I know this topic has been discussed to exhaustion, but I am not sure if this situation has been covered.
My friend’s grandparents left Belgium for Colombia fleeing the Holocaust. They had my friend’s mother, making her a Colombian national. But soon after they left for the US and lived here ever since. They have no remaining family in South America, have not visited, do not speak the language, and would more readily identify as Jewish culturally. Knowing the perceived advantages of applying as a minority my friend would like to identify themselves as ethnically hispanic/ latino (and racially white).
It is commonly considered appropriate to list who she identifies with culturally/ethnically. If she doesnt identify as latino/hispanic, she should not use it. Sounds like she might have an interesting essay topic though!
As well they shouldn’t. However, the analogy is imperfect. Asian is a race; latino/a is an ethnicity. One can be a white latino, black latino, Asian latino, or any swirl combination.
To the OP, if your friend identifies culturally as latino, by all means he can identify himself as such. If not, don’t.
The OPs friend’s mother happened to be born in SA (to an eastern European family) and the family shortly thereafter relocated to the US. I’d guess the mom has no memory of ever being in South America. In what way,shape or form is this applicant honestly likely to identify as hispanic/latina? Its silly.My children, as the offspring of someone born and raised in Asia for 17 years, would IMO have a more legitimate claim… which they would never make.
@jym626, I think Belgium is east of France or something. I guess that makes it “Eastern European”? (just pulling your chain).
I just wanted to repeat that I am not making a value judgment about what the friend SHOULD do, simply trying to answer the OP’s question about what the friend is within his rights doing.
There are people who live among Native Americans and identify as such, participating fully in cultural events, but who cannot legally prove lineage, and thus cannot claim it officially. Life is unfair in both negative and positive ways.
Why your kids are not proud of their Japanese heritage is a bit of a mystery, but it really is a personal choice and has no bearing on OP’s friend’s “Hispanicity”.
Huh? They have no “japanese heritage”. The closest they have come to experiencing it is exposure to many of the artifacts/decor in our home. They have never set foot on Japanese soil, though we are planning a trip this summer so they will see where DH grew up. Oh wait-- we eat a lot of sushi and dim sum. Does that count?
Many of the college forms have changes their descriptors to say, for example, “African-American/black” because there were, for example, caucasian south africans selecting the AA designation. So, while a fine line exists between what the OP’s friend can “legally” do vs what is the right thing to do, well I would encourage my friends and family to be honest with who they identify with, in the spirit of the question.
A heritage is not something you can choose. Heritage is more of a factual situation than a conscious choice. Understanding where your father was born and grew up for the first 17 years of his life, even as the son of an expat family, is part of understanding that heritage. The cultural forces that formed your Husband, and that are now a part of him by virtue of living in Japan, are part of that Heritage.
I am glad you do find it important enough to go back for a visit, but that is my value judgment.
I think in the apartments of Buenos Aires, Santiago, Lima, Montevideo are many displaced-feeling families that identify as “Europeans”.
This question of identity can be complex, and I would delve into it with my close friends and family after knowing the bounding rules. I would not tell someone NOT to research their roots on a public forum.
They understand it-- they just do not in the least bit identify with it. Are they interested in visiting to see? Sure. Its on the list. Do they hear stories about DHs cliff diving or scuba diving or whatever, having grown up on an island in the South pacific? Sure. Do they identify with it any more opr less than with my having grown up in the NE (they did not). No.
Not understanding how this is at all relevant to the question at hand. The OPs friend mother happened to be born in Colombia but the european family shortly thereafter moved to the US. IMO while technically legal, it is disingenuous for this applicant, who may also have no identification with Colombia or the time her family spent in SA (though sure, she should consider researching it- its probably very interesting) to “self identify” as hispanic/latina if she does not truthfully identify as such. There have been previous discussions about this where questions posed to gauge if a person identifies with a particular group were posed. Will have to look for it. Guess it comes down to: can she? Maybe. Should she? No.
@jym626, the identity of exile, of not belonging, could be considered as a part of the identity of many South American families. I do not pretend to understand what it means to identify, but it may be important for a teenager to understand any feelings of displacement or not belonging, which, as a cohort, is a common identity of those who fled WW II to South America. Why should he not identify with that Exile culture if it is something that pervades his being? Some stayed months or a few years; some stayed lifetimes- they are still a part of that social epoch. Maybe I am being dramatic, and it does not pervade his being. I don’t know. Researching and understanding this out-migration may help him to surface and sort out feelings he does not even know he has. I would not presume to make that value judgment. I would not tell someone NOT to research his roots in a public forum. I do not know what it means to identify with this cohort of persecuted exiles and their progeny.
Should [s]he [identify as latino]? Who are you (or I) to say without a much deeper understanding?
The original question did not ask “Should”:
Also, I choose the masculine pronoun “he” simply because the OP used “latino”, not “latina”.
But if you read the OP, the student is a “she”.
ANd the family “fled the holocaust”. We can assume it means they are Jewish, but it could possibly mean someone was a member of the SS. Regardless, some of the "ethnicity questions that have been posed to “test” affiliation (for lack of a better word) are: Do you identify as XXXXX? Do you speak XXXXX in your home? Do you belong to clubs/organizations that are associated with this ethnicity? Etc. These are the more ethical tests of whether the OPs friend “should” mark yes. She might feel a bit awkward if she is invited to a minority campus visit weekend or invited to interview for a minority scholarship. Yes, her selection of “yes” to Latina is explainable, but …
The only pronoun reference in the OP speaks of the friend’s mother, who is a “she”. This sentence is meant to convey that the friend’s grandparents gave birth to the friend’s mother in the brief (how brief?) time the grandparents were in Colombia.
I’m sorry, we seem to be getting far afield here. I really think we have very limited information presented here. However, I know that there is much depth to many stories. I am simply stating that while I would make this decision on other than strictly legal, technical grounds, I am suspending judgment since I do not have a full picture.
My posts (after the first one) have more to do with protecting my “reputation” (as not a slimy, “all that matters is the narrow technical/legal definition” proponent) than they do with helping the OP. I think there is no value in further debating. Perhaps PM if you would like?
All that other stuff that you suggest… sure, maybe the student might at some point have an interest in researching their genealogy, family history or what have you. But it is , IMO, irrelevant to the current question. If the student has no current affiliation/association/identity other than happenstance of a few months of her mothers early life, then IMO its disengenuous to say “yes”.
Does “Hispanic” also embody the mass in-migration of those fleeing the Holocaust, and landing on the shores of America (i.e. South America)? If it does, the OP’s friend’s experience and identity may be wrapped up in that “Hispanic” social epoch. Whether or not the mother is a Colombian national, the exile is part of her. That she happened to be also born in Colombia puts the friend into this arbitrary “legal” classification/grouping.
Perhaps the op’s friend is a he. Apologies if I misread the female reference to the mother. Not interested in a backchannel discussion. I think it is fine right here where it is. The OP said the friend has no family in SA, they do not speak the language, do not identify culturally, etc. I think I’ve made my position clear.
And fwiw, I assume the family is Jewish, not really a member of the SS. Was just following the logic of the discussion re: family of origin and histor . And, I also suspect the Op was asking , not really for a “friend”…
