<p>Haas is a lot better IMHO. I think Econ is just as competetive, but at least the material in the business classes are easier. Econ is all about assumptions and rules based on those assumptions and applying that to some stupid word problem. If X is true, then Y happens. But then they tell you X doesn't happen in real life. wackness. Anything can be tru if you make up rules that make it true.</p>
<p>True. However, I do think business students are more self-interested and antagonistic. I suppose they have to be in order to succeed in the business world. Business classes are more competitive in the sense that the material is much easier, so everyone can grasp it. The curve becomes very tight because silly mistakes determine your grade instead. However, in Economics, the material is much more difficult to grasp so the competition depends on mastery of the material itself.</p>
<p>Agreed. The material is also 10X harder to grasp when you have no interest in it at all (like me). Well, I used to like it, because understanding our economy is fundamental to pretty much everything in business. However, I feel that some of the material is presented in an overcompicated manner, and a lot of the math is dry. At least 1 model can apply to like a 10 different things, just change the variables and the labels haha.</p>
<p>Okay, I'll try to address some of the concerns raised here as OBJECTIVELY as I possible can. Hopefully this will put things in perspective for prospective students and not scare them off, but at the same time prepare them for what's at Berkeley. This is also a limited view on Berkeley so take it for what it's worth.</p>
<p>
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I guess the main thing is the atmosphere. I feel that the student population is overly competitive to the point of refusing others help. I'm not sure if this is just true of every good university, but it seems pretty applicable here. In addition, the class sizes don't help people develop more sociable personalities.
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<p>In my opinion, this really depends on what you are studying and what kind of people you hang out with. If you're taking the hard sciences, major in MCB (biology) / am pre-med, or want to get into one of the competitive majors (Haas, econ) then this is definitely true to some degree. There are SOME students who, frankly, care very much about getting a good grade, and has very little interest in being nice to you or helping you out.
For majors like engineering though, I find that yes it's a very difficult major, but students tend to collaborate much more. Maybe this is because they're not trying to get into anything competitive. Engineering students are all in engineering so they help each other out.
For humanities majors, I see students mostly studying by themselves and doing a lot of reading and writing essays (and complaining about them) so nothing new there.
Many intro classes ARE pretty big, but I don't think it's even that. College classes just make it harder to socialize during class. It's hard to meet people through class. You usually make friends outside of class then talk to them more in class if you happen to have class together. People are usually pretty open at the start of the semester so meet a few people in class you click with and stick with them.</p>
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On top of that, and this may be partially my fault, but I find very few laid-back people here to socialize with. Back in the day in high school most of my friends were pretty much the laid-back types, and it seems that everyone here is really uptight. Oftentimes jokes are misunderstood and everyone seems really serious. Again, this might just be because it's a good university academically and academics are generally more serious.
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<p>I think this definitely has a point too. A lot of people frankly, already has established a set of friends and care a lot more about getting good grades than, making new friends. Just realize who these people are and forget about them. Like I said, make some friends at the start of the semester in your classes and stick to them. Or you could try to be extroverted but don't let the competitive people get you down. Keep trying. There are a lot of nice people at Berkeley.</p>
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Punk..maybe it depends on the person. In terms of friends, I can't say I've kept in touch with people continuously during my academic career. For example during one semester I may talk to certain people a lot because I saw them in my classes. But after classes changed, I don't usually keep in contact with them. Same thing with the dorm. My first year I dormed in the units and became close with a couple of other people. After that year ended, we hardly saw each other. But then, I didn't really feel that I wanted to put much effort to keep in touch.
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<p>This happens a lot too. It's a lot harder to keep friendships going with people in college because it's hard to socialize in class and it's hard to get together outside of class. I'm not gonna lie, it's hard to build strong ties with friends sometimes. That's why again, I recommend finding a few people in your class that you click with, and just hang out with them a lot during the semester. Go get lunch after class, do homework together, whatever. This will help ensure that after your class ends, you will still be good friends and want to meet up from time to time to catch up.</p>
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As for romantic relationships, I've dated way more people in college than I did in high school. But in the end most were pointless and you wonder why you keep dating so many people when it doesn't amount to anything. Although they may be hot or whatnot, in the end it just meant nothing.
