Chances for Harvard, MIT, Princeton, etc.

Chance Me / Match Me!
1

I’m an Asian male, and I’m graduating early, after sophomore year (so high school class of '16). Here are my classes:

Eighth grade:
AP Calculus BC

Freshman:
Bio H
Chem H
Art
PE
English H
Debate
French 1
PhD. Seminar at UCLA
Independent research at UCLA

Summer:
World History
Freshman English at community college

(Tentative) Sophomore:
AP Govt
AP Econ
AP US History
Art 2
PE
English 2 H
Astrobiology
Independent research at UCLA
Long distance research class in Norway
PhD. Seminar at UCLA

Overall GPA: 4.6 weighted, 3.89 unweighted. I only got one B.

Standardized tests:
ACT: 34. Breakdown: 33 Reading, 36 Math, 34 Science, 34 English
SAT IIs: 800 Math, 760 Chemistry.
AP scores: 5 Calculus BC, 4 Physics C: Mech (both in eighth grade, if that helps), 4 Chemistry, 3 Physics C: E&M (weak, yes) (also, both are in freshman year).

Extracurriculars:
Vice Prez of tutorial club
Founder of philosophy club
Started abstract algebra seminars at school
Reviewer for Zentralblatt Math
Volunteer for Interact, CSF
Independent and collaborative research at UCLA
Research Fellow at distinguished research institute in India
Given multiple research talks to both professionals and high school students
Co-organizer of the school’s science fair

Awards:
Intel ISEF First place and Best of Category winner (EUCYS award winner)
First place winner in my category in California State Science Fair
First place winner in my category in the Los Angeles county science fair
Intel Excellence in Computer Science award
Mu Alpha Theta award for the most challenging, original, and creative research in mathematics
One paper published

Essay:
Not yet finished, but mentors and teachers say that the drafts are really strong.

Recommendations:
My research mentor and a former teacher (who just retired). Both absolutely love me, and I’m sure the recommendation will be solid.

If needed: My mentor is contacting professors at the universities I’m applying to talk to the admissions offices of the respective colleges. I’ve also gotten mails (specifically directed towards me) from people from HYSPM who I met at ISEF encouraging me to apply and congratulating me.

The colleges I’m applying to:
Harvard
MIT
U Chicago
UCLA
UCB
UCR (this is my backup)
Caltech
Princeton
Cornell

When responding, please keep in mind that I’m graduating early from high school.

2

You only have ONE safety school? There are so many other schools that you can apply to that would love to have you and that are soo much more prestigious than UCR. Try other UCs, UCSD is nice.

What’s your intended major?

Ok. I have to say the with the exception of all the UCs, everything is a reach. Yes. You are a great student (although graduating early doesn’t make you a special snowflake), but keep in mind that admissions to HYPSM+other Ivies+Caltech+UChicago is a TOTAL CRAPSHOOT. Caltech holds the country’s highest average test scores for any university, don’t get me started on Harvard. I can tell for a fact that you will get into at least one of them, but at the moment, it’s very hard to tell which one. Leave that to luck and the AOs. As for the UCs, I don’t know how to calculate your UC GPA (since they traditionally use 10-11 only) but your test scores seem solid, and you are a very well rounded applicant.

3

Yes, of course, it’s a hard collection of colleges. I’m editing the list this summer, and adding more backups (and perhaps removing some of the selective colleges).

My intended major is mathematics.

4

Pretty interesting stuff there; as a math w/ CS major at MIT, I’d say you have a pretty good chance at getting accepted to at least one of those schools.

Ph. D. seminar at UCLA your freshman year of HS? What mathematics topics did you learn?

5

Thanks! The class I took was on topological modular forms, an advanced research field of algebraic topology (more specifically homotopy theory).

6

Nice… :slight_smile:

(I haven’t taken many algebra classes at MIT, mostly been taking CS-related classes recently)

7

Mhm! I’m currently studying Turing machines and stuff (you may know about that).

8

@TopologyisFun, you are obviously brilliant and highly accomplished. You will get in to at least one HYPSM and probably more, and you will be smarter than 95-99% of the very talented kids at that level.

But top colleges will also be cautious about how many 16 year old geniuses they take. Success in life is about so much more than being smart, and you will spend the rest of your life in a world run by people who aren’t as smart as you.

