<p>Well, my daughter has presented me with a car decal that has both names on it- BARNARD COLLEGE in big letters on the TOP; COLUMBIA UNIVERSITY in smaller letters on the bottom. And that's just the way I like it ... so the sticker will be displayed proudly for the next four years. (I mean, its not as if we are ashamed of Columbia and need to hide it now, is it?)</p>
<p>This is true. She should write Barnard College, Columbia University on her resume because Barnard is affilliated with Columbia University. Barnard writes Columbia University on almost all of their marketing materials, brochures ect, and is proud of that affilliation.</p>
<p>I may be a little biased because I see a significant proportion of Columbia's value proposition to be in its signalling of quality. The rigorous screening process of admissions (as subjective and sometimes random as we CCers know it can be) is objective enough to be a standard that helps open doors for us. </p>
<p>When that signal becomes diluted, when more noise is introduced, the value is diminished. That is undeniable. </p>
<p>This matters most for the marginal Columbia student - good but not that good - who has to count substantially on signalling (rather than say, innate quality or alternatives) to get the edge. Columbia2002, I'm sorry buddy but it sounds like you're this guy =) just kidding. That marginal student is probably me: not that bright, not that charming, not that hardworking... whatever.</p>
<p>But it matters for Barnard students across the board as well. I would think that on a macro-level, they do not want to devalue that signal too much either. However, as long as the private benefit to an individual exceeds the social cost to the larger community, the dilution of the brand will continue. </p>
<p>The only solution is to make the distinctions clear and reduce the ambiguity. Transcripts might start to read as B.A. (whatever major) Columbia College, Columbia University or B.Sc (whatever major) Fu School of Engineering and Applied Sciences, Columbia University. Or B.A. (whatever), Barnard College, Columbia University. Whether to distinguish between CC/Barnard or Columbia University/ colombia-the-country-in-central-america... spelling things out so that they're unmistakable.</p>
<p>Though it irks me when someone I meet at a party blithely assumes that I'm going to 'UBC' because that's what the yobs here are familiar with, or columbia-in-some-other-place-than-manhattan, I'm comforted that the only people for which this stuff matters are already in the know (grad schools and employers). </p>
<p>For everyone else, it shouldn't matter what school I went to - only the content of my character. Getting into an ivy says very very little about that.</p>
<p>Seriously though, I've never heard of barnard college before :confused:
Columbia is the world-renowned university :cool:</p>
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I'm comforted that the only people for which this stuff matters are already in the know (grad schools and employers).
[/quote]
I can assure you that people "in the know" are well aware of Barnard's excellent reputation and its history. Anyone "in the know" recognizes that the presence of a separately administered, highly selective women's college under Columbia U's umbrella adds to the overall quality of the institution, and does not detract from it in any way. Most "in the know" people are also very aware of the reputation that exclusive women's colleges have for instilling leadership qualities and confidence in their students, as so many high achieving women are graduates of colleges like Barnard or Wellesley. </p>
<p>I agree that there are many people who are not so sophisticated who don't have a clue as to where or what Barnard is... but then, there are also people who have no clue that Columbia U. is an Ivy and whose brand name awareness doesn't go much beyond "Harvard" and "Yale". But my point is that the only people contributing to "dilution" of Columbia's reputation are Columbia students who go around badmouthing Barnard on public forums. The rest of the world has no clue how hard it is to get into either Columbia College or Barnard, nor what the names of the various undergraduate colleges at Columbia U. are.</p>
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<p>yeah i admit that i am not quite sophistcated, ill give u that, but i know columbia is one of upper ivies :)</p>
<p>I also know this:</p>
<p>Harvard - "Business/Politics/Medicine"
Yale -"Law"
MIT - "engineering"
Stanford - "cutting-edge technology with wonderful eng/science/humaties"
Columbia -"politics/business"
NYU -"films"
Caltech - "hard sciences"
Berkeley - right mix of "harvard" and "MIT"</p>
<p>:rolleyes:</p>
<p>&</p>
<p>Penn - "wharton"
JHU - "Medicine"
CMU -"Computer Science"
NorthWestern - "Journalism/Business"
Chicago - "Economics"
UVA - "law"</p>
<p>blah blah blah ;)</p>
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The rest of the world has no clue how hard it is to get into either Columbia College or Barnard, nor what the names of the various undergraduate colleges at Columbia U. are.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>and thats exactly why you along with a host of barnard think you can get away with claiming that barnard is a part of columbia.</p>
<p>Penn - "wharton"
JHU - "Medicine"
CMU -"Computer Science"
NorthWestern - "Journalism/Business"
Chicago - "Economics"
UVA - "law"</p>
<p>blah blah blah ;)</p>
<p>calmom almost everything you have said is pretty idiotic....sorry</p>
<p>Hey this is real episode.</p>
<p>Me: "Where you going to college nest year?"
