Colgate vs. Middlebury

<p>I;m trying to knock one of these guys odd the list and would like a little help. I've looked through a lot of the previous threads but haven't quite found what I'm looking for?</p>

<p>My top concerns:</p>

<ol>
<li>Student Body; frequency of rich kids, preppiness, pretentiousness</li>
<li>To what extent are outdoor activities (esp. hiking) available and popular?</li>
<li>level of intellectualism</li>
<li>Partying, drinking, etc.</li>
<li>politics; as a moderately conservative kid I don't mind a liberal campus, but don't want to feel totally out of place for my views.</li>
<li>And if anyone knows anything about the rowing teams that would be great</li>
<li>Quality of Financial aid, esp. for middle class</li>
</ol>

<p>Thanks for the help</p>

<p>Also, I'm definitely applying/have applied to Dartmouth, Bowdoin, Hobart, St. Lawrence, UVIC, and Western Washington (honors)</p>

<p>Anyone? </p>

<p>I kind of need to decide today. I’ve already submitted my ACT score to Colgate and there’s no app fee, but I’d have to write a shore essay, no big deal. I know about the pre-application supplement, but I e-mailed Midd and they said it would still be ok to submit, but I;d have to pay to send test scores and apply. So what do I do?</p>

<p>Both schools are relatively isolated and outdoorsy. However, Middlebury is closer to mountains and skiing.</p>

<p>Middlebury is slightly more selective academically.</p>

<p>There is probably plenty of drinking at both schools. However, Midd has banned frats, while Colgate still has a Greek system. Schools that ban frats typically experience a reduction in the levels of partying/drinking.</p>

<p>In general, Colgate takes athletics more seriously: Colgate is NCAA Division I, while Midd is NCAA Division III. </p>

<p>In women’s rowing, the distinction is even starker: the Colgate women’s team competes in NCAA Division I, whereas Midd has a club team (in other words, not even NCAA Division III). The differences are probably similar in men’s rowing, but men’s rowing is not an NCAA sport, so the Divisional distinction does not apply. The Midd rowing teams, as club teams, are probably open to any interested student; this may or may not be the case at a DI school like Colgate.</p>

<p>People applying to Midd or Colgate commonly also apply to Dartmouth, Williams, Bowdoin, and SLU. You seem to have all of these covered, except for Williams.</p>

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<p>On the conservative collegeguide.org site, Colgate gets a “yellow” and Middlebury a “red”. That is, they consider Colgate a little more welcoming to conservative, libertarian, or religious students. Very few LACs get a “green” (only 2 or 3 in the US News top 30, I think).</p>

<p>You can read up to three reviews on this site free of charge.</p>

<p>Thanks for the help guys…ugh decision time</p>

<p>I know both schools are very acadmemically selective and high-calibre, but some of the stuff i’ve read indicates that Midd is more intellectual while Colgate is more pre-professiosnal. Any truth to this?</p>

<p>I recognize the disparity between rowing teams, although I’m applying to a range anyway, form a highly competitive lightweight team (Dartmouth) to a fairly low quality club team (western). My main prioity is just to be able to row, ideally with a fairly competitive and dedicated group.</p>

<p>As far as politics I’ve browsed through the site you mentioned and was initially scared by that rating, although I’ve heard Midd is failry modereate in other sources. Anyone have any personal expereince?</p>

<p>S applied to both, visited both and was accepted to both. In the end it came down to these two schools and one other.</p>

<p>However, in visiting Colgate for a second time and spending a lot of time talking to current students he came away with the feeling that there were a lot of Colgate students who had not been accepted to Midd (and it had been their first choice). So… when he visited after acceptances and was asked, there was a large number who said, “that’s where I wanted to go, but I didn’t get in.” Not to say they aren’t happy as clams to be at Colgate, but just repeating the story.</p>

<p>Second, again in talking to students and hanging out, he felt like there was a lot more partying at Colgate. Not that there isn’t a lot of partying at Middlebury - there absolutely is. But there are probably fewer nights of the week dedicated to it at Midd.</p>

<p>Also, in trying to ask kids about their classes and professors, and this was the main thing that made up his mind, the kids he spoke to just didn’t seem as engaged in their classes as those students he spoke to at MIddlebury, who talked a lot about class (clearly enthusiastic) outside of it. I would suggest that Midd is probably slightly more intellectual, but let’s face it, it’s not UChicago. :slight_smile: </p>

