<p>Okay. That’s good. It’s just as I said before though, I’m highly surprised that a lot of people with good enough grades to get into MIT are that interested in partying and getting drunk.</p>
<p>^ I’m still confused by why you think these two traits can’t go together.</p>
<p>I lived in a frat for four years (you could do that back then, now it would be three). We had several fraternity brothers who were teetotal, for a variety of reasons. We still threw pretty good parties.</p>
<p>I don’t think that between high school and university my sense of what makes a party fun changed, though I think that the people did. If I went to a big, loud party in high school with music, dancing, alcohol, I found that I did not enjoy it that much. This had less to do with the music, or with the alcohol, or with the dancing, but really with the people. I just did not have all that in common with the people I would end up talking to at HS parties. Whereas somehow, the same elements at an MIT party were a lot more fun, often because I had a lot more to talk about with the people who were at the party.</p>
<p>onamatapia doesn’t like “making conversation with people you don’t know.” Whereas I learned to love this. With some 4300 undergraduates on campus, you won’t know everybody, the way you did in HS. I had some amazing conversations with strangers at MIT parties. Some of those people are still my friends many years later. You will find that if you are willing to talk to strangers at MIT, amazing things can happen. The party scene, such as it is, provides an ideal opportunity and socially prepared environment to do just that. I know of two marriages that eventually resulted from what started out as conversations with strangers at MIT parties.</p>
<p>For what it is worth, I like lots of different sorts of parties, sometimes I do like to thrash around on the dance floor, other times I like things much more subdued. My fraternity (and of course your mileage may vary) threw a wide variety of parties, from formal dinners in black tie, to quieter games-evenings, to the odd loud toga dance party. Nobody in the house was required to attend any of them, but most of us did. And yet, it is always a tiny percentage of the parties that attract all of the press. </p>
<p>There are 4300 undergraduates at MIT. Whatever forms your idea of the “right” social scene, you are likely to find it at MIT. Though as Molly indicated earlier, a strong part of the MIT ethos is that you do not judge those who make decisions that are different than your. A tolerance of other’s valid choices is a real part of the MIT culture.</p>
<p>Piper: I have NEVER met anyone who had both of those traits. In my whole entire life. It seems strange and counterintuitive. Honestly, I think getting drunk is plain stupid, so I don’t see how anyone who is smart would make a stupid decision like that.</p>
<p>Mikalye: “With some 4300 undergraduates on campus, you won’t know everybody, the way you did in HS.”
I don’t know everyone in my high school. We have over 2000 students. I don’t even know all the people in my grade.</p>
<p>You kind find all kinds of parties here, specially p-set parties (a party, you know, to do your p-sets).
One thing I have to say, geeks party hard! In frat rush, I’ve been to SEVEN parties at one night!</p>
<p>
Well, not to stir the pot, but some people at MIT even do harder drugs than alcohol. </p>
<p>Overall, most people at MIT are light to moderate drinkers. Some drink a lot, and some don’t drink at all. All of this variation is normal within a college-aged population. </p>
<p>Again, I want to point out that I do understand where you’re coming from – the smart kids at my high school were mostly also the good kids, and alcohol was a particularly heavily-demonized vice. But college is different from high school, and even people who didn’t drink at all in high school tend to drink in college, at least every so often. It’s important to learn how to drink responsibly if you choose to drink. But just because you think getting drunk is stupid does not mean that other smart people, especially those a few years older than you are, agree with you.</p>
<p>But the thing is, I can’t think of any reasons why getting drunk would NOT be stupid, so it completely baffles me how an intelligent person could make a decision like that. It seems like a conclusion any intelligent person would come to, and yet, it apparently isn’t. And this depresses me.</p>
<p>^ Why do you think getting drunk is “just plain stupid”? (Certainly, getting drunk in improper circumstances can lead to stupidity. Then again, people can pull stupid stunts in cars - that doesn’t make all driving stupid.)</p>
<p>In general, MIT is a place where people get over themselves and stop judging those who are being productive and not hurting anyone. If a lifestyle’s not for you, then it’s not from you (I don’t get drunk either!). </p>
<p>But I think it’s sort of pointless and irrationally high-and-mighty to define a lifestyle that might include getting drunk at a party “stupid”. Maybe you’ll change your mind about its stupidity once you see people who do fine in their academics, have fun in their activities, make an impact in their community, and enjoy a good stereotypical frat party on a Friday night.</p>
<p>There’s a lot of room to grow at MIT - but you have to be open to it.</p>
<p>When I drive (well, once I get my license; I’m 15 right now), I would use my sense of judgement to know not to do stupid things. If I were to drink, my sense of judgement is messed up, quite easily leading to me doing stupid things. This is also exactly why mixing the two, drinking and driving, is a bad idea.</p>
<p>And as of right now, a smart guy who likes getting drunk at parties seems like an oxymoron. I have never met one, and it just doesn’t make sense to me. And yet, it seems like they actually somehow exist, and this depresses me.</p>
<p>“But I think it’s sort of pointless and irrationally high-and-mighty to define a lifestyle that might include getting drunk at a party “stupid”.”</p>
<p>If I didn’t think it was stupid I would likely take part in that lifestyle. It does seem pretty fun. It just also happens to seem pretty stupid.</p>
<p>You’re conflating different types of judgment. Drinking strongly affects your reflexes - so, absolutely, you shouldn’t drink and drive, or operate heavy machinery, or fly a plane, etc. So don’t place yourself in a situation where you’re both drunk and where you need the capabilities that alcohol takes away. That’s what people at MIT do - you don’t need to be sober to laugh your butt off playing rockband.</p>
<p>Piper: You ignored the other two things I said.</p>
<p>onamatapia - Huh, did you edit your post? It only showed the first paragraph when I read it last night. I’ll respond to the rest now.</p>