For all your brilliance, how do you distinguish yourself from this 16 year old SoCal Asian math genius and ISEF grand prize in category winner?

http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/what-my-chances/1791886-chances-for-hypsm.html

9

@renaissancedad Of course, I’ve been told this. My mentors specifically told me that they would mention that I am quite mature for my age, and I plan on explaining why I’m graduating early in my essays. One of the reasons is that I do not have too many resources at school, and personal problems make it hard to travel to colleges to study. I love math, and going to college provide me with so many more resources and opportunities.

As for the other person (whose presented information looks a lot like mine, but I promise you, he isn’t me): I won at ISEF in 2015, too, in the mathematics category. Since there are only two best of category winners from California, the other person won it in the software category (check the ISEF website, if you wish, to clarify this). In addition, if this matters, my research is more theoretical than his. I’ve begun to take classes at UCLA since I was a freshman, while he began in his junior year. My GPA is slightly lower than his, as is my class rank. I’m not a board member of as many clubs as he is (I’m the Vice Prez of one, and founder of another). He’s in a sport, I’m not.

10

I actually thought the other applicant was you when I checked the ISEF site for his thread!

My point is not that you are the same. But schools will tend to group you together.

You sound mature, and we’ll grounded. I would emphasize those. Your brilliance speaks for itself.

Good luck!

11

@renaissancedad Got it. I guess personally, as humans, both of us are different, whereas as numbers, we’re the same.

I was hoping you could tell me whether the Intel STS finalist decisions come out in time to tell the admissions officers. Do they? How about semi finalist decisions?

12

I should probably mention that I got an A+ in all of my UCLA classes.

13

@RenaissanceDad I think I was the goy in the other thread. Thanks for the response, by the way.

@TopologyisFun, I would highly advise you to consider graduating after junior year. It’s almost impossible to have finished enough courses after sophomore year to be a viable ‘I’ve exhausted my resources’ candidate. I’ve gotten to talk some with Chris Peterson (who also sent me that little book thingey, which was by far the coolest letter), both in person and by email, as well as a lot of alumni and parents of kids who graduated early. If you can figure out a way for your school to let you take AP Lang next year, that would be best. I’m graduating as a junior, and I’ve gotten authorization to double englishes and histories (and my math track is already done).

As for specific schools, Caltech and MIT are ok (depending on the applicant pool for the early grads), Harvard and the other ivies are unlikely, UC’s basically dont admit us. I would email Chris and ask for his advice, he’s a really nice guy and gave me a lot of good advice about this stuff. Just my two cents.

14

@chancethrow7815 Unfortunately, due to visa problems, I can’t stay in the U.S. for longer than a year starting now, unless I get a student visa (which is one more reason I’m graduating early).

I’m also taking two English classes and two social sciences next year! One of the English classes is a sophomore English class at my community college. In addition, my mentor moved to Australia, which makes research slightly hard. Going to college early would also be beneficial to me in that respect. Also, personal problems don’t allow me to go to UCLA as often as before, which is an obstruction to me being able to do research and continuing to learn math, and I love math (as you’ve probably figured out by now).

I’m in contact with Chris (and oh yes, that book was amazing!), and I’ve asked him questions about it. As long as I’m mature enough and I have a valid reason for graduating early, I should be fine (that’s what the MIT admissions blog says, at least).

15

@TopologyisFun Sorry for being a bit off topic, but are you a US citizen? If not, how can you participate in the STS?

16

You don’t need to be a U.S. citizen to take part in STS, do you? Just attending a U.S. school.

17

@TopologisFun and @chancethrow7815, you are both outstanding and amazing applicants. You are clearly 2 very different people, but demographically and academically you will be lumped together. It’s not an ideal system, but most top colleges look to build a balanced and diverse class, and they will want to make sure that overqualified geniuses are going to fit in and not be social misfits. You both sound extremely mature and I expect you will do great wherever you end up. I suspect Caltech and MIT would be more inclined to take more people with your kind of achievements and credentials.

