Brandeis v. Bucknell?

Colleges and Universities A-Z Bucknell University
1

<p>My son accepted the offer of admission to Bucknell and as good fortune would have it was accepted to Brandeis from their waitlist.</p>

<p>Intended major: mathematics. Pure mathematics. He is a thinker.</p>

<p>Cost: not a consideration.</p>

<p>Temperament: Quiet. A loner and a clown who people like to have around. “Friends make me,” he says. Competitive. Judgmental. Athletic. A smart kid (many AP’s) who didn’t need to study in HS to get A’s.</p>

<p>Objection to Bucknell: he thought students were superficial and talked too much of partying.</p>

<p>Driving the decision: I think that social comfort and fit will be a prime consideration.</p>

<p>Questions: Can anyone compare the universities for pure mathematics? Can anyone assess his fit with both social scenes?</p>

2

<p>May I ask if he's Jewish?</p>

3

<p>The more I read on this site, the more I realize that Bucknell gets a really bad rap for being a party school and a preppy school along with all the negative connotations that go along. My daughter will be attending Bucknell in the fall and she is not a partier and although she attends a "prep" school, she is neither superficial nor materialistic. She looked seriously at a number of the elite LAC's and found the Bucknell students to be warm, friendly and very involved in many activities. I think the active campus environment is what attracted her most. We believe the larger size (compared to the other LACs she visited) is more conducive to an environment where any student can find their niche and the “middle of nowhere” location that is often criticized makes for a very active and thriving campus community.<br>
I don’t enough about Brandeis to give you a thoughtful comparison. Everyone's impressions are different (thank goodness!) but our experience does not find the students at Bucknell to be superficial partiers.</p>

4

<p>Perhaps you've answered your own question when you note ...</p>

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I think that social comfort and fit will be a prime consideration

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</p>

<p>and your son notes ...</p>

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..he thought students were superficial and talked too much of partying.

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</p>

<p>and lastly, you indicate ...</p>

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Cost: not a consideration

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</p>

<p>Mathematics is perhaps the one science that changes not, no matter where it's taught. What are you really in need of in coming to the "choir?" Assurance, some keen insight re: the Pythagorean theorem, or what? Bucknell is fine in the sciences, but not overly noted for producing actuarial type thinkers, to my knowledge. :confused:</p>

<p>What you're most likely to get here, understandably, is defense of the social and academic honor of the BU that's been perceived as being maligned as noted in comments preceding.</p>

5

<p>The schools are very different. If it comes down to a tie, the tie breaker is SAT scores. The higher the scores, the better the students, teachers, facilities, etc. Don't get scared off by Bucknell's location. Kids have the time of their lives there. And the name has a nice ring to it.</p>

6

<p>I would not make the decision based upon SAT scores ... that's splitting hairs that won't make a lick of difference when looking at these two. Both schools are very selective, with Brandeis being the more "heady" place, no doubt.</p>

<p>The 2 major "tie breakers" imo are:</p>

<ol>
<li><p>Location, location, location ... Boston and Bucknell are both fabulous places and light years apart. One is in the middle of "everything" and the other in the middle of "nowhere." Of course students have the times of their lives ... at either/both ... but they are very different times. This is a very important issue in deciding between these two, imo. </p></li>
<li><p>Campus cultures, again nite and day, especially for Jewish students. I'm confident that Bucknell is very inclusive, accepting, and tolerant. They even have a Jewish chaplain. But it's roots/history if not so much it's present state are Christian, which I'm sure the great predominance of its students are. Tolerant and Christian. I'm sure your student would do fine there. </p></li>
</ol>

<p>And it's an very significantly different culture than Brandeis that relates to not only the "where" it is, but also the "who" and the history of the place. </p>

<p>So both are fine, good places but VERY different. Again, I'm confident your student knows his answer. So let him.</p>

7

<p>i cant specifically address the campus culture at brandeis because ive never been there. however, i can unequivocally state that bucknell is not a place where one would have to worry about friends only worrying about partying. there are stereotypical frat parties, no doubt. there are also the 'parties' that arent really parties out all, but merely a half dozen people hanging out together, having a few drinks. and there are the 'crazy' anime society meetings, too; in my undergraduate days, that club was nearly 100 members strong.</p>