<p>In any case, you still haven’t answered why you think it’s stupid. So in your short life where you’ve probably met very few people, you’ve never met someone with both of these traits before - why does that mean those traits can’t coexist? Why in the world would it depress you that they can? </p>
<p>I understand that you think it’s stupid. I just want to know your reasoning.</p>
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<p>Not very surprising at all. In fact, work gets crazier as you go on, and in the process, by default you go a little crazy because you’re tapping into sides of you that are hard to reach. It’s no wonder why people tap into other sides of themselves.</p>
<p>The thing is if you only tapped into the getting drunk side, then you’d end up like a majority of people without the work ethic to do productive things.</p>
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<p>Why? It’s quite interesting and makes a lot of sense. I am quite on the opposite spectrum and don’t like the drink-and-party thing, but it doesn’t depress me simply because it makes a lot of sense. </p>
<p>It is true that all academically motivated people have some internal motivation, which binds them together. But the sources of internal motivation can be quite distinct.</p>
<p>It would depress me if everyone’s style were to work hard half the time and get drunk and party the other half, but not if there’s a mix.</p>
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<p>There are a lot of things that are quite stupid in some sense. Playing an addictive video game is stupid, because you are enslaving yourself willingly. Trusting someone to understand how you feel is stupid, because maybe they really never can. Devoting your life to academia is stupid, because it’s a huge gamble, and you’re probably smart enough to do something else (and who really buys that “I love it” junk?? most people are probably conditioned to say things like that, and may not mean it). Caring way too much about school is stupid, because you’re going to die anyway. </p>
<p>With all of the above things, I would probably advise most people to just avoid doing it. Unless they know very well what they’re getting into, won’t be harming anyone else, and are just crazy enough to do it anyway.</p>
<p>mathboy98, you make me laugh :D</p>
<p>"Oh, and also, in this case, by ‘party’ I mean big frat parties where the only activities are drinking (which I don’t like) and making conversation with people you don’t know (which I don’t like). "</p>
<p>The first part of this statement is pure conjecture. You’ve obviously never had anything to drink before, so you can’t at all say that you don’t like it.</p>
<p>The second part of this statement is the blunt of your problem. You clearly have no need for social interaction in your life, which is unfortunate. Perhaps when you get a little older and develop your social skills, you might have a little appreciation for alcohol. Responsible amounts, of course, never in excess.</p>
<p>This whole “every 4.0 student is socially awkward and isn’t popular” thing is BS. I know people in my school that are pretty smart, myself included (granted not MIT smart, but top 20 university) that have lots of friends and like to drink occasionally when we don’t have other priorities.</p>
<p>Piper: I think it’s stupid because of the high risk of doing something that you’ll really regret.</p>
<p>The Rhino: “The first part of this statement is pure conjecture. You’ve obviously never had anything to drink before, so you can’t at all say that you don’t like it.”
Not liking =/= not enjoying. I’m sure I would enjoy alcohol, I just do not like to take big risks of doing something I’ll regret later.</p>
<p>“The second part of this statement is the blunt of your problem. You clearly have no need for social interaction in your life, which is unfortunate. Perhaps when you get a little older and develop your social skills, you might have a little appreciation for alcohol. Responsible amounts, of course, never in excess.”
I need social interaction, I just want it to be with people whom I actually know. I love talking to my friends. It’s easy, I know what to say, and I feel comfortable. I don’t like talking to people I don’t know. It’s hard, I don’t know what to say, and I feel uncomfortable.</p>
<p>“This whole “every 4.0 student is socially awkward and isn’t popular” thing is BS. I know people in my school that are pretty smart, myself included (granted not MIT smart, but top 20 university) that have lots of friends and like to drink occasionally when we don’t have other priorities.”
I have never met a 4.0 student who drinks. And there is literally only one 4.0 student at my school who has tons of friends.</p>
<p>MathBoy: “why?”</p>
<p>It’s called cognitive dissonance. The state of believeing two contradictory things at once, or in this case, having logic seemingly lead to two contradictory conclusions at once. On one side, my logic is telling me it is completely irrational to take the risk of doing something stupid by getting drunk, which leads to the conclusion that getting drunk is stupid. But on the other side, most everybody gets drunk, even smart people, which logically leads to the conclusion that getting drunk is not stupid. See, two contradictory conclusions. When this happens, a person tends to feel depressed and experience “dissonance”. The person either changes their belief, or rejects evidence that challenges their belief. I haven’t really done either, which is why I am continually feeling depressed.</p>
<p>This is a funny thread.</p>
<p>I would say that the vast majority of MIT’s students weren’t partiers in high school, and probably didn’t drink either. Some of the people I consider non-drinkers may have tried it, but in general, they were like the smart high school clique that onamatopeia is familiar with.</p>
<p>Most people drink in college. It’s kind of viewed as part of the college experience, including (unfortunately) binge drinking. So people do it. Some of the frat guys I knew were trying very hard to not be a nerd, so that was a contributing factor to some of the reckless drinking I saw. MIT has a reputation for parties (“work hard, play hard” is an advertised motto) because of the large Greek system, so there is an effort to maintain it. The dorm parties are tamer (though people do drink there, and certainly sometimes to excess.) Some people do get addicted to alcohol, and don’t try particularly hard to stop themselves since it’s viewed as socially acceptable in college. I would guess that for most, the binge drinking ends after graduation.</p>
<p>In general, I think many MIT people make an effort to be more social when they get to college. It’s even pushed by the administration somewhat. One administrator at MIT told a group of MIT students need to “learn how to socialize, and spend less time in their rooms studying” to be successful in business. (This did bother me more than a bit; maybe the profs should assign less work if they want us to have more time to socialize.)</p>