<p>My daughter is a senior in California, and she will be applying to several University of California campuses (in addition to other schools). Any thoughts about how the lives of undergraduate students will be (or have been) affected by the ongoing budget cuts? Through, say, 2017? Are parents encouraging their kids to cross UC schools off their lists because of these issues? Are some campuses affected more than others? </p>
<p>And how do parents help their kids determine whether they'd be a "fit" at such large schools?</p>
<p>I've always thought that my daughter would do better in a smaller environment, but she is insisting that she wants a LARGE school.</p>
<p>The UCs are excellent schools in terms of reputation and what a good student who looks for the opportunities can get out of them. Cuts at any state schools, however, can make it difficult ot get into certain classes and mthe bureacracy to change majors or do anything that is not straight forward. When the “frills” as they call it are cut, a lot of flexibility goes. SMaller classes also go. </p>
<p>I’ve heard budget cuts every year for last 40 years and somehow the tution is higher than ever and there are more amenities at college than when I went. </p>
<p>You have your kid visit the school and shadow a freshman in those big lecture halls so that s/he can see what it’s like But, I can tell you that none of my kids were particularly interested in my opinion of where each of them should go. I have one at a big state school now, and every single thing I told him that is a drawback has come to be with some thrown in the mix. But that was where he wanted to go despite some very sweet offers that I thought were better fits. So it is being a parent. But it 's a big plus to have the kid pick his/her own school as the momentum and motivitaion, two big MOs are so integral to a successful year at college.</p>
<p>I am encouraging out-of-staters to examine CA public schools with a critical eye for this reason. If you are paying OOS tuition, some of the problems (unavailable courses, limited dorm space, etc.) may be unacceptable. For in-staters, not so much.</p>
<p>Anyone looking at OOS publics should keep that in mind. It’s one thing to have to deal with these issues at prices that are less than half and often a third of private school options, but to be paying private school prices with your kid sitting along side those paying much less than that, and having to put up with those things is really galling. You can do much better thatn that.</p>
<p>The whole “cannot get the courses you need to graduate” problem appears to be over-exaggerated at UCs. Indeed, Berkeley and UCLA are among the top of public universities in four year graduation rates, though that is likely mostly due to also being among the most selective public universities (more selective schools have higher four year graduation rates, due to fewer students needing remedial courses and other student-fault reasons for graduating late).</p>
<p>However, some of the CSUs, and apparently many of the community colleges are having course space problems. Some of the CSUs do have four year pledge programs for those who do not need remedial courses and agree to follow their majors’ course plans, but it appears that few take advantage of such programs, given low four year graduation rates at CSUs. Some of the CSUs have gotten much more selective due to shrinking enrollment to solve this problem. Some community colleges may have honors programs with priority registration. Because community colleges admit anybody, the demand versus capacity problem is worst there, and can get even worse faster than it can at CSU and UC.</p>
<p>But the one thing that affects all three systems when the budgets are cut is that in-state tuition and fees will rise greatly, though students under some financial aid programs (e.g. UC Blue and Gold Opportunity) may see minimal to no effect of the tuition and fee increase. But for someone who pays list price, UC in-state is costly enough that some out-of-state publics are price-competitive at their out-of-state list prices, like Minnesota, Virginia Tech, North Carolina State, and Stony Brook.</p>
<p>I agree with the above that the ‘can’t get classes’ problem is overblown for the UCs. If you’re getting input on this you need to get it from current UC students (or their parents) and not people who don’t really have any idea (which includes a number of people on CC with an uninformed opinion). Don’t forget that a lot of the budgetary speak you hear is posturing for the ever decreasing public dollars available in California. There are some adjustments being done based on budget and priorities, as there always should be IMO, but how that would affect a particular student, if at all, is in question. </p>
<p>Just one anecdote - I had an intern from UCB this past summer and specifically asked him this question about getting courses and he said he’s had no problems and neither have most of the people he knows. This is only a single anecdote so consider that.</p>