<p>(and yes, i do feel a strong need to defend the negative characterizations of bucknell because, simply, theyre inaccurate. if all bucknell had to offer was a social scene involving frat parties, id have transferred after my freshman year.)</p>

<hr>

<p>anyway, as a mathematics major and current graduate student in theoretical mathematics (specifically foundations... logic, set theory, proof theory and a bit of computational complexity theory on the side), i take somewhat strong offense to the naive suggestion that it doesnt matter where one studies mathematics. frankly, im not sure i can think of a major where it matters more. why?</p>

<p>theoretical, proof-based math is really hard... hard to the point where even most highly intelligent princeton math majors find the ho-holds-barred approach their department takes to be too demanding and consequently leave for 'easier' fields. as one meanders down the academic food chain, increasing amounts of 'sugar-coating' works its way into the curriculum simply to keep more than a handful of students afloat. it happens at bucknell. it happens even more at places like penn state and maryland. and im sure it happens even more yet at schools with, on average, even less capable students.</p>

<p>now, i dont know how much sugar-coating occurs at brandeis. the school certainly has a highly qualified faculty and draws strong students. however, there is relatively little in the way of outcomes to suggest an undergraduate program that is particularly strong.</p>

<p>take, for example, the fact that bucknell produces phds in mathematics and statistics at TWICE the rate of brandeis. this is a somewhat disappointing outcome for a school with a strong faculty and presumably 'headier' student body. however, in context, i dont find it particularly surprising.</p>

<p>despite brandeis having a phd program in mathematics, bucknell actually holds the larger of the two departments. considering then the fact that brandeis is home to approximately three dozen graduate students, the difference in faculty access and dedication to undergrads could potentially be quite large. and in a field where it can take hours to make any grounded progress on a line of thinking, having a faculty dedicated to undergraduate instruction is critical.</p>

<p>my strong recommendation of bucknell as a place to study mathematics isnt coming from left field, either. in addition to the aforementioned difference in phd production (in which bucknell ranks 52nd nationally in the ABSOLUTE number of phds produced and 21st among private schools of ANY size), bucknell has also performed very well in the highly prestigious putnam mathematics competition, even finishing in the top 10 in north america in 2004. the putnam is a BIG deal, and for a team from bucknell to beat out teams from places like uchicago and michigan, along with 400 or so other schools, speaks to the quality of instruction at the school.</p>

<p>...of course, it doesnt hurt that department served me very, very well, either. that i am currently studying mathematics at a top 20 (or so) graduate department in a highly competitive field speaks volumes to the education i received.</p>

<p>if you have more specific questions about math (or social life!) at bucknell, feel free to let me know either here or via pm. knowing the time-sensitive nature of waitlist admissions, ill try to respond in a timely fashion.</p>

8

<p>Frankly, I don't really have any specifics to add like ericatbucknell, but I will tell you that the party-scene stereotype is nothing to fret about. I've never drank, partied, smoked, etc., but I feel 100% positive that I'll fit right in. :) That and I know a relatively sufficient number of kids who aren't completely into it either, who will be attending Bucknell or already attend.</p>

9

<p>Disagree with Pig (who is a serial pessimist on this site). SAT scores are critical, unless they are equal, and location is not. Students love bubbles, and love to hang with other students. The whole go into Boston thing is way overblown. Students at BC, for example, very rarely go off campus. And these kids will have the rest of their lives to hang out it cities. Every single person I have ever met from Bucknell was totally in love with the school. It is happy and beloved. And all of these schools party, it's just that the bubble school students party together, which is a nice, safe thing for them. Whistle's kids decided not to go, which he needs to come to terms with.</p>

10

<p>My son is Jewish and he just completed his freshman year. He gives his freshman year a "10 out of 10" on all factors - classes, profs, dorm life, partys, students, etc. He is 100% confident he made the right choice in Bucknell. However, weather gets a 5.....</p>

11

<p>
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SAT scores are critical, unless they are equal, and location is not.

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Now, there's an insightful comment.;) </p>

<p>No need to get personal simply because one doesn't patronize or rationalize. </p>

<p>As noted, I'm confident that either could be fine. But they are about as different as could be. And I'm also confident the student is sufficiently perceptive, as he's already noted to mom, to make HIS choice rather than buy anyone else's.</p>