<p>Brand new to the Athletic Recruits Forum. Have a 13yo swimmer who wants to swim in college because he enjoys it. His best fit will be a less stressful environment, but if there is any partial scholarship to be had at a small school, well that would be great.</p>
<p>Could someone explain about the NCAA divisions? I understand D1, and know we will not be looking at that level of competition and stress. What about Division 2 schools? Aren't they allowed to give scholarship money also? Why is no one on the boards talking about D2 schools? I am seeing that people who decide not to pursue D1 are then looking at D3 schools as their second choice. Why not D2 schools?</p>
<p>It is my understanding that D3 schools don't give scholarship money? Help me understand what is so great about the D3 level.</p>
<p>We would be looking at very small schools in the southeast only. No Ivies or D1 schools. Open to NAIA or anything else we learn about. Expect Academics not to be a problem for admission to second tier schools. We will be looking for merit aid and financial aid.</p>
<p>Thanks so much for helping me understand the "Big Picture" of athletic recruiting.</p>
<p>Yes, D2 schools can give athletic scholarships. You don’t hear them discussed as often as D1 or D3 because there aren’t as many of them and they tend to be smaller schools without much name recognition outside of their regions.</p>
<p>Thanks, varska. That makes sense, considering most folks on this board are shooting for more prestige and ranking in their school choices. We were more local/regional with our first child’s college search, and will probably do the same when it’s time to start looking again.</p>
<p>Look at the trophy case at little bitty D3 Kenyon in Ohio,</p>
<p>20+ swimming and diving National Championships, maybe eight or 11 in a row,so much pressure is that? where you might have a D1 where the swimming is NCAA, but just slightly above club swimming.</p>
<p>I was just at Denison University in Ohio and they had a full trophy case of swimming and diving trophies and from looking at what they have invested in the facilities they are pretty serious and D3 also.</p>
<p>From what we have been told D2 schools can give athletic scholarships. They can give you a package deal of athletic, merit, and need based aid unlike D1 which can only giver athletic. D3 schools cannot give athletic aid, however, they can give merit and need based aid. Grades are very important. As one D3 coach told my D that she needs to keep her grades up and he can help find her additional academic scholarships offered by the school above the initial merit scholarship that the school offers. If you live in an area that has NAIA schools many of them also give athletic scholarships and are similar to D2 schools.</p>
<p>You have a number of years to research and understand the differences and many nuances between D1, D2 and D3. My best advice would be to physically see & research these athletes to figure out where your son best fits, and visit the schools. </p>
<p>As your son matures, you’ll get a sense if this is something he genuinely wants to pursue. You’ll learn quickly that everybody has different goals and different perspectives on college athletics. The challenge becomes identifying that goal, and then finding the school that best fits it academically, athletically and financially. Those three dynamics (athletics, academics and financial) are the typical lever points that you will be considering as priorities. it is a recurring theme in this section of CC. </p>
<p>IMHO one of the biggest areas to consider is your son’s major, and how difficult it is to win a position or event on starting team. Not all college athletes compete in meets or events. There is typically a long roster of participants, and the team choses “starters” by having internal competition. When it is time for your son, will he be ready to win one of those starting spots as a freshmen or a junior for example. It is very competitive at every level. It is the most frequently looked over aspect to college athletics. Most kids think it is like high school, but it is not. </p>
<p>So, please continue to research and ask questions. There are many folks on this site that have been through college athletic recruiting multiple times, and have the battle scars to prove it. Good luck!</p>
<p>I would also suggest you do look at NAIA schools. My daughters friend is a swimmer and she goes to Fresno Pacific and she got a nice scholarship. Most NAIA schools are private but they have more money to hand out in general. My daughter play bb at an NAIA school and we are paying less for her to go there with here scholarship money then we would be for a non private education. Most important though is the fit of the school for your son. Big school vs small? Location? Size of classes? Things like that are very important when researching schools. good luck</p>
<p>tpm - did you say that D1 can only give athletic scholarship? I am not sure about other sports, but in swimming many boys get a combination of athletic/academic scholarship at the D1 level. Keep in mind that a D1 school only has 9.9 scholarships for male swimmers (and they share those with the diving team also) so if your son can get academic money too - that is great.</p>
<p>Also - it is probably not fair to compare Kenyon and Denison (and Emory) to other D3 swimming schools - they are kind of in a league of their own! But while the swimmers are top notch - many will tell you the progam doesn’t “own” them like some big D1 programs because there are no athletic scholarships - a kid can walk away from the swim team at any time. Swimming often helps a kid get into these top LAC’s. I think you will find stronger programs in D1 and D3 because the really strong swimmers use their athletic talent to help them get into acadmically challenging schools in D3. I don’t know much abou NAIA.</p>
<p>OP - your son is only 13 - things will change!!! Let him enjoy high school and then start thinking about swimming in college in 2-3 years!</p>