<p>That doesn’t mean one doesn’t have to work at it a bit and be flexible, such as taking a less popular morning class or a Friday class when multiple classes are offered for the same course. One should plan as well to make sure they know which classes to take for sequences, especially if a course isn’t offered every quarter/semester. Sometimes if one course is unavailable/full then taking a related course may satisfy.</p>
<p>As far as the large classes, they tend to be large for the more general lower level courses that many of the students take. As one takes upper level courses or courses more particular to their major the classes will usually be much smaller - sometimes very small. There’s not usually a big issue for most students in taking these general courses in large classes. They do need to make sure they pay attention, seek prof office hours, see TAs, work with fellow students if they need to (which isn’t much different than if the class was smaller).</p>
<p>Getting out in 4 years:
D1 graduated from a CSU in 4 years, despite changing her major three times, having minimal APs, and having major surgery her sophomore year. She could have graduated in 3 1/2, but wanted to stay because she was having so much fun. S2 is at a UC, same story, will have no problem graduating on time, despite changing majors and could graduate early if he wants. One friend graduated from Berkeley, a year early and studied abroad for a semester. What they tell the parents at orientation is that you may not be able to get the exact class at the exact time you want it, but if you are willing to take a class at 8am or on Fridays, it is no problem getting the classes that you need.</p>
<p>Big school: What they tell you at orientation, and what my 2 kids have found to be true, is that you can make a big school small but you can’t make a small school big.</p>
<p>Fwiw, the problem is not so much about graduating in 4 or 5 years (credits help) or getting enough classes to graduate. Schools have few problems expanding the size of the classes at will. That is why there are halllways and corridors. The real issue is getting in classes one wants to take.</p>
<p>Or a less serious note, here is a view of a Cal overcowding issue:</p>
<p>DS (a California resident) is interested in applying for a master’s at one of the schools but they won’t accept any CA residents for Spring 2013 semester; has to wait until fall 2013. He offered to pay OOS tuition (they are taking applications from OOS and international) but they still won’t let him apply.</p>
<p>And now Canadian schools might become options for Californian students, provided they are willing to get a study visa; really, it’s not much more expensive than an UC is set to become.</p>
I TA for a gen ed class. Every quarter my class is crammed full of seniors who’ve been trying to enroll for years. This fall UCLA thankfully finally wised up and reserved a lot of spots for freshmen and sophomores (the ones who really would get the most out of the class), though it nearly caused riots among the seniors who’d been hoping/needing to take it. </p>
<p>It’s definitely possible to get out of UCLA in four years; there’s no question about that. Being able to take the courses you want when you want to…that’s an entirely different question. Some programs are somewhat desperate for students to take their courses, whereas the popular ones (e.g. geography and life sciences) fill up unbelievably fast. </p>
<p>
Large universities work perfectly well for many people, and perhaps she’s one. If it makes you nervous, adding a few smaller universities or LACs to the list (e.g. the Claremonts or Santa Clara) to balance things out might be prudent.</p>
<p>Take a look at the specific major(s) your D would be most likely to take. Some are more affected by budget cuts. For instance, UCLA’s School of Theater, Film and Television had to make serious cuts in productions. They now talk about focusing on training (classroom work) rather than production opportunities for undergrads. Each department may have to make cuts depending in part on the outcome of the election in November.</p>
<p>If the measure does not pass, "UC’s state revenue will fall by $375 million, a cut that comes on top of years of declining state revenue.</p>
<p>“In the last four years, UC’s state appropriation has fallen by $900 million — the equivalent of 27 percent — even as mandatory costs and student enrollment have grown. Costs for health benefits and other required items are projected to continue to rise; absent an infusion in new revenue, UC’s budget deficit could reach $2.9 billion in five years.”</p>
<p>Thanks, everyone. This is all helpful information. Madbean, I need to spend more time reviewing the info at the link you provided. It’s hard to comprehend how the system can make it work. Good to hear from others that students are still having good experiences.</p>