This Girl in my church: "Barnard"
Me: What?
Girl: Barnard.
Me: Sorry I donno
Girl: Oh it's columbia same thing
Me: :confused:</p>
<p>
[quote]
The only solution is to make the distinctions clear and reduce the ambiguity. Transcripts might start to read as B.A. (whatever major) Columbia College, Columbia University or B.Sc (whatever major) Fu School of Engineering and Applied Sciences, Columbia University. Or B.A. (whatever), Barnard College, Columbia University.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Columbia and Barnard have ENTIRELY DIFFERENT transcripts issued by the Columbia Registrar and Barnard Registrar, respectively. It is perfectly clear.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I can assure you that people "in the know" are well aware of Barnard's excellent reputation and its history. Anyone "in the know" recognizes that the presence of a separately administered, highly selective women's college under Columbia U's umbrella adds to the overall quality of the institution, and does not detract from it in any way. Most "in the know" people are also very aware of the reputation that exclusive women's colleges have for instilling leadership qualities and confidence in their students, as so many high achieving women are graduates of colleges like Barnard or Wellesley.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>I do not dispute this. I do recognize that Barnard is a great school and I look forward to meeting the people there. </p>
<p>However, the question is not whether it is excellent in absolute terms, but in relative terms. The differential exists. Calmom believes this differential is not meaningful - and I agree. But surely you can imagine a case at the margin where it makes a difference. And that will be when someone may cry for more clarity. Let's try to minimize those occurances. </p>
<p>
[quote]
Columbia and Barnard have ENTIRELY DIFFERENT transcripts issued by the Columbia Registrar and Barnard Registrar, respectively. It is perfectly clear.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>If the distinction is clear then there is nothing to discuss... Because transcripts are the area where clarity matters most. If the issue is about ambiguity in unmonitorable situations like introducing oneself socially I don't think it matters that much anyway.</p>
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<p>many employers don't ask for transcripts.</p>
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many employers don't ask for transcripts.
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I think employers who wouldn't ask for transcripts (ie don't have HR monitoring and verification policies in place) are probably not where you would want to apply anyway.</p>
<p>
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I think employers who wouldn't ask for transcripts (ie don't have HR monitoring and verification policies in place) are probably not where you would want to apply anyway.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>This is simply not the case. Plenty of top / competitive employers don't ask for transcripts.</p>
<p>I haven't had a chance to glance through the posts in this thread, but I'll add some of my experiences with Barnard girls:</p>
<p>I was at the prefrosh weekend just a couple days ago, and I met with many future Columbia students. However, I also met some Barnard girls around campus. When I chatted with the Barnard girls and asked where they came from/are going to school, they said with some hesitation, "uh.. Barnard which is a school of Columbia."</p>
<p>I was like, "oh? I didn't know that."</p>
<p>She said, "Well, there are 4 different schools at Columbia: The College, the Fu Foundation, the School of General Studies, and Barnard."</p>
<p>I responded, "ah that's cool." In my mind, I was like... "whatevvverrr."</p>
<p>Anyway, there's nothing wrong with Barnard. I just thought I'd share what happened with you guys <3</p>
<p>I have a question..
If Barnard is in fact an undergraduate college at Columbia University the same way Columbia College and the Fu Foundation, why is it that Barnard is not a part of the ivy league?
Please correct me if I am wrong, but I once read that Columbia College and the Fu Foundation is a part of the ivy league, but Barnard is not.
Does anyone know why this is this way?</p>
<p>barnard sort of technically is, since barnard athletes can play on columbia sports teams and that's what the ivy league is all about. just as you wouldnt say there are actually 9 ivy leagues and include seas in that count. barnard falls under the columbia umbrella on that one.
it does not have its own sports teams, because of the rather unique agreement it has with columbia, but for most intents and purposes, barnard is independent.</p>
<p>
[quote]
If Barnard is in fact an undergraduate college at Columbia University the same way Columbia College and the Fu Foundation, why is it that Barnard is not a part of the ivy league?
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Because Barnard is NOT in fact an undergraduate college at Columbia University IN THE SAME WAY THAT Columbia College and the Fu Foundation are.</p>
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