My D is not accepted to either, so the question is premature, at best. However, if she is accepted, what would you suggest? Which school is better? Should she apply to Dartmouth “early decision”? The issues are as follows:
Is Dartmouth a good school? Her HS counselor says “yes”, but Dartmouth is virtually unknown among our friends / classmates / family.
Is Dartmouth known among Californian employers? My D doesn’t mind spending 4/5 years in the middle of nowhere, but she is definitely looking forward to coming back to California, eventually.
Berkeley looks familiar, it is much closer, my D has friends at Berkeley, and she is familiar with the culture.
Everyone tells us that Berkeley is too big/disorganized and Dartmouth is student-friendly. Is it an issue? D is used to large public HS, where students are supposed to advocate for themselves.
Financials / weather/ location / Greek life / diversity/ athletics / distance from home/ crazy parties / etc. – not an issue.
Yes, she visited both schools. She is a bit overwhelmed by Berkeley, but able to find her way from cafeteria to Starbucks. Dartmouth looked artificial, too perfect-to-be-true (D’s words).
Should she apply to Dartmouth ED? HS counselor says that she has a good shot and is ready to support D’s application.
Which school would you choose (assuming that she is accepted into both)? Berkeley of Dartmouth?
I prefer Rome. Spouse prefers Paris. That is not a value judgment on either Paris or Rome.
Not sure what question you are trying to get answered here, except to say that listening to your friends about the value of a Dartmouth education is probably not a solid way to assess Dartmouth. I have cousins who alternate between Disneyworld and Graceland for their annual vacation, and I don’t plan to ask them any time soon if the line outside the Musee D’Orsay is “worth the wait”.
Dartmouth is an excellent, well-known, highly respected college. Employers, including California employers, will have heard of it.
However, Dartmouth does not offer an undergraduate business major. You say that she is interested in business or economics. If it turns out that she wants to major in business and she’s already at Dartmouth, she would have a problem.
I think you need to talk with her about whether she wants to have the option of an undergraduate business major. If she does, then she should not apply ED to Dartmouth. She could find herself committed to attending a college that doesn’t have the major she prefers.
To me these schools seem very different. Why are you trying to pick between these two? How did Dartmouth even get on her list? Did you visit? You shouldn’t ED without visiting. It really is remote and greek life is huge, along with outing type activities like hiking and skiing. Is this what she is looking for in a school? If it is, then why is Berkeley on her list? She needs to think through this some more.
Dartmouth has an undergraduate economics degree. Both schools are very good. If she wants to stay in California after graduating, UCB would be the safer bet and would likely be much less expensive.
If it were my kid, I would have her split the difference and go to UChicago.
Berkeley is on the list because it is our public school, everyone applies there, and there is an opportunity to be accepted (a reasonable number of kids from D’s HS are accepted to Berkeley every year).
Dartmouth is on the list because HS counselor advocates for it and says that D has a good chance, is she applies ED.
Yes, the schools are very different. Thus, it is difficult to compare them. We visited both, the first impression is “yes, these schools are very different”. D has good social skills, very versatile, I think that she would be able to fit in in both schools.
Thank you very much for your post! It is a little difficult to understand the difference between econ and business. I am not an expert, I can’t give my D an advice. Thus, she is considering any college that has business / econ undergrad, interchangeable.
@Zinhead
<Dartmouth has an undergraduate economics degree. Both schools are very good. If she wants to stay in California after graduating, UCB would be the safer bet and would likely be much less expensive.
If it were my kid, I would have her split the difference and go to UChicago >
UChicago is a great school. My D will send an application there. However, the chances are dim. Nobody from her HS was accepted to UChicago for the last 2 years (Over 30 kids / year are accepted to Berkeley, for comparison).
But they’re not interchangeable. Not really. I’m not an expert, either, but there probably are some people here who could knowledgeably discuss the difference between undergraduate economics and business majors and the pros and cons of each major for students with different interests. Maybe you should start a thread on that topic?
Economics is traditionally a liberal arts (social science) major, although some economics departments do offer more “business” electives (managerial economics, accounting, etc.). Some departments offer heavily mathematical options for intermediate economics and econometrics, which may be favorable for pre-PhD students.
Business is a more applied major, drawing on the bases of various social science fields like economics, sociology, and psychology, as well as some math and statistics (though typically less than for pre-PhD economics majors).
You can compare the courses for each major at schools that offer both.
What does your D want to get out of her undergrad education intellectually and careerwise? What types of campus environment does she prefer/lean towards?
Berkeley and Dartmouth are almost polar opposites in many ways…large elite public U vs LAC-like university, availability of pre-professional majors like Business* vs a more liberal arts majors with engineering thrown in, not so rah-rah Div I sports vs hardcore Div I sports spirit among students, etc.
Considering that 60 % of the ED pool is hooked in some sort of way, if she does not fall into that 60% I would say that she stands a chance, not a good chance. No, coming from California offers little in the geographic diversity dept.
Why Dartmouth? It could not be more different from Cal. It does not seem like neither you or your D have done any real research especially when you are looking at ~$240k
Don’t want to distract from this thread, but the Paris/Rome vacation question may have some answers