@Crosbylane, In my experience with NESCACs, the answer is no, the coach doesn’t “know.” I specifically asked coaches, and two different coaches at different schools said that they did not know. One NESCAC coach told the recruited athletes to inform the coach as to the admissions decision, noting that “things have happened in the past.” To me, that strongly suggests that they do not know.
That said, certainly the coaches know more than the recruits as to what was said in a pre-read, where he/she placed on the list, and the thinking of the adcom. But, since the admissions decision is is between the applicant and admissions, I would say that the coach is not informed by admissions of the final official decision.
The likely letter shortens the “sweats it out” , but doesnt remove the leap of faith.
Blockquote
This. Nobody is going out on a limb until the application is submitted. And once you have submitted, you should tell other coaches you have done so. Sure, you can tell them you want to keep the door open just in case, but they are moving on without you. You may get lucky if you don’t get that LL, but you don’t know. But really, at some point, you have to decide whether you trust the process and the coaches youare dealing with.
Everyone who isn’t a recruited athlete resents the boost the athletes get in admissions. People who know the system recognize that they move to the front of the line, but only after a long, arduous, and stressful game of musical chairs.
At most highly rejective schools, there is a relatively small chance that the pre-read is in error and the coach’s support/slot is not enough. Whether admissions offers a likely letter or you have to wait for the official acceptance letter doesn’t change this probability, just the timing of getting a yes. Coaches want to use their slots to get recruits in, not to get applications. A precious slot that is used for a recruit who doesn’t get in is a big loss for the coach (certainly the athlete, too).
An equal loss for the coach is a student athlete who uses a slot to get in, but chooses not to compete. At Ivys and DIII, all the coaches have to entice an athlete is help with admissions. Once someone uses a slot, the coach has no leverage. Ivy coaches that I know (multiple schools, multiple sports) have gotten remarkably good at sensing student athletes who aren’t committed to being great at their sport. Fit matters, and if there isnt a sense of comitment, there won’t be an offer.
My sense is that the biggest risk to your D during the recruiting process is that your need to hedge your bets will send a sign that your D has a lack of commitment to the school. It might be subtle, but coaches pick up on it. Either you trust the coach or you don’t. If you don’t trust the coach during the recruiting process, don’t trust the coach with your kid throughout college and move on.
You want your D to get into a good school and participate in a sport she loves. Ideally, this gets buttoned up early, but if it takes a little longer, that’s ok. You might be risk averse, but know that coaches are, too.
For this to happen, the coach has to make an offer in September. Lots of offers don’t go out until October, sometimes to accommodate visits, sometimes because the coach is still deciding, sometimes because the coach is new and on and on. Some offers don’t go out until even later than October.
True, but NLI signing is basically continuous for most sports now (between Nov and Aug, with exceptions for football and bkball) and signing an NLI does not guarantee admission. It would be interesting to see what proportion of NLIs are signed first day, first month, etc!
An athlete can only sign one NLI. The earliest for that is mid Nov. so you can’t ‘secure’ a bunch of them. They don’t even print them up until right before you sign as they are dated and you have to sign within a few days (48 hours? 72 hours? I don’t remember, but daughter’s coach needed to know WHEN she could sign, it came in overnight mail, and we had to send it back by overnight mail). It came without her whole name on it and we couldn’t change anything on the NLI or it was void, so she signed her name and left the printed part incorrect. It comes from the athletic department with an offer of a scholarship. It is NOT a guarantee of admission but if the student is not admitted, the NLI is void and then the student can sign another NLI. All the NLI provides is the agreement that the student will play for that school and get a scholarship. If the student decides not to go to that school, he can go to another but just can’t play the sport for a one year waiting period…except now that student can enter the transfer portal. Before the NLI is signed, the offers are just verbal offers and either side can walk away. The athletic department can’t make admissions admit the student, the coach can’t make the student sign the NLI. Verbal agreements aren’t enforceable.
No NLI for Div 3 schools or schools that don’t offer athletic scholarships (military academies, Ivies). A student who signed an NLI can switch to one of those schools without waiting out a year (and don’t think they don’t bring that up when they are trying to ‘steal’ you from your commitment).
I bet there are fewer signed immediately now because signing is continuous. It uses to be for only a week in Nov and then opened again in April. Football and basketball used to be in Feb but now has an early period too, so maybe those football and basketball signing make it seem like everyone is signing on Day 1.
My daughter did sign on the first day in Nov but didn’t have her hs celebration until April just because she wanted to be with all her friends. I think only 4 of the rowers did a signing ceremony in the fall and all the other kids waited until April for the party. A neighboring school just spread the celebrations out from Nov to May, so a lot of the kids who signed in Nov seemed like they signed in March or April.
Thanks. My assumption is that coaches don’t officially know as well, but I wondered if admissions may give a coach a ‘heads up’ if something wasn’t looking good. If a coach has a good relationship with admissions, and gives their list of supported athletes to them, tells the recruits when everything is all set with their application, it would really stink for the coach to be “surprised” with a rejection for an applicant with no warning from admissions. Again, I know that is probably a small percentage of cases after a NESCAC offer, but as we know, it does happen.