<p>i was interested in tx5’s comment that you can make a big university small. Would love to hear you elaborate on that. Obviously, that’s true for kids in a small program with rigidly defined lockstep requirements (like architecture or something) but I’d love to hear your thoughts on this for kids at a big public u that are not in that kind of program.</p>
<p>Keep in mind that out of state students get priority registration. </p>
<p>My daughter is at a CSU and says that students trying to add classes are often told, “if you’re not a graduating senior, or an out of state student, you have no hope of adding this class.” </p>
<p>Doesn’t apply to every class, but apparently the higher fees paid by OOS’ers buys them something.</p>
<p>Making a big university small: Basically what I think they mean is that in a big university you can find your smaller group. For instance, at UCLA they have over 800 clubs in addition to Greek life. So if you put yourself out there you can find people with similar interests. An example academically at UCLA would be the Fiat Lux Freshman Seminar Program which are one unit pass/no pass classes in a small group setting: [Fiat</a> Lux Freshman Seminar Program > Home](<a href=“http://www.college.ucla.edu/fiatlux/]Fiat”>http://www.college.ucla.edu/fiatlux/)</p>
<p>My daughter, at SDSU, made friends with the people in her dorm, was in a sorority, played intramural soccer and developed a close group of friends in her major (math). </p>
<p>My son, at UCLA, works on campus and has made friends at work, made some really good friends on his hall in the dorm, has played a lot of intramural sports (basketball, volleyball, flag football, etc…), goes to a lot of athletic events on campus as part of the “Den”, joined club tennis, took one or two Fiat Lux classes as a freshman, and has made friends with people in his major. </p>
<p>I have friends with kids at other UC’s, they have joined club volleyball, become involved in Outdoor Adventures, rally crews, dance teams, acapella groups etc… Done a semester abroad or a summer travel study. Many have done research, internships, or gone to a semester or quarter in Washington.</p>
<p>We were in exactly your position last year, skeptical of the UC’s and leaning toward a private college or U. When the results were all in, D had several options within UC and several acceptances to very good private schools. If she had been offered significant financial assistance she probably would have attended a private school, but none was offered. She is now extremely happy at UCSB, with a view of the Pacific Ocean from her dorm bed. We are full pay, and having heard some of the life stories of kids who, against all odds, have found a seat at UC I do not begrudge our tuition payments. </p>
<p>I’m not sure if it’s true of all campuses, but UCSB uses a system of “pass times” for students to enroll in classes. Priority is given to students who require particular courses for their major and based on their accumulated credits. So undeclared Freshmen will have the lowest priority in registering for courses. This becomes less and less of a problem after the first year. </p>
<p>I agree with everything tx5athome has said about making the large school small. In addition to all the special interest groups and sports, the school offers a tutoring service that allows kids to meet in small (less than 30) groups twice per week to review the concepts presented in the larger lectures. They also have the regular discussion sections for each lecture course.</p>
<p>The one concern I have about academics and the effects of the budget cuts is that courses that I feel should be taught by faculty are taught by graduate students or postdoctoral researchers. So far, the quality of teaching does not seem to be compromised and it’s probably better to have an enthusiastic young person who needs the experience teaching some courses than a reluctant faculty who would rather be doing something else. However as the UC’s continue to increase enrollment without concomitant increases in faculty hiring this “problem” is likely to get worse. </p>
<p>I am a bit perplexed by the comments of warblersrule. The variety of courses that satisfy GE requirements is huge, so it’s hard to understand why seniors are clamoring to get in to a specific course. My D did have AP credit that got her out of basic writing and math, so perhaps these are more impacted than the other GE courses.</p>
<p>Berkeley’s current pre-registration system has two phases, where students can register for about half of their schedule in the first phase, then register up to a full schedule in the second phase after everyone has done the first phase.</p>
<p>I’ve never heard that out of state students get priority registration. Can you link to a source, Simbot? </p>
<p>And on a purely anecdotal level, I ran into one of my daughter’s friends yesterday who got through UCLA in two years. (coming out of high school with a fair number of AP and summer school courses–but also taking a heavy course load.)</p>
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