Chances for Ivy/other schools, ED vs. regular

Chance Me / Match Me!
1

<p>Hello there. As I'm sure everyone else is doing, I'm considering my list of colleges to which I intend to apply. In particular, I was pondering the possibility of applying ED to Wharton; while I didn't originally intend to apply ED since I wanted to potentially scout out scholarships to lower-ranked schools, I'm now highly considering it. </p>

<p>I intend to major into something regarding business, finances, or economics. Schools I'm looking into include standard Ivies: Columbia, UPenn (Wharton), Harvard, Princeton, etc. In particular interest are Columbia and UPenn, to which I may apply ED since they both have great business schools. University of Chicago is also a big consideration. I'm also looking at more local schools that may offer scholarships, including WashU, University of Michigan, etc. A general assessment would do very nicely though.</p>

<p>Anyway, my stats:</p>

<p>Note: I moved at the end of my sophomore year. Anything before a slash means 9th/10th, and anything afterwards means 11th/12th.</p>

<p>General Info:
Ethnicity: Asian (Chinese)
Location: Illinois (previously lived in Missouri)
School: Top 10 in Missouri / Top 10 in Illinois (which means a lot more)
Rank: Top 5 by the end of Sophomore year / No class rank
Current GPA: 4.0 UW, 4.3 or 4.4 Weighted (but keep in mind transferring lowered this a bit. For instance, my freshman and sophomore English classes and my sophomore history class were originally weighted but lost the weight during the transfer)</p>

<p>Notable courses:
9th: None
10th: AP Calculus AB, AP World History
11th: AP Calculus BC (transfer messed things up), AP Physics, AP English Language and Comp., AP Macro/Microeconomics
12th: AP Statistics, AP Chemistry, AP English Literature and Comp., AP US/Comp. Gov, AP Spanish Language, Calculus III/Advanced Linear Algebra</p>

<p>Testing Scores:
ACT:
10th Grade: 36 Comp / 35 English / 35 Math / 36 Reading / 36 Sci / 10 Essay
11th Grade (state test): 35 Comp / 35 English / 36 Math / 33 Reading / 35 Sci / 11 Essay</p>

<p>SAT:
11th Grade: 2280 Comp / 730 Reading (eww) / 770 Math / 790 Writing / 11 Essay
Will retake in 12th grade (although I'm not sure if I have to considering my 36; I just don't feel comfortable with a 2280 on the SAT)</p>

<p>SAT IIs:
Math II: 800
Physics: 800
World History: 790</p>

<p>AP Tests:
All 5's (see aforementioned AP listings)</p>

<p>Extracurriculars
At my old school
9th/10th: Science Olympiad participant and VP
9th/10th: JV Tennis
9th/10th: Key Club
9th: Marching Band
9th: Freshman Advisory
9th: Mini-medical seminars at WashU
10th: Pit Orchestra
10th: Speech and debate participant
10th: Mu Alpha Theta (math tutoring service)
10th: Quiz Bowl participant</p>

<p>At my new school
11th/12th: Environmental Club participant
11th/12th: NHS participant
11th: Quiz Bowl participant
11th: Web Design club</p>

<p>Notable awards/recognitions:
At my old school
9th/10th: Many 1st-3rd place places at Science Olympiad state level events
9th/10th: Gold Scholar (4.0+ GPA while doing athletics)
10th: Missouri Scholars Academy (MSA) student</p>

<p>At my new school
11th: Nominated for NCTE Achievement Award in writing (a total 10 people get this nomination from their teachers out of the class of ~1000 or so)
11th: Various ribbons from math competitions
11th: 3rd place team finish in a state Economics competition
11th: Science - American Association of Physics Teachers pick, Outstanding Junior in Science/Social Studies, Junior Math Scholar</p>

<p>Work experience
Volunteer work: Ample volunteer work from Key Club, working in parks, etc.
Webmaster of a small business: I suppose I should elaborate on this. I was commissioned as a web designer for a woman who wanted to start her own business. But slowly I got more roped into it and taught myself some PHP and MySQL to keep up with her demands. Now I'm in respond of managing many aspects of the site including payments, customer complaints about the website, etc.</p>

<p>My comments
Now here's what I'm worried about. I feel like colleges will view me as a "quitter" on a lot of the extracurricular stuff. Perhaps as a combination of the moving experience and a lack of initiative on my part, my extracurriculars for junior year are incredibly lackluster. A lot of the stuff I listed I shouldn't even list on a college app; for instance, I was horrible at debate and didn't enjoy it at all, and I'm barely an influence on the Quiz Bowl team. Most notably, I dropped some of my old activities. I quit Science Olympiad, which I had a very good record with, because it conflicted with my math competitions and Quiz Bowl. I also quit band because it didn't fit into my schedule and I hated the fact that marching band was mandatory (based on my freshman experience I hated marching band). I never took many leadership positions either; although I certainly had the chance in 9th/10th grade, I feel as if my new environment in my current school kept me from taking any more of these positions. So my EC is lining up to be incredibly lackluster, and I'm worrying that this is going to kill me.</p>

