Chances???

Colleges and Universities A-Z Harvey Mudd College
1

<p>I am a white male from Billings, MT.
What are my chances?</p>

<p>G.P.A.- 3.7 UW***(ouch!)
Class Rank- Top 20% or better (ouch!)</p>

<p>ACT
Composite: 34
Reading: 34
Math: 33
Language: 34
Science: 33
Writing Subscore: 09
Combined English/Writing: 32</p>

<p>SAT IIs:
Math I: 730
Math II:740
Physics: 650 (ouch!)</p>

<p>Extracurricular Activities
Freshman: School Musical, Youth Group
Sophomore: Academic Team, Youth Group
Junior: Academic Team, Debate, youth group
Senior: Academic Team, Debate, Intramural Tennis, Academic WorldQuest Team, national honors society, youth group</p>

<p>Community Service
100+ hours for National Honors Society/Youth Group
yardwork/caring for elderly
care packages for needy
clothing giveaway
food bank
family service center
community cleanup
etc.</p>

<p>Distinctions:
MCTM math contest regional and state superior award (4-time)
presidential award for academic excellence (4 time)
lettered in debate and academics
placed in top 8 of every debate tournament of entire career
one of the leaders of the best academic team in montana (multiple school, regional, state, and national competitions, successful in most of them)
best newcomer-debate 2007-08</p>

<p>5 years of work experience for Yellowstone Polaris & Recreation, Inc.</p>

<p>Hooks: Geographical Location, rigor?</p>

<p>***I started high school with a 2.7 due to an administrative confusion causing classes i took at the high school in sixth, seventh, and eighth grades (math and science) to count on my high school transcript, and they are refusing to take it off
(i tried to explain this scenario in my app)
I finished all of high school math in my sophomore year, then earned a few credits in college</p>

<p>Essays: solid
Letters of Rec: phenomenal
Most rigorous courseload available for my school
school size:1550</p>

<p>i am hoping they will overlook my less than stellar gpa/ec's!
what do you guys think?</p>

2

<p>Why do you want to go to Harvey Mudd? I'd not worry about your GPA so much if you explained that it's a huge mistake...but I'd definitely ask why you're applying. Can you explain to me? Could you explain to admissions officers?</p>

<p>Though SAT II's are just....something, generally I'd expect to see a few math and science AP's, and SAT II's.</p>

<p>Oh and I got in without EC's. Like, no EC I ever did counts as an EC LOL. I was really just into what I liked to study. So I don't think this'll kill you, i.e. don't worry way too much about EC's.</p>

3

<p>The above is intended to be just a question, not a hostile remark. Just asking, how're you supposed to convince someone that you're both interested in and fit for the type of program Mudd is.</p>

4

<p>My school doesn't offer any AP science courses, so i haven't taken any tests</p>

<p>and i didn't bother taking ap calc test since i have already completed calc in college by my junior year</p>

<p>i want to go to harvey mudd because i've wanted to be an engineer my whole life and harvey mudd is one of the best places in the nation to pursue that dream.</p>

<p>i definitely went in depth why i wanted to go there and how i would fit in my essays</p>

5

<p>Your GPA is not that bad for HMC. I had the same UW GPA and I got in. However, you definitely need to raise all of your SAT IIs if you have time. 740 is pretty low percentile-wise for Math IIC (25th Percentile at Mudd is usually 760 or 770). </p>

<p>I would say that HMC is definitely a reach.</p>

6

<p>do they even post their sat II statistics?</p>

7

<p>I think they only post SAT II Math IIC.</p>

8

<p>I spoke recently with an Admissions counselor while at the interview and they told me that a 750 is needed in the Math 2 SAT Subject tests as they feel this is a good 'barometer' of whether you can cut it or not at Mudd in general. I retook them and raised my score alot.</p>

9

<p>"i want to go to harvey mudd because i've wanted to be an engineer my whole life and harvey mudd is one of the best places in the nation to pursue that dream."</p>

<p>Look, so is UC Berkeley. So is Stanford. So is MIT. So is Cornell. Harvey Mudd is a very specific kind of school, and one with people who're likely unusually into several fields of math, science and engineering. I looked at their core and knew it's not the school for me...I like unconditional freedom to do whatever I want in any given semester. Generally, someone who did well in AP Physics, AP Chem, all the SAT II's, and all, should still find Mudd academics slaughtering them, from what rocketDA and atomicfusion posted. I'd not take this lightly. </p>

