catholic vs. non catholic

College Search & Selection
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<p>Agreed. Scranton is a lovely school and doing very well. Fordham’s president was the former president at Scranton. </p>

<p>Glasses: I agree. Its hard to define a Jesuit education, but there is a unique ethos and ethic about them. No, growth is not limited to Jesuit schools and I didnt mean to imply that of course. That would be silly. </p>

<p>Nor do I pit Jesuit schools against Villanova, Providence, Notre Dame, Siena, Franciscan, U San Diego or any other catholic school. </p>

<p>Kids/Parents have to pick the school which is best for them, which is most affordable for them and which will give them the best opportunities. </p>

<p>I promote Jesuit schools in general for anyone, Catholic or non-Catholic alike.</p>

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<p>1sokkermom ~ as you know I agree with all you said ;)</p>

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<p>Agreed. As the parent of 2 Jesuit educated children and a Jesuit educated husband, I can tell you they all have benefited greatly from the experience. We visited other Catholic schools which we liked, but the Jesuit influence just drew them in. And we are not Catholic or even overly religious. </p>

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<p>Also agreed.</p>

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<p>It really depends on the one you are thinking about</p>

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<p>One more tidbit about Fordham’s articulate, well-educated President: he is a graduate of Boston College!</p>

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<p>He is indeed. But a native of New York:</p>

<p>Father McShane grew up in New York City and graduated from Regis High School. He earned his bachelor’s degree from Boston College and went on to pursue a Master’s degree from the same institution in 1972. In 1977 McShane was ordained as a Jesuit priest, after receiving his M.Div and S.T.M. degrees from the Jesuit School of Theology at Berkeley. In 1981, Father McShane received his PhD in the history of Christianity from the University of Chicago.</p>

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<p>Open-minded in what sense? The problem into which the Jesuit universities have been running in recent years is a perception that “open-minded” essentially means that Church teaching is optional belief, when in fact it’s not.</p>

<p>And I don’t understand why someone would voluntarily attend a Catholic school and then complain that they don’t offer contraception. You pick a Catholic university and then raise hell because it’s Catholic? LOL</p>

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<p>Baelor, this sounds to me like an appropriate concern for a Catholic, but not really relevant to the OP’s question. She’s not Catholic.</p>

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<p>Again, I wasn’t trying to address Catholics; I was trying to address the non-Catholic questioner, who asked about non-Catholics’ experiences at Catholic colleges. Obviously, my Jewish friend was surprised by the Student Health policies at Georgetown. You obviously find that risible. But I think it’s something that non-Catholics might legitimately want to be aware of, even though they might not think of it on their own. Perhaps you overestimate non-Catholics’ familiarity with Catholic doctrine or its influence on the working of Catholic colleges. After all, you yourself seem to complain that many Catholic colleges aren’t Catholic enough. So how’s a non-Catholic girl to know?</p>

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<p>At BC, (I’m an alum), the “Religion” requirement can be met in any number of classes from Philosophy, History or Theology. You can study just about any religion you care to: Buddhism, Catholicism, Islam, Judaism, even the Pagans. These classes are no different than those offered at most universities or LACs around the world. Perhaps the only difference is that at BC they are taught by professors who have been on the front lines, so to speak. </p>

<p>The Jesuits have a tradition of scientific and philosophical training and research. At BC I was taught to analyze all sides of an issue/belief. I was taught to challenge every position in order to understand its strengths and weaknesses. I was taught that an unquestioned belief is an immature and ultimately weak belief. If you don’t challenge yourself somebody else will. Or, as the Jesuit who taught my Finance class said to me, right after eviscerating my business plan in front of the entire class, “Daniel walked into a lion’s den, not one filled with kittens.”</p>

<p>There are degrees of daily Catholic influence at different colleges. In my experience, Notre Dame and Villanova have the strongest presence, with Fordham, BC and Georgetown far down the list. The last three are not secular, but they also don’t blindly subscribe to and promote dogma as some would like them to. In the Jesuit tradition you are free to believe anything you like, you’d just better be ready to intelligently and thoughtfully defend your position.</p>

<p>All that said, I do chuckle when someone asks if a school is “too Catholic”. It’s not as if last Tuesday the Board of Trustees had a vote, “Come on, we need a decision, by a show of hands, Catholic or Druid”. They’ve been Catholic from the start. If you’re worried at all about religious influence then go somewhere else, there are plenty of options. However, if you want excellent training in the skill of intelligent questioning along with a tradition of community involvement and service, I cannot think of a better environment than a Jesuit university.</p>

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<p>It’s relevant to all students who may be looking at Catholic universities. What “open-mindedness” actually means on a particular campus is relevant. Plus, although it may seem to affect Catholics exclusively, the tension that may exist on campus between orthodox and liberal factions, if you will, is going to affect the entire student body. Consider something like ND’s decision to invite Obama – a Catholic campus that has any vestige of Catholicism will necessarily be affected in some way by Catholicism, and this has repercussions for the entire student body.</p>