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<p>This depends on what you want. People seem to group into two extremes: those who hookup a lot and those who want/are in a long and steady relationship.</p>
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On top of this, I feel that the students are very socially segregated here, into ethnicity for example. Although it is supposedly a more diverse environment, people generally only socialize with their own race.
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<p>Also true, but I've found that it works, for the most part. Hey, most students want to hang out with people of their own race....so let them.</p>
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wow smithy...im starting to kinda get freaked out by going to cal. i just got accepted and my parents really want me to go there, but all of my friends think that i definitely wouldn't fit in because i looove shopping and fashion. if what you are saying is true about other cal students being critical of people who care about their appearances...i definitely dont think cal is the place for me. i mean, academic-wise, cal has a great reputation...but happiness is more important to me, and i would hate to have to deal with people who have no regard for others just because they want to be the "smartest." ughh, i just hope there are other people at Cal who think that their health and happiness are more important than letter grades and numbers on a transcript!!
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<p>There are definitely people like that at Berkeley. The thing is, the student population is so large that you will really find every type of person here. You'll find the competitive type and you'll find the friendly and outgoing type. It's really useless to make generalizations about the type of people at Berkeley. No matter what kind of person you are, I can say with confidence that you will find people like you at Berkeley. I know people who were outcasts in high school who are thriving at Berkeley because...they meet other outcasts!</p>
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Well, I agree to the OP to some degree. Being a double major in engineering, I can say that my first semester here was HELL!!!! I was seriously considering to drop out of school once my first semester was over or to switch my major to economics (not to say it is easier...but according to engineering, it is).
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<p>Yeah, one thing that students should prepare for is...if you're into a hard science major or engineering...or a hard/competitive major overall...be prepared for some serious competition. Got As in high school? Be prepared for Cs and worse. Grades you wouldn't have imagined getting in high school, you now have to work for. Especially at a place like Berkeley, for a difficult major, the classes get TOUGH. But if some of the classes weren't so tough you definitely won't be feeling nearly as accomplished for finishing an assignment or doing well on a midterm. It's definitely a lot of work with a lot of benefits to reap. Hey, if you find out that it's too much for you, I suggest just switching to an easy major and enjoying all the other offerings out there...clubs, sports, SF, whatever.</p>
<p>General tips:</p>
<ol>
<li>If you're in a hard major, classes are HARD. Be prepared to work, but don't get discouraged. You get a lot out of it.</li>
<li>It takes a lot more work to socialize and keep those friendships. Go about it the easy way: meet people in your dorm, in your classes, and through your other friends. People you generally tend to see a lot. Then foster a relationship. Definitely go for quality over quantity.</li>
<li>It's easy to slip through the cracks. You could not go to class, not join any clubs, not talk to anyone, and no one will do anything about it. You could just game and sleep all day and no one will care (until report card time maybe). Force yourself to get out there and get involved. Do something. On the flip side, it's easy to just get caught up in studying and nothing else. Mix it up. If all you do is study you'll drive yourself nuts.</li>
</ol>
<p>Most of this is just common sense to people but they are mistakes a lot of people make which leads them to be unhappy at Berkeley, and they gradually learn to avoid them. Just be prepared for what's ahead and you'll do fine. Most students are really nice people if you get to know them.</p>
<p>huh. very interesting, vicissitudes! so what kind of experience would you have as a social welfare major? it's a smaller department, right? i'm hoping that means there's a lot more interaction between profs and students. (i'm applying as a transfer from a ccc.)</p>
<p>there are no hot girls and that just kills it for me</p>
<p>People that say there are no hot girls/guys are just making excuses for why they can't get a date. I believe that to my core.</p>
<p>I haven't had much luck dating, but I don't make excuses. I know I'm socially awkward, around women especially. And that is apparently a huge turn-off. I'm not a creeper or anything, I'm just kinda shy and have trouble starting conversations with random women. I do not blame the lack of hot people for my lack of prospects. And to add, there is a dearth of hot people at Cal, if you are looking for supermodel gorgeous. What is lacking in "hot", is made up for in naturally beautiful and wholesome looking. I'm not looking for a supermodel -since that is the standard for hot-, never have. I just don't find that attractive, really. I think the key is to be comfortable with who you are and just wait for someone who is right for you.</p>
<p>I've never seen so many girls with moustaches than at Cal.</p>
<p>Wrathle: Whenever we learn knew graphs, I think HOW the hell did they come up with a graph like this? And then somehow apply it to 10 other things...</p>
<p>Vic:
[quote]
I think this definitely has a point too. A lot of people frankly, already has established a set of friends and care a lot more about getting good grades than, making new friends. Just realize who these people are and forget about them. Like I said, make some friends at the start of the semester in your classes and stick to them. Or you could try to be extroverted but don't let the competitive people get you down. Keep trying. There are a lot of nice people at Berkeley.