Consider the following 2 recent Asian SoCal applicants from a year ago:

  • Applicant 1 was his HS valedictorian with a 4.0 UW GPA (4.98W) taking the hardest schedule ever at his HS, including calculus as a freshman. He had a 2400 SAT I and 36 ACT, with 800's in 7 SAT II subjects. California State Science Fair student of the year. He won ISEF 1st place in category (and won other ISEF awards in 2 previous years) and was 2nd place STS and a Siemens semi-finalist. He was a USAMO/USAChO/USAPhO finalist. He won a $10,000 Davidson Fellows prize for a mathematics project entitled "Strongly Coupled Electromechanical Modeling of the Heart in Moving Domains Using the Phase-Field Method", inspired by his own experience with a minor heart problem. He took college classes at UC Irvine since he was a HS freshman. He placed 2nd in a Junior Science and Humanities Symposium and 4th in the U.S. DOE's National Science Bowl. He was president of his HS math and physics clubs, and founded a club. He is a 3rd degree black belt in teakwondo, and also enjoys music and basketball.
  • Applicant 2 was an Intel STS winner, Google Science Fair Global Grand Prize winner, Siemens Individual Grand Prize winner, and 2-time ISEF 1st place winner. He won a $25,000 Davidson Fellows prize for a science project entitled "Computer-Aided Discovery of Novel Anti-Flu Drug Candidates to Fight Pandemics". He was a first co-author in a paper published in ACS Medicinal Chemistry, and has a patent on file. He founded and was president of Club Intrigue, an science outreach program to help start science fair and science olympiad programs at other schools, and of Senior Space, a program to help senior chinese citizens access online resources. He qualified for the U.S. Junior Olympics in fencing.

Both applicants are now at Harvard. I don’t know the details of where else applicant 2 got in, or how (SCEA vs. RD), or where else he applied. Applicant 1 got in everywhere he applied EXCEPT Stanford (rejected) and Harvard (wait-listed). He was eventually admitted to Harvard off of the wait-list.

Like the 2 of you, these 2 applicants were ridiculously smart and over-qualified. They will both be smarter than 99% of students at Harvard, and will likely both do very well. But my point is that adcoms seem to be a bit cautious about admitting too many over-qualified people like this, and probably treated them as similar given their SoCal and Asian male/STEM background. So just keep this in mind.

@TopologyisFun, you seem to have a number of reasons compelling you to apply 2 years early. I’m certainly not suggesting that they aren’t legitimate, nor that you aren’t ready for college. But many schools will view that as a potential issue. MIT and Caltech may not, but a lot will. They will question whether you are mature enough to handle the college environment, and whether you are applying just because of your Visa situation. I wasn’t nearly as smart as either of you, but I was probably in the top 5% of “smart” people I met at Stanford, and I ran out of classes in some areas at my HS by the end of my junior year, in a era where there weren’t the kind of outside options that there are today. I considered applying early and decided not to, and it was a great decision. I wouldn’t have been ready, and my senior year was my best year by far in terms of personal growth and development. I’m not you, and you are both smarter and apparently more mature than I was, but be aware that this will be a significant consideration when you apply.

You both sound like outstanding people. Good luck!

18

@TopologyisFun Ouch, i had no idea that you were an international. That’s going to make it even tougher. I wish you the best of luck, but I would highly consider making sure you have other options open.

19

I wouldn’t discourage @TopologyisFun at all. His qualifications are impeccable, and he sounds mature and well grounded. But being an international applicant and applying 2 years early will definitely make things harder, so I think having options open is good.

@TopologyisFun, have you thought about applying to Oxford or Cambridge? I don’t know how those schools view younger applicants, but brilliance in your course of study is highly valued, and your exceptional mathematical talent would make you a very strong applicant. It’s another path worth considering, though if I had to guess I suspect you will get in to MIT and Caltech. Harvard and Princeton will depend on how they view your early status, and Stanford would probably be the least likely of the top U.S. schools.

20

@renaissancedad Stanford doesn’t take early applicants, period. Their CDS specifically prohibits it. Actually, now that I’m looking, Princeton and Cornell don’t allow them, either. As far as I can tell, you haven’t passed the freshman admit req’s at the UC’s, either. Some of them are rather esoteric. Maybe your scores are good enough to test out, but I’ve heard that the admit rate for those applicants is less than 1% (i.e. less than one UC gets into ANY university). @TopologyisFun, just something to think about.