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<p>First, I am not arguing that Catholic colleges aren’t Catholic enough per se – I’m simply stating that the Church views the Catholic label as something serious, and I agree. It’s simply a matter of being in line with what you say you believe. I don’t really care what that is. I just want consistency.</p>

<p>Second, I don’t view this as a matter of being aware of Catholic doctrine. I view this as being knowledgeable about the university that you have selected, regardless of religious affiliation. The Catholic affiliation simply (or presumably) makes understanding how the university works a bit easier, given that you have a (presumably) consistent framework for the university policies and decisions. But if sexual health is important to you, I don’t see why you wouldn’t do research about it beforehand – it’s the process that everyone should go through. Again, the religious aspect is only a shortcut.</p>

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<p>vinceh,</p>

<p>Thank you for that eloquent exposition of Jesuit education. There is not enough said about its virtues, thus extending life to the mindless drivel that passes for truth amongst the masses. Your contribution is greatly appreciated.</p>

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<p>You can be as orthodox Catholic at a Jesuit College as you wish to be. Nobody will stop you or humiliate you. Likewise, a non-catholic is free to make strong inquiry into the Church at a Jesuit college. Many do. Some have earned doctorates in Theology at a Jesuit college, such as the story I relayed above about the Lutheran Pastor in residence at Princeton. </p>

<p>The Jesuits teach you how to think critically, not what to think. And not all Jesuits are liberals or “heretics” as some believe. Many are rather conservative and orthodox on theological issues. If you want DOCTRINE, then go to Christendom College in Virginia or Ave Maria in Florida. You will be served up a steady diet of Catholic doctrine 24.7. </p>

<p>Villanova has perhaps a reputation as being more Catholic, but I think that stems more from its student body being a larger percentage Catholic than many Jesuits, not because the Augustinians there are jamming orthodoxy down your throat. While Notre Dame’s student body is more leaning to the right and orthodoxy, the faculty is anything but that, there. Plenty of liberals and “open-minded” faculty at Notre Dame. </p>

<p>Fordham is a superb example, I deign to use again. Because its as Catholic as you want it to be. You can attend daily mass, weekly mass or no mass at all. You have a huge selection of philosophy and theology courses. There are fabulous Jesuits teaching there and in the administration. There are also diocesan priests teaching there, two of whom I know are incredible scholars and warm endearing and inclusive souls. But you have Lutheran, Jewish, Orthodox Christian faculty as well. And if you want, you can simply regard Fordham as secular and ignore its religious heritage. Its up to YOU to embrace your faith. Nobody is going to force you to do that, or shun you if you don’t. Faith is a personal experience and communal experience, if you choose. </p>

<p>There are also fabulous historical religion classes at Fordham, teaching the full truth, with all its warts and rich history. You can focus on the Irish Troubles, or you can focus on the Church in Civil Rights Movements of the 60’s. Or you can focus on Medieval Church History. Or New York Catholics. On and on.</p>

<p>Some people expect incense to be burning all the time and monks to be singing in the background. That is all fine and lovely (and which I enjoy when offered), but its not what makes us “Catholic.” FAITH is what makes us Catholic Christians and to a Jesuit that is an intellectual exercise as well as spiritual or physical. </p>

<p>To a Jewish student or non-catholic, I suppose going to the healthclinic and asking for contraceptive devices is not peculiar at a Catholic college. But it really is unfortunate if they get upset when the answer is no. We wouldnt go to the bookstore at Yeshiva or Brandeis and ask them if they sell rosary beads and crucifixes and get upset if they say no. We won’t judge, but we also won’t acquiesce to values we find contrary to our Catholic teaching. Provocation is not always a good thing. Provocation for the sake of being provocative is insulting and disrespectful. Not saying that is what happened at Georgetown, just food for thought. </p>

<p>I know Christians who come to Catholic colleges and expected (desired) it to be more in line with Catholic doctrine and were surprised at how lax it is. I concur. Being Catholic is not like being on a soccer team where you can switch jerseys or put the uniform on or off. Its a faith journey and people should take their commitment seriously. On the other hand, the Church should be open to discussion on any number of hot item issues, such as celibacy and the modern priesthood, or the role of women in the Church. </p>

<p>In short we should be filled with pride when a non catholic seeks an education at a Roman Catholic college. Welcome them and embrace them, just don’t proselytize them.</p>

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<p>ghostbuster - Thank YOU! Another worthy example of setting the record straight.</p>

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<p>thanks so much for all of the info guys, this has been so helpful</p>

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<p>Holy Cross and Georgetown are Jesuit schools and as others have posted, they tend to be more liberal.</p>