<p>ahsmouch the way it was explained to us by D1 women’s volleyball coach was that D1 schools can only give athletic scholarships and a portion of a PELL Grant if you are eligible. The way he made it sound it was that was for all sports. (Now that I think on it he may have meant sports like football, basketball, women’s volleyball where the division levels are clear. It may be different for some sports since some schools play one sport at one level and another at different level. I think lacrosse is that way.) The student, however, could bring any academic or need scholarships that they earned on the outside. However, if any of them were related to playing a sport you could not use them.</p>
<p>My dd’s bff is going “full ride” to swim at a D1 school - but she got a 3/4 tuition academic scholarship and the rest is her athletic. DD’s boyfriend is also swimming D1 on a small athletic scholarship and some academic also. Maybe each sport is different - but I know in swimming you can get both from the university. Both schools are d1 for all sports.</p>
<p>It’s never a bad idea to start gathering information…it’s a real labyrinth, this college athletics thing, and I sure wish I had done more homework a little earlier on. Having said that, I’m with ahsmuoh on the “things will change” thing. As I’m sure you know, the 8th grader (I’m assuming) that you see today is going to be a completely different person than the 17/18 year old who will be applying to college in 4 years. Just as I’ve seen kids take up a sport in 10th grade who are now getting D1 looks, I’ve also seen kids who have been playing little league or pop warner or swimming since they were in elementary school decide when the time came to hang up their cleats (or speedo) to pursue a purely academic college journey.</p>
<p>There are many good options for D3 swimming in the southeast. Emory has dominated the women national championship for the past several years and the mens team has consistently placed near the top. There are many excellent d3 schools with less intense swimming programs. There are several d2 programs which may be worth a look and finally there are some d1 programs which swim at the d3 level. Based on your comments above I would look at the following schools:</p>
<p>I met the field hockey coach at the Disney Recruiting Showcase in February. She waqs watching a club who had been successful in sending her student-athletes in the past play to see what was in their upcoming pipeline. Her biggest challange was getting her recruits through the Admissions Office due to the schools high standards.</p>
<p>Word 2: DD’s school just sent their 1st student iin some time to Rhodes in September.</p>
<p>OP here…thanks so much for the information. To further explain, my son does not know I am researching and gaining understanding of the college athletic recruiting world. He just mentioned that he would be sad when he aged out of YMCA swimming and had to go to college. So I told him it might be possible to swim in college, too. He brightened up at that thought. We are not making any plans for him, just trying to understand what the rules are, and what schools in the southeast might be a match for him academically, socially, and swim team competitively. </p>
<p>For him, swimming would be a connection to meeting new people who had something in common. A physical activity to stay in shape and the joy of continuing to get better personal times. But the minute he tires of swimming, we agree he stops swimming. He will also be in a great position academically and with ECs to compete for academic scholarships. We realize there are very few swim scholarships out there, and that they are usually divided up among several swimmers/divers.</p>
<p>It is great to have a source of information and experience here on CC. Thanks for each of you for sharing to give me a more solid base of knowledge to work from. We just got First child into college and felt like we missed out on some key things due to inexperience. Don’t want to make that same mistake with second child, hence the early start in looking on cc for athletics.</p>
<p>From listening to friends, swimming is pretty straight forward, in that it is based on swim times. So if he can post good swim times over the next couple of years, you will have more choices. D1 is a full time job. D2 very rigorous, and D3 is more seasonal. Depends on the kid. My daughter, does not want all her college career based on sports, but still wants to play at collegiate level. We are looking at D3, but honestly in our area, they are very highly selective LAC, with excellent NCAA ranking.</p>
<p>Google “guide for student athletes” for both NCAA and NAIA. They both have one. The NCAA one, as I recall, tells you exactly what the academic requirements are for D1, D2 and D3. They are different. </p>
<p>Also, look into the number of scholarships offered for swimming. For example, football is what they call “helmet” sport or “helmet” count, meaning a college can have X number of football scholarships, one per kid. For men’s soccer, and I expect swimming too, a college can have X number of scholarships, but they can divide those between as many athletes as they want. </p>
<p>For example, a D-2 men’s college soccer team is only allowed 9 scholarships, even though there may be as many as 24 kids on the team. So, one person may get a full, one may get a half, one may get enough for books, etc.</p>
<p>And even if the scholarship/competitive route doesn’t work out, many colleges have club teams where you can still participate, but it’s more for fun.</p>
<p>Men’s swimming d1 has 9.9 scholarships that they share with diving. Most schools if they have a diving team will have 2 scholarships for diving and 7 for swimming.</p>
<p>It is interesting, there are even differences in intensity within the different divisions. With my son and daughter on our visits, we found that schools with outstanding, top tier programs were extremely intense, and the “feel”/pressure was a significant turn off to both children. If I could give you one piece of advice, it would be to trust your gut, and definitely accompany your young adult on any visit. Only you know best for your child.</p>
<p>Because many DIII schools are amongst the very best academic institutions in the country. Look at school rankings on line. You will find that the names you see at the top of list, alongside the Ivys and some other DIs, will be schools that compete in DIII.</p>
<p>Many DII and DIII schools are not in the same league, athletically (literally) OR academically.</p>