<p>In general it just seems that I lack focus. I intend to present myself as a student with a very good academic record in all aspects. I'm convinced, based on my English teacher's critiques of my NCTE works, that I can write an above average personal essay, and I plan to use the nomination to push the idea that I'm not just "one of those math and science Asian people". As far as the uniqueness is concerned I think being the webmaster and web designer for the aforementioned website works out nicely. But I'm not convinced as a whole, and as a result I'm having doubts that I'm competitive enough for the top schools.</p>

<p>Thanks so much for any insights you can give me!</p>

2

<p>Well in your transcript it should say what school you went to in what grade. Maybe they’ll realize that most of those EC’s that you had 9th and 10th grade are not at your new school. Maybe write an essay about your move and how it changed you – but that would be boring. I honestly don’t see why they’d make such a big stink about it.</p>

3

<p>OK, here’s the deal. You have good shots everywhere, but the fact that you called your 730 in CR “ewww” and you don’t feel “comfortable” with a 2280 even WITH a 36 ACT makes you look like one of the cockiest applicants on earth. I really hope the colleges don’t look at this page and know this is you when they get your application because there’s no way in hell they’d want to take a kid like you.</p>

<p>Later.</p>

4

<p>@r0kAng3l: Hahaha, yeah, I was thinking of writing a moving essay actually. I think it could work, especially since I reacted to moving differently than most people (initially positive but faced some hardship after since I’m not the most social person).</p>

<p>In regards to the EC, some of them I would’ve quit regardless of moving. For instance, as I mentioned, I wasn’t too fond of Speech and Debate, so I would’ve dropped it. And many of the ECs were offered at both schools, such as band and Science Olympiad.</p>

<p>@golfer111: If I come off as cocky, I apologize, but that was not how I intended to present myself. In today’s hyper-competitive college application arena, it’s easy for a pressured student like me to find flaws in him or herself; once you find a flaw, you think about it more, which only exacerbates the associated anxiety. This is exactly what’s been happening to me. And as I stated, I’m not worried about my academics nearly as much as my EC.</p>

<p>The reality is that, there are much better people both in my school and on the forums here. People who have 2380s-2400s on their SATs, similar GPAs/AP scoring records, are presidents of clubs or captains of teams, have 400+ volunteer hours, etc. Some of the other people I see come on here have all of these things and more, and they seem genuinely concerned about their chances.</p>

<p>If I truly do have a shot at every school in existence, who can blame me for thinking otherwise? With all the hearsay about rising application rates and declining acceptance rates and hearing about that kid who got a 2400 on his SAT or who got X award and Y recognition, I think it’s only natural.</p>

5

<p>An essay on the hardship of moving will not go over well at a top school. Many suffer true hardships.</p>

<p>Class rank is the number one factor in top school admission. Whether or not your school officially ranks they provide colleges with enough info to know where you rank.</p>

6

<p>Hm, alright. I wasn’t really intending to make the essay based on the whole hardship idea (“oh I moved poor me”), but I guess I’ll scrap the entire topic. Thanks!</p>

<p>I’ve been told that ultimately class rank/academics matter the most, which does provide some relief considering that’s my strong point, but many times it’s those ECs that help push those certain students across the acceptance/denial line.</p>

7

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<p>There’s no reason for you to think that, because there are 2400, X/Y recognition kids, that you don’t have a shot at all schools. Notice how I only mentioned the accomplishments of these other applicants, but did not say that he/she is a BETTER or STRONGER applicant than you.</p>

<p>First of all, you practically have a 2400 (36 ACT) and you have plenty of recognition.
Second of all, do you really think some kid that has 20 SAT points or some extra recognition on you is going to ruin your chances? The importance of essays, recommendations, and a little bit of luck cannot be overstated. This is where the differentiation will be made.</p>

<p>Conclusion? The decisions of other applicants have little bearing on your own chances. Just because some guy got a 2400/X/Y and got rejected doesn’t mean you’ll be rejected too. You only know his accomplishments, and nothing about the rest of his application. And even if you had read his essays, there are recommendations that you probably haven’t read and there’s his luck you definitely don’t know about.</p>

<p>And for the record, even if you had a 34 ACT instead of 36, 3.9 instead of 4.0, and less activities and recognition, you’d still have a chance. MANY, MANY applicants have a chance (very different from ultimately being accepted), so why would you think you don’t have one?</p>

<p>I also don’t think that activities push students across the line. I think ultimately essays, recommendations, and luck determine your decision because there are so many applicants that have great academics AND great activities.</p>

<p>Lastly, there’s nothing really wrong with your activities. I think as long as you demonstrate interest or passion in one or more of them (essays, maybe), you’ll be fine.</p>