Class of 2021 Statistics: 8.7% Acceptance Rate, 72% Yield

Why are you guys surprised that more options resulted to less applications?

Thaler, the newest Nobel Laureat, will tell you that this is to be expected. If more options increase complexity without increasing utility, then applications will go down. (You lose a lot of the people who shop around for the best deal. You lose the people who apply just in case/lottery applicants.)


As far as the high acceptance rate goes I have a hypothesis on why it happened.

  1. They accepted too many ED1 because they designed this whole thing for a high yield.

  2. They accepted fewer EA but they also underestimated the EA yield that the class is practically (almost) filled after ED1/EA.

  3. ED2 comes and they find that the stats of the ED2 applicants were so awesome - like way better than the ED1 and EA admits that they just took so many of them in. I mean, the plan is to have a high yield… why not get high stats too?

  4. By the time RD came around, there are no more spots left. However, for reasons dictated by the all powerful god called “optics”, they have to accept enough RD applicants to raise the RD acceptance rate to something that is not worse than Stanford’s or some other peer school. (because if it is worse, why not apply RD to the peer school instead?)

  5. And yet, RD yield was also higher than anticipated. The school is just THAT hot these days.

So that is my hypothesis on how they ended with 150 more students than they planned. And why the acceptance rate was higher.

the Ellison “no safe spaces” letter was a reason for me to apply!
No 1 (crime) was my only worry, and the campus is indeed in a bad neighborhood

It looks like they accepted the same number of EDII/RD as they did EDI/EA - 1200 - and even took some kids off the wait list. My daughter’s stats as an EA applicant didn’t seem to cut it; however, they were perfectly fine for EDII so not sure that “stats” is the reason for taking in so many EDII’s. Most likely a lot of deferred EA’s had great stats and the only thing that got them accepted was switching to EDII. Perhaps a whole lot of new EDII applications came in - but do we really think the number of new apps. was higher than the number who switched? Not sure. In any event, it’s quite possible (dare they?) that Uchicago admitted 800 EDII and 400 RD’s! And why not? First of all, do we know how many EA’s committed right away? Second, they are trying to get yield up for a variety of short term and long term reasons. Third, they admitted a 2:1 ratio of ED’s to EA’s - why not do the same for EDII’s and RD’s?

What’s interesting would be to see the yield on the EA and RD applicants. Do we have evidence suggesting that these were “higher than anticipated”? If, for instance there were only 800 non binding applicants - 400 EA, 400 RD - that means as few as 135 of them (maybe a bit more depending on attrition for ED’s) committed! That’s actually pretty low and would support the hypothesis that segmenting the application pool four ways (two binding and two non binding) effectively directs the applicants to reveal their preference for attending UChicago. In short, those who really wanted to attend overwhelmingly applied ED.

(would love to think they accepted way more than 400 RD applicants but with a 2% admit rate that number can’t climb too high before implying something ridiculous. Unfortunately, with Nondorf playing fast and loose with the admit #'s, we’ll never know if the number was 2% or 2.7%! :)))

We’ll see this year. I predict another significant dive in applications, mitigated in part by an increase in ED II applications. That’s the unique proposition Chicago now offers gamers – an elite-college ED option that lets you apply ED or SCEA someplace else first. People will pick up on that. But EA applications, which I believe were over 12,000 a few years ago, are going to head towards 0. Half the prior EA number would be a gigantic number of ED I applications to receive. (Penn is the only college that gets as many as 6,000 ED I applications.) And RD just looks too competitive to bother with.

i was told that they had an unexpected number of top candidates which explains in part the larger class size. its also good for finances. Stats were highest ever.

I think its the news and murder rate. Who wants to go to school somewhere with blistering cold winters and is practically the murder capital of the country with so many other great options?

Statements like that (in #24) have a little bit of a barnyard odor to them. Any class can have the highest stats ever – all they have to do is select for stats over other qualities. It’s not something to brag about, exactly. And the “unexpected number of top candidates”? Give me a break.

Some of you reflexive cheerleaders should go back and take a look at the CC “results” thread from December 2016. EA applicants who looked sensational on paper were being deferred (many of whom later converted their applications to ED II and were accepted), while much less impressive candidates who had applied ED were being accepted. I’m sure their essays and recommendations were all beyond stellar. But the clear impression I got was that it was a cynical exercise in maximizing yield and holding down acceptance rate, at the expense of quality. If they wound up with super-high stats for the class as a whole, it’s because they prioritized getting that result, too.

