<p>According to about every source, CMU's CS program is elite. I was looking at their AP policy at SCS</a> Placement Policies and was amazed: skipping two chem classes for a 5 on the exam? I took that exam and got that score; while not easy, it was not too difficult. Skipping two calc classes for a 5 on BC Calc?</p>
<p>Something seems wrong. Do they not care about people taking classes for anything but what is majored in? Even then, two classes can be skipped for a 5 on AP CS AB (I got a 5 on AP CS A reading nothing more than one prep book and having previous programming experience).</p>
<p>It puzzles me, because at places like MIT and CalTech AP's are hardly accepted at all. Are the intro classes at CMU weaker? At most places they're hard, in order to 'weed people out'.</p>
<p>I might apply early decision to CMU's school of CS, so I want to hear your thoughts.</p>
<p>I got a 4 on AP Chem (we hadn't finished the AP chem curriculum) and was able to sleep through Chem 2 every day in class and still managed to get something like a 96% in the class.</p>
<p>A lot of the intro classes are fairly simple since they're taken by a ton of non-technical people. I think every student at CMU (including art and drama) are required to take the first computer science course, as well as a year of calculus.</p>
<p>I think the reason why CMU lets you skip those classes (at least calc) is because they don't do a very rigorous treatment of the material; it's aimed a lot more at engineering students and people who will use the material as a tool and not as something they want to study out of a passion for it. The math class I had to take here at Caltech while a grad was definitely more proof-based than anything I had at CMU, and I really don't understand how to apply the material nearly as well as I did from my courses at CMU. Also, I'd say CMU's undergrad differential equations class covered about 80% of the material in my grad ODE class (even used the same textbook).</p>
<p>I don't really recall any weeder courses that I had to take at CMU, though organic chem was recognized for being a pain (professor would only teach at 8:30 MWF saying if you really wanted to learn the material, you could be at the top of your game no matter what time the class was). I think CMU takes the opinion that if you're good enough to get in, then you're good enough to get through their program (though you will have to work your butt off to get through).</p>
<p>You will not be alone in your computer programming skills. DS didn't even buy the book for programming, he uses the 'help' function. He did mechanical engineering and HCI at CMU. Computer science at Toronto. Not yet one programming class but he will never be able to compete for a trained CSer.</p>
<p>The nice thing about CMU's AP policy is that it gives you a lot of freedom to take courses you enjoy. My son found the computer science courses he took plenty challenging. He'd had quite a bit of programming experience beyond the AP which he took as a high school freshman.</p>
<p>OP may be behind the learning curve if he bought a programming prep book. (humor) :)</p>
<p>Do not be lured into thinking that any of the top engineering schools make the course work easy. You will be definitely be within your peer group.</p>
<p>first, let me say that i bought the prep book because the AP CS A exam has nothing to do with CS; it's mostly about java and some quirks that go along with it...</p>
<p>The hard course work wasn't really my question. I'm wondering, do students who skip 2 (!) intro classes in a subject actually perform well if that's their major? Or should they play things safely and start from the beginning in whatever their major is? I can't imagine skipping the intermediate/advanced programming class even though I have a lot of programming experience.</p>
<p>I asked my son specifically about the Computer AP exam. He said 15-100 is aimed mostly at non-cs majors that even with little programming experience, most people are better at starting off with 15-111 because it's a better course and doesn't take bad short cuts. He said if you found the AB Comp Sci exam easy you should have no trouble starting where he did in 15-123. He knew some of the material, but hadn't had discrete math. He'd had a lot of programming experience, but I think there were still plenty of holes as he'd taught himself things that interested him (LISP, a bit of scheme, lots of Linux) or what he need for job (mostly database organizing stuff I think - SQL etc.)</p>
<p>My son also skipped the physics courses that are allowed by getting a 5 on the exam. He took Modern Physics and Quantum Mechanics and got A's in both. </p>
<p>For what it's worth he got A's in everything except a B in a history course. I'd advise that if you follow CMU's recommendations (there may be some placement exams as well) you'll be fine. In addition I believe the various intro computing courses are scheduled for the same time, so if you start off in one that is too hard you can transfer into an easier one.</p>
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I can't imagine skipping the intermediate/advanced programming class even though I have a lot of programming experience.
