<p>So...let's say a person has a 2210 SAT, and 4.33 GPA (hoping to improve of course), and is slated to be NMSF (221 in IN), and academic honors diploma, and A/P scholar with distinction (9 A/P courses), BUT...</p>
<p>really doesn't much dig math and has already taken four years (by taking Jr. High math) through pre-calc and just doesn't want to take math in his/her senior year.</p>
<p>Will this application be immediately tossed off the "maybe" pile into the "no way" pile at Harvard? Whatcha think?</p>
<p>I finished Calc II (equivalent to BC) in my sophomore year, and then I didn’t take a single math class Junior or Senior year. I’m currently on the waitlist, so I don’t think it hurt me considering my acceptances to other amazing schools.</p>
<p>Know a kid with a similar profile who only took math until pre-calc in junior year; was not accepted to any schools but safeties…just one example, obviously, but top 20 schools have a plethora of kids who have gone above and beyond with course rigor…why would they even look at someone who didn’t complete their HS cycle of math?</p>
<p>lolcats: your situation is COMPLETELY different than the OP’s…you achieved a higher math level than most seniors do…</p>
<p>oh, I didn’t notice that the OP hasn’t taken calc yet. In that case, I think it would be highly recommended, or there would be serious issues. Selective colleges want students to take the most challenging coursework possible.</p>
<p>Yeah…thanks for the answers - I expected that. Hoping for different. While she does have extreme RIGOR…no question…it’s just not in math. And I know how important that is. Seems crazy for a philosophy major, but…I get it. She’s still above the required math even for the top/honors diploma…but nothing “fancy”. Oh well. The whole fiasco actually happened due to misinformation from her counselors…now we’re frantically trying to find a way to fix it without dropping all her other desired A/P courses, so I was just wondering your experience. Thanks to you both. Lesson learned. Too late though.</p>
<p>So…you’re saying Calc is the next best step?
Think she’d get by with statistical? I mean, she was on the first place math bowl team, 6th personally in state in standardized testing, 740 SAT. BUT…still hates math. What’s a Mom to do?</p>
<p>“Not wanting to take math” would be precisely what the admissions committee would read into his case. I just took the bc calculus exam today and it’s been an extremely tough year–so, if math is not his thing, I would not recommend taking bc calc. However, I don’t think pre-calc is high enough a level for a high school graduate; it /would/ be understandable to opt out if one had already taken calculus/multi-variable calculus/advanced math concepts/word problems, etc. Technically, the SAT’s math section is logic based and could be completed with the skills typically learned by 8th grade–so my princeton review teacher told me about two years ago. </p>
<p>My suggestions: AB Calc would be much easier than BC, and with the work you can expect about the same grade as pre-calc. (BC would be pre-calc minus a full grade, from experience.) If you have calc-phobia, look into statistics (doesn’t have to be AP) or a math elective offered by our school.</p>
<p>Math is hard and it will not be an easy senior year, but I advise strongly against going without math during senior year.</p>
<p>–a Harvard Waitlistee (with otherwise similar stats)</p>
<p>lawl I didn’t take any math as a HS senior and things turned out fine.</p>
<p>Thanks music, work etc (description sounds like my daughter)…
Yeah…she did score well on her math when she took the SAT in 8th grade too. She did tell me she didn’t know what some of it was though. She used to LIKE math. Said that SAT was very fun, trying to figure out what the problems meant! Then she was put in a “cluster class” (20 kids or so pulled out for double advanced math and given a teacher who had NEVER TAUGHT A DAY OF school). Kid was 6th in state in some standardized testing, 1st in state math bowl team, etc. Then…thwomp. Teacher made a difference and she never looked back. Oh well. Thanks much for your learned insight!</p>
<p>Well, your daughter should give math another try. Trust me, calculus is whole 'nother kind of math…forget what you learned in pre-calc. She might even enjoy the calculus, and she just might get a different teacher who is experienced and likable. And she doesn’t even have to take AP.</p>
<p>Besides, math up to pre-calculus only just sounds…i don’t know…weird? For me, math is one of those things in which if you don’t use it, you lose it so I have to stay on top of it. Your daughter seems different; more reason for her to continue because she is actually good in the subject, and a good challenge shouldn’t hurt. That’s what top schools look for.</p>
<p>bizzyjudy–the scenario you’re describing was largely my experience. hated pre-calc, mostly due to the fact that there’s no coherence in the way it’s taught–it just speeds through a lot of unrelated topics. calc is very different. the concepts are fascinating, the material is taught in logical progression, etc. it’s not inherently easier, but you might find it easier (i did) than precalc.</p>
<p>in the same vein…i will not have taken any AP sciences in high school-just bio, chem, honors physics (honors bio/chem aren’t offered)…i was in bio freshman year but studied abroad sophomore year and am not interested in doubling up at all, and am definitely a humanities person. will this really hurt? i mean i’m not going to take something i hate but i’m just interested in knowing:) thanks!</p>
<p>If you’re a humanities person, definitely sign up for and prioritize humanities courses and make those stand out, but where they are offered, you should take at the very least a light load of other math/science courses. They will see that humanities are, euphemistically, “your strength” and math/science, maybe, “not your cup of tea;” however, they want to see you have the ambition to at least try courses outside your comfort zone–courses in topics you would be required to take, for instance, in a general education curriculum. (I think I’m repeating advice I’ve read here on cc some time back–deja vu.)</p>
<p>Not taking an AP when it is offered is a lost opportunity to show the college the rigor of your school’s grading standards, which is why they have the SAT, so AP’s show that you can take tough courses and prove that they’re tough. On the other hand, not taking an AP will not hurt you in any way. It’s a missed opportunity, but if you have a well-balanced load of courses that your school will vouch for as challenging, then there’s not much more you can do as a student–just study hard for those courses. Interviewers often ask what your “favorite” or “most challenging” courses are to gauge the intellectual curiosity that led you to choose the courses they /will/ have seen on your transcript.</p>
<p>ok thanks so much!</p>
<p>marie, i didn’t take a science class at all this year. i did, however, complete honors bio, honors chemistry, and ap chemistry. like you, i am also into the humanities, and things turned out fine for me</p>
<p>On the other hand, if a prospective junior has taken several post bc math’s, and at the time of applying will be at nearly graduate level mathematics, how would they fare? Would that make them significantly standout from the application pool, or simply just a “good” and that’s that.</p>
<p>My friend never went past Algebra II and he got waitlisted.
Not everyone’s a math person so yeah just do whatever is in your area of interest.</p>
<p>Not everyone is a math person is correct. One of the girls in my school who got accepted to Harvard, Yale, and Princeton (all three) was also one of the few top ranked people in the school who didn’t take as much math. She definitely didn’t get to calculus. I think in senior year, she did AP Statistics. </p>
<p>Frankly, she didn’t need calculus anyway.</p>
<p>Well, technically there are no absolute requirements.</p>
<p>I personally know someone who did not take math in senior year, did not take the SAT, had drug problems and an arrest record but she got into Harvard anyway. </p>
<p>Her hook? She had done some exotic research with a very famous person (that you have probably heard of) somewhere in an exotic land. This was also 40 years ago, peak of the hippie era. </p>
<p>She later dropped out, to become a best-selling author.</p>
<p>Well, it would be recommended that you complete calculus, but if you don’t, it’s not going to stop you from being admitted. Harvard, and all colleges in general, like to see a challenging curriculum. So if the overall coursework you’re taking is challenging, but lacks math, it should not be a problem.</p>
<p>I got in this year without taking any math, but I did BC last year.</p>