Good for finances? I guess, but maybe only in the short run if it affects the quality of people’s college experience and word gets out. They don’t have appropriate housing for them, or lots of other infrastructure. There are real marginal costs: additional Hum and Sosc faculty, additional writing instructors, advisors, TAs for introductory courses. Doing all that at the last minute. Getting apartments for upperclass students off campus so they can put the extra first-years on campus. It’s classier when colleges plan their class expansion in advance.

I’m actually a big fan of Jim Nondorf, and a UChicago cheerleader. (A reflective one, I hope.) Last year’s admissions season looked like a big mistake to me, not a triumph. Time, of course, will tell. Or at least it will inform somewhat more.

EA was over 12,000 but keep in mind that some of those would obviously have been ED had the option been offered in those years. That’s what happened this year. 13,000 total divided into something like 8000 EA and 5000 ED. (Basing those guesstimates off the admit rates thrown around these threads for the past several months now . . ). If overall early numbers IMPROVED over prior years (which they seem to) and a good representation of those are ED, that means in prior years there would have been eager ED’s applying as well. UChicago knows those numbers - they would be the kids who committed very early on in order to get priority in the housing queue.

This year there is still an incentive to apply EA if your other top choice is an ED school (Columbia, NU, Penn, Carleton . . . there are others) or you also want to apply EA to Notre Dame. That way, your options to apply early decision to UChicago are still open in case of deferral. EDII is not just for those kids who have applied SCEA somewhere else.

The big difference this year - as we all know, is the 4,000+ drop in apps due Jan. 1. Obviously, some of those who applied RD in previous years would eagerly have chosen EDII had they been given the chance. This year they WERE given the chance so whatever number of new EDII’s there were this year would be no lower than any previous year. That’s not the source of the drop. The source - again, as everyone knows, is in regular old (or new LOL) RD applications. Why would they have dropped?

@FStratford attributes it to complexity and he/she might be on to something. Would argue that it’s not “irrational behavior”, however. Students and their families interested in the elite set of colleges tend to be very savvy about admission plans - they DO search the web, read CC, etc. and incorporate what they’ve learned into their decisions. Highly doubt anyone was truly “confused” about the switcheroo this past year (as Admissions was reported to have said) but they likely were surprised by the news and perceived it as a negative shock. Perhaps expected likelihood of getting in RD was now a lot lower, given that there are three admission decisions before March (two of them being ED), so why bother? (Parents could have played a huge role in that, btw, simply by refusing to sign an ED agreement). Perhaps UChicago appears as harsh, calculating and not nurturing in the right sort of way (Ellison letter) and to add two ED options on top of that seemed offensive so No Thank You. The question is whether those who DIDN’T apply would have had higher stats or been higher quality applicants who would have gotten in. We don’t know the admitted stats yet (we have Nondorf’s word, but he’s already on record as exaggerating a bit so . . . ). However, even if the stats are the same or a tad lower, it’s not clear whether Admissions was willing to trade that off for something else - a more diverse class, a LOT more firm commitments, etc. @JHS haSo . . . hard to know. What we DO know is that they accepted a ton of ED’s (I and II). Could have been an act of desperation - or it could have been very calculating. Evidence points to it’s being the latter, given that they were clearly willing to go aggressive on the number of EDI accepteds, well before the deadline for RD (which they extended in part, btw - anyone remember that? :slight_smile: ).

This quandry looks as if a whole bunch of extra kids whose abilities, interests and goals aren’t a good fit with UChicago simply didn’t apply this year. They were obviously turned off by some aspect of the college and/or the application process. If UChicago admits a whole crap-ton of ED’s again, then the signal is - so what? If they pull back on ED - even at the risk of a drop in yield - then the signal is that aggressive ED doesn’t give them the class they are looking for. This can change year-to-year, too, of course depending on the quality of applicants. Highly doubt it will spiral down to Zero RD’s simply because there are high quality HYPS/SCEA applicants out there who will apply to UChicago in the regular round. Will it PRIMARILY be that type? Perhaps. And maybe, given the number of ED’s who are currently the Class of 2021, that’s all UChicago really wants to be in the RD round.