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<p>That's true. I guess it's also because I came from out-of-state and nobody from my high school besides me went here. Most stayed at home and lived at home or the few that got out went East. </p>
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This depends on what you want. People seem to group into two extremes: those who hookup a lot and those who want/are in a long and steady relationship.
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<p>Right now I'm in a long and steady relationship, but with someone from back home unfortunately. After dating around (man that sounds sleazy but oh well) I've realized that it's not emotionally rewarding at all compared to a long steady relationship. When you're just dating someone you do stuff together but you don't end up caring about them usually. </p>
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Also true, but I've found that it works, for the most part. Hey, most students want to hang out with people of their own race....so let them.
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<p>Ah, I guess I notice the difference because in my high school it just wasn't segregated at all (this could also be because we had 10% minorities so there was nobody to segregate). I think it's kind of extreme to the point at Cal though, because you end only being in "race" clubs for example or themed dorms. I just don't understand that part, probably because I grew up in a place where it didn't happen.</p>
<p>As for grades at Cal, yeah I agree. I used to essentially BS my way through high school and AP classes and somehow pulled straight A's. Now my GPA is defo lower even though I study for exams. </p>
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there are no hot girls and that just kills it for me
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<p>Well as for the student population (both girls and guys), there's probably a few hot ones, some okay looking, and then most are below average .</p>
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People that say there are no hot girls/guys are just making excuses for why they can't get a date. I believe that to my core.
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<p>Hmm, true. I think it is the opposite actually. If there is a lack of hot girls/guys it should be easier to get dates. I think due to the lack of hot girls, I get more dates in college because the competition is less stiff. </p>
<p>
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I haven't had much luck dating, but I don't make excuses. I know I'm socially awkward, around women especially. And that is apparently a huge turn-off. I'm not a creeper or anything, I'm just kinda shy and have trouble starting conversations with random women. I do not blame the lack of hot people for my lack of prospects. And to add, there is a dearth of hot people at Cal, if you are looking for supermodel gorgeous. What is lacking in "hot", is made up for in naturally beautiful and wholesome looking. I'm not looking for a supermodel -since that is the standard for hot-, never have. I just don't find that attractive, really. I think the key is to be comfortable with who you are and just wait for someone who is right for you.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Very true. I also think the best relationships start from friendships first. </p>
<p>As for you being socially awkward around women, hmm maybe try treating them like a bud first? I personally would like a guy to treat me like a guy buddy, because it makes me feel as if he likes me as a friend too. I don't know, I guess that's just me, but I like it when guys joke around with me like they do with other guys. Maybe you could just think of women not as women but as guys? </p>
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I've never seen so many girls with moustaches than at Cal.
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<p>haha Ok fine Wrathle. If we're playing this game, I have never seen so many SHORT guys in my life than at Cal. I swear there's anti-growth hormone in the water.</p>
<p>
[quote]
huh. very interesting, vicissitudes! so what kind of experience would you have as a social welfare major? it's a smaller department, right? i'm hoping that means there's a lot more interaction between profs and students. (i'm applying as a transfer from a ccc.)