<p>So I honestly think if you prove it to <em>yourself</em> that you can be happy and successful at Mudd, and just show that to admissions officers, you'll be in. I don't see enough evidence in your application as of now. You could easily get weak SAT II's because your high school doesn't do much on the lines of the SAT II curricula, but what HAVE you done which indicates you go deep into math, physics, chem, bio, etc, and would genuinely make it at Mudd?</p>

<p>This is what I mean when I ask: do you really want a school like Mudd, and how does that show.</p>

10

<p>Sorry, I keep finding that I'm sounding not very nice, and that's not the intent. I'm just highl skeptical of people who say they want to go to Harvey Mudd...too many don't seem to know what they're talking about.</p>

<p>You not only need to be strong, but also a specific <em>kind</em> of strong, imo, to appreciate the atmosphere. Else, there are lots of schools where really amazing, bright students can do great things.</p>

11

<p>i really appreciate your point of view
honestly, i just didn't feel like going in depth on why i want to go to harvey mudd</p>

<p>i hope i was able to convey that i could succeed there in my essays</p>

<p>i do think i could cut it though!</p>

12

<p>"i do think i could cut it though!"</p>

<p>Well perhaps you are GOOD enough, but I'm sure you realize the point is if you're a good fit for the type of school it is. I consider myself highly into mathematics, probably more so than quite a few Mudd math majors, and could handle the math major there. Doesn't mean I went to Harvey Mudd! [As great a fan I am of it.] It's about fit.</p>

13

<p>i know what your saying
but you don't know me, so you can't say anything about fit</p>

14

<p>"but you don't know me, so you can't say anything about fit"</p>

<p>Don't see the point of this statement, because I'm really just encouraging you to figure out for yourself if you're a good fit. BTW, the admissions officers don't really know you either beyond a little bit, through interview + essays. Unfortunately, it really is up to you to demonstrate using your high school record whether you're a good fit. </p>

<p>Read the following by me:</p>

<p>"You could easily get weak SAT II's because your high school doesn't do much on the lines of the SAT II curricula, but what HAVE you done which indicates you go deep into math, physics, chem, bio, etc, and would genuinely make it at Mudd?"</p>

<p>and you'll realize how careful I am not to presume what kind of fit you are. Just making it amply clear that I'm well intentioned here.</p>

15

<p>I want to add that my daughter visited Mudd last summer because we thought it might be a good fit. She excells in all the sciences and math but when she really asked herself if she wanted to complete Mudd's core curriculum she decided that it wasn't for her. So you need to ask yourself do you really want to take 2 years of physics for example in order to study engineering. There are lots of schools that will allow you to be an engineer without you learning all the other subjects. Mudd just isn't one of them. I think that's what mathboy was getting at.</p>

16

<p>"asked herself if she wanted to complete Mudd's core curriculum she decided that it wasn't for her."</p>

<p>Right, she made a decision similar to mine. This is what I was getting at. I remember rocketDA (I think) posting somewhere that "core will eat your soul" if you don't really feel like doing it.</p>

17

<p>"So you need to ask yourself do you really want to take 2 years of physics for example in order to study engineering. There are lots of schools that will allow you to be an engineer without you learning all the other subjects. Mudd just isn't one of them."</p>

<p>Sorry, but if you don't want to take physics to be an engineer, you shouldn't be an engineer. Period. I'd say that 75% of the core curriculum has been essential to my engineering education. I use physics in the form of mechanics and E&M every day. Engineering classes build on this to form foundations in continuum mechanics and systems engineering.</p>

<p>Again, I strongly believe that if your D isn't up for 2 years of physics in order to pursue engineering, I don't see engineering as a good fit at any school. Bridges and airplanes will be falling into the Hudson more often...</p>

18

<p>"Right, she made a decision similar to mine. This is what I was getting at. I remember rocketDA (I think) posting somewhere that "core will eat your soul" if you don't really feel like doing it."</p>

<p>Yes, the core will eat your soul. However, deals with the devil turn out for the better.</p>

19

<p>Yeah I'm sure the physics has to be necessary. Might I add, as a mathematician, that I think engineers at schools other than Mudd [and Caltech and the likes] don't seem to learn enough math to have a sophisticated language to express things in. I heavily disapprove of that. I mean, while the more abstract math is only necessary for those wanting to do something like complexity theory, i.e. geared towards theory anyway, the level required at quite a few schools is awfully lacking.</p>

20

<p>I should've prefaced that with <em>many</em> schools, i.e. there are a few such small, focused programs which force a lot more down students' throats. While I think freedom is a virtue, it shouldn't be at the cost of a good background for engineers + physicists. Frequently physicists will require much more mathematics to appreciate things than they have to take in undergrad..similar for engineers. I mean, "their sort of math," not my more abstract sort of math.</p>