@JHS at #26: it’s obviously a cynical exercise - we disagree on the degree to which other top universities are also cynical. But anecdotally, there are a couple others this year who could have planned their expansion in a classier fashion and were very public about their “oopsie”. Almost as if this kind of news isn’t exactly bad for admissions.

Fun fact: they were trying to increase the class size.

They need more revenue in tuition money.

6 Chicago was front page in just about every paper and news outlet for an entire year due to shootings and murder rates unrivaled in the US in decades, if ever. If you look at the number one discussion from parents, it’s not academic related, it’s always safety related, 100% of the time in my direct discussions.

10% drop in total applications is absolutely possible. I know it was my families only concern when deciding.

Hyde Snark: How do you know?

@HydeSnark That’s exactly what I surmised … In the immortal words of Voltaire: “Common sense is not so common.”

We pretty much could figure out that they were trying to increase class-size, since they were taking people off the waitlist in May.

@fbsdreams the gang war in Chicago over the past few years has been awful, but it also has been totally exaggerated by sensationalist conservative media in an effort to find something negative to tie to Barack Obama.

In reality, Chicago doesn’t have the highest murder or shooting rate among American cities, and it never has. And the murder rate in Chicago is lower than it was in the 1990s and earlier. And the gang war has little to do with Hyde Park - Chicago is an enormous city and Hyde Park is one of its safer neighborhoods.

The shootings are awful, but don’t let them manipulate you into thinking that Chicago has become some sort of post-apocalyptic hellhole.

@ThankYouforHelp - exactly. And this sensationalist conservative rag was the worst:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/grade-point/wp/2015/11/30/university-of-chicago-cancels-classes-over-gun-violence-threat/?utm_term=.6a53314444f2

@Kentriko lol at calling Hyde Park a bad neighborhood. I guess you’ll see when you get here but it’s really rich.

Similarly, I really doubt people are deterred by gun violence stats - Chicago’s aren’t that high and Hyde Park is one of the safest neighborhoods - and most people serious enough about the school to apply and smart enough to get offered admission would do some basic research presumably. Have Loyola, WUSTL, or Northwestern seen any drop?

@JHS the rumor on campus is that EA was brutal, around 1%.

All the foregoing theories explainlng the decline in RD numbers sound plausible to me. We have known about that decline for some time, and hence it never seemed mathematically possible that the acceptance rate would remain at 8 per cent. Some have viewed that inevitable result as a negative in the beauty contest between the College and its peers. I see it otherwise - as a mild but statistically significant recursion to a traditional self-selecting UChicago applicant pool. Those 3,000 or so who might have applied last year and didn’t this year were all kids who either didn’t want what Chicago offers - or want it badly enough - or figured they’d be wasting their time applying in a lost cause. Why would any Chicago well-wisher want to see anyone in the former group accepted as a student, and why (except for trivial statistical reasons) should a decline in the latter group be lamented?

As for the enhanced yield rate, I join many in seeing this as an artifact of the ED1 and 2 regimes, therefore see nothing triumphant about it. To my mind the achievement of such statistics isn’t a valid objective in any event. But is it the actual one? Applying Voltaire’s maxim to the facts of the case (and also a swipe of Ockham’s razor) the plain results are easy enough to explain as simply the desired ones - greater numbers of kids really wanting to come to Chicago are being selected. What’s not desirable about that? The pool of qualified Chicago-loving kids isn’t extensive, but it is precious.

The enrolment target must have been overshot because of an unexpectedly higher yield on the RD pool of applicants. That sounds like a good thing. Planning is wonderful, but animal spirits have a logic of their own: F. Nietzsche.

Many have spoken wistfully of the exuberant but crowded Chicago campus of the post-war years. There were huts on the Midway! Creature comforts are wonderful, but animal spirits…etc. Shall we see those huts again?

@JBStillFlying : How does a terroristic threat by a crazy individual that the FBI found credible translate into a bad neighborhood? Lord knows, there have been plenty of incidents with crazy people with guns on a variety of campuses, and no one concludes from it that Virginia Tech or Texas Tech or UCSB (to name a few) are in neighborhoods that are unsafe.

@marlowe1 You are citing Voltaire and Nietzsche without my permission. Kindly find your own philosophers ! Where is you sense of intellectual dignity ? Perhaps try Woody Allen and Bob Dylan. We at Harvard would never tolerate such usurpation.