[/quote]
</p>
<p>I'm not really familiar with that major. What I can say it that while you will probably get more attention / smaller classes as an upper-division student in a smaller department, much more important is how willing you are to seek attention out. You could be in a small department but if you don't bother going to office hours, talking to advisors, talk to classmates in class, you won't much interactions. There are classes where you have discussions in class but those are in the minority (or perhaps I'm just science-oriented). A lot of the "dicussion" sections are really just GSIs going over material or working on worksheets/quizzes. It depends on the class.</p>
<p>
[quote]
haha Ok fine Wrathle. If we're playing this game, I have never seen so many SHORT guys in my life than at Cal. I swear there's anti-growth hormone in the water.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Hey come on, that hurts.</p>
<p>Those of you complaining about the sexual selection need to get your heads outta your asses - the problem is you, not them. There are plenty of attractive people here. Don't use some contrived "ugly-factor" as a self-protection mechanism because you aren't getting any. The ugliness has to do with your mentality and your willed perception of things.</p>
<p>It might be hard to discern personalities among the population, but even for the superficially-minded, there is plenty enough attractiveness going around.</p>
<p>"Those of you complaining about the sexual selection need to get your heads outta your asses - the problem is you, not them. There are plenty of attractive people here. Don't use some contrived "ugly-factor" as a self-protection mechanism because you aren't getting any. The ugliness has to do with your mentality and your willed perception of things."</p>
<p>Whew, someone finally hit the truth there. Exactly, it's not that there are no attractive people at Cal, it's just that those people aren't attracted to you.</p>
<p>^^ lol, well said, though I can't attest to its veracity. =p</p>
<p>yeah, there's a bigger selection of hotties than i thought. in fact, every day i see a good-looking guy, at least in passing. so not bad, not bad.</p>
<p>Haven't done this in a while!</p>
<p>Fall 06 transfer here.</p>
<p>I don't know what I'm doing wrong, but I just don't feel the competition that everyone is talking about. I've taken the Econ 101 series, taken some lower div math and AC, taken some Haas courses, and it's just not there. If anything, I feel like there's a lot more underachieving here than I would have expected. Examples: few people talk in discussions (math/bus/econ), about half the class leaves Bus 103 after quizzes (anyone else in that class? it just seems ridiculous how many people leave), and bleh I can't think of anymore right now.</p>
<p>I can definitely picture what Smithy is saying about the effect of hot girls (lack of) on her dating life though. Not that I think that there are no hot girls here, it's just that the frequency of hot girls on other campuses is way higher. I see hot girls here everyday (they're almost always in sororities), but I know that if I was at Davis I'd be seeing twice as many per capita everyday. Well not necessarily hot, just dressed sluttier with a bit more makeup :)</p>
<p>Speaking of hot sorority girls, it seems sort of impossible to get to them without being at a party cuz they always have a posse in and out of class. Am I right??!</p>
<p>As far as happiness, I'm generally happy about Cal so far. The only thing that occasionally depresses me is the fact that I commuted up until two weeks ago, and I feel like I missed out on so much because of it. For example, I have a few facebook friends who transferred into dorms or Channing-Bowditch, including a bunch of CCers, and they look like they're having an absolute blast. They're involved, they have all these parties, all these friends, etc. The automatic network and support system you get from a good UC-housing experience is incredible. Meanwhile I'm still floating around trying to find my niche; it's a lot of regret to live with.</p>
<p>In light of that, I believe that if you lived in the dorms, you really shouldn't have many excuses for being unhappy. Cal is huge, there are tons of laid-back people, tons of must be best at everything people, tons of party more than they study people, etc. There's just too many people here for it to really be a one-dimensional grad school competition.</p>
<p>P.S. If you can't find any laid-back people, hit me up I'm SUPER laid-back :)</p>
<p>Well, it looks like you've been around too many students in the College of Letters of Science. Students in the College of Chemistry (ChemE majors) and the College of Engineering hardly have time to shower....let alone go on party rampages like the students down on southside. </p>
<p>Also ucbhi, your currently taking lower div math courses...which are complete jokes. Once you get to the upper division, you'll feel the wrath of berzerkeley. That's why alot of students join the facebook group..."I don't need sex because UC Berkeley Fuc** me everyday". lol. </p>
<p>My suggestion is that if you want to feel the competition, hellish nature of true berkeley then take upper division technical courses...... and on top of that, this is your 2nd semester which doesn't really give you a good enough feeling of the overall nature. This is my 4th semester at this hell. </p>
<p>I like the quotes that i learned back in my 1st semester......</p>
<p>"UC Berkeley, where your 'best' is not good enough"</p>
<p>AND</p>
<p>"C's get degrees"</p>