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<p>Very little of upper-level CS is about programming. The classes become much more about thought processes and logical thought quickly.</p>
<p>I came into CMU with eight classes worth of AP credit, and I don't feel that I missed out on anything by not taking the lowest level classes. It actually was great, since I was able to do a minor and take about four extra electives within my department beyond all requirements and still graduate a semester early.</p>
<p>As I understand CMU's CS, it's designed to get students prepared for real-world problems, and would an advanced programming class not be in the interest of any student? I guess it doesn't matter much because I only have AP credit for CS A (can't skip it), but I'm curious.</p>
<p>The stuff you learn for the CS AB test pretty much covers what's learned in 15-111. There's really no point in taking programming classes on the same level again. People using their CS AB credit can probably easily fill the gaps between the AP curriculum and CMU's intermediate programming curriculum. They're quite ready for 15-123 Effective Programming in C and Unix and 15-211 Data Structures and Algorithms, which starts a move onto more theoretical courses rather than simply learning a language, which anyone can do on their own. </p>
<p>By the way: 15-123 only has a pre-req of 15-100, not 15-111. But most people take that because 15-211 has a pre-req of 21-127 which they take in the fall.</p>
<p>As for myself, I am going for a Physics and CS double degree (which only requires two more classes than a double major, biology and chemistry) and it would be impossible to do without credit for two semesters each of introductory courses for physics, calculus, and CS. I only wish I had taken more AP courses in high school.</p>
<p>Also, a lot of other good schools (Stanford, Berkeley, at least) don't accept AP credit for humanities courses, but they do accept science AP's, like physics, bio, chem, and CS. MIT also allows skipping intro courses but some through placement exam only. So it's not much different than CMU in regard to skipping introductory courses.</p>
<p>Were you guys able to skip out any of the humanities requirements? It appears that the courses needed to fill the requirement cannot be covered by AP credit. This makes me sad, because spending that much money, I don't want to learn humanities from CMU.</p>
22. Designated Writing - A : 76-101 Fall '08 * 9.0<br>
23. Cognition, Choice, Behavior :1 unfilled course
24. Economic, Political, Social : 73-012 Fall '08 AP 9.0<br>
25. Cultural Analysis - B3 : 79-015 Fall '08 AP 9.0<br>
26. HSS/CFA Electives - C : 73-100 Fall '08 AP 9.0<br>
76-011 Fall '08 AP 9.0<br>
88-012 Fall '08 AP 9.0<br>
9.00 unfilled Units
And for SCS:
18. Writing : 76-101 Fall '08 * 9.0<br>
19. Technical Communication :1 unfilled course
20. Category 1 Breadth :1 unfilled course
21. Category 2 Breadth : 73-012 Fall '08 AP 9.0<br>
22. Category 3 Breadth : 79-015 Fall '08 AP 9.0<br>
23. Humanities/Arts Electives : 73-100 Fall '08 AP 9.0<br>
76-011 Fall '08 AP 9.0<br>
88-012 Fall '08 AP 9.0
</p>
<p>So I'm definitely using my humanities AP credit in my degree requirements. I have credit for World History, English Language, US Govt/Politics, Econ Micro, Econ Macro. Now I only have to take two more general humanities courses.</p>
<p>I got credit for AP US History and Euro History at CMU. I didn't take macro/micro or any other humanities classes there. It was nice, since I only had to take one history class to fulfill my depth sequence. I took Jerry Day's course on History of Urban America, a class I'd actually recommend taking. It's an ultra easy A, but he does a good job lecturing and you learn a lot of neat stuff. I even got to do all of my projects based around topics in materials science, such as the influence of the introduction of specific materials into society and how it influenced building structures (fiberglass insulation made the required wall thickness go from something like one foot to three inches, which was a huge space savings in dense urban areas) as well as other "engineering" topics.</p>
<p>The dude also looks and sounds just like Martin Short when he's playing Jiminy Glick.</p>
<p>awvvu, is Tom Keating still teaching the Technical Writing course? Up until 2006 he was in CIT (and had been there forever) and was a fantastic teacher. The class size was roughly 10-15 students and he always had stellar FCEs. After I took his class CIT decided to let him go, but SCS picked him up instantly. I talked to him one time and he was saying how he worried that his course would really suffer due to the massive amount of students he'd start being responsible for since he always liked making each student give a few presentations throughout the semester.</p>
<p>CMU says that for just about everything you get credit (so far I have two 5's in Euro and US history, and am taking about 5 more humanities exams as a senior), but is that credit just as an elective, or can it be used to satisfy the SCS BS degree requirements so that you can take more math/CS courses and less humanities courses?</p>