<p>Athletics: There is the DI, DIII distinction, but I don’t think you can say Midd doesn’t take it’s athletics seriously. They do, however, really hold true to the scholar athlete mentality. As for school spirit, Colgate students left him with the impression that they didn’t much go to the games etc whereas at Midd almost “everyone” attends certain sports games (lacrosse and hockey top the list) and school spirit is evident at all. But, Midd’s ski team is DI. And Middlebury would probably trounce Colgate at lacrosse regardless of division. They are regulars at the final four. </p>

<p>Can’t really speak to politics, but there was a huge hubbub at Colgate last year when they brought in what I thought were fabulous speakers being poorly attended. I believe Colin Powell was among them. However, while liberal minded for sure, I don’t think there is any persecution of political leanings.</p>

<p>Financial aid: cannot speak to this, either but I believe both are need blind and meet full demonstrated need.</p>

<p>All of this said, son has said he would be happy regardless and it was a good problem to have to be accepted at both, but he is thrilled to be at Middlebury. He loves everything about the place… and will spend Jterm skiing at the Snow Bowl. What’s not to love? Both schools are lovely and offer a first rate education. As we said when the decision was on the table, having the choice of either was a good place to be.</p>

<p>Personally, I had no horse in the race, but my one complaint of Colgate was the constant walking of stairs. When they say it’s on a hill… they aren’t kidding! Son says Midd seems really spread out at times. And… son says the food at Midd is actually good. AND he can eat as much as he wants so he might go in at 4 for a snack before working out/practice and then eat a real dinner later.</p>

<p>

This is a common misconception. Several NESCAC schools, including Midd, Williams, Bowdoin, Bates, and Colby, have NCAA ski teams, but they are all formally classified as NCAA DIII, for both [url=<a href="http://web1.ncaa.org/onlineDir/exec/sponsorship?sortOrder=0&division=3&sport=MSK]men’s[/url"&gt;http://web1.ncaa.org/onlineDir/exec/sponsorship?sortOrder=0&division=3&sport=MSK]men’s[/url&lt;/a&gt;] and [url=<a href="http://web1.ncaa.org/onlineDir/exec/sponsorship?sortOrder=0&division=3&sport=WSK]women’s[/url"&gt;http://web1.ncaa.org/onlineDir/exec/sponsorship?sortOrder=0&division=3&sport=WSK]women’s[/url&lt;/a&gt;] teams. </p>

<p>The confusion arises because all college ski teams in the northeast compete with each other, regardless of formal NCAA division; thus the DIII NESCACs compete in the same events with DI schools like Dartmouth, UNH, or UVM. However, the NESCACs are still DIII, and must abide by DIII rules; for example, they cannot offer athletic scholarships to skiiers, as DI schools can.</p>

<p>

Doubt it. Midd does very well in the NCAA DIII playoffs, but Colgate is well ranked in DI. In 2008, they beat Syracuse, the eventual DI national champion that year.</p>

<p>I’m pretty sure Colgate is not needs-blind. You better check on that. I think they do meet 100 percent of need if you’re accepted though. In my opinion Middlebury is very generous with financial aid and I know some people choose to attend because of this.</p>

<p>Middlebury it is. Thanks guys, I probably would have been happy with either, both are great schools, but Midd just seems to be a better fit. Now I just wait…see where I get in and get money.</p>

<p>COLGATE DEFINITELY FTW!</p>

<p>Screw you darlie.</p>

<p>Colin Powell’s lecture was not “poorly attended” - there were 5000 people there! (I was one of them). </p>

<p>Colgate and Middlebury are both great schools. Good luck with your application to Midd!</p>

<p>As I said, Colin Powell was “one of” the fabulous speakers brought in and the complaint was that opportunities IN GENERAL weren’t being enjoyed by as many students as they should. Not that this particular one wasn’t, but that in general there was a feeling of student apathy despite the great opportunities. I think it was an op ed in the school paper around that time. However, I also recall that the review of Powell’s talk was that he was very funny and engaging. I thought it would have been fantastic to hear him speak - and while he backed Obama, he is pretty conservative in general.</p>

<p>Good to know the distinction of the skiing thing. Wonder why there is the misconception and why the ski in an independent conference. I also noted that Midd does the same thing for women’s golf. </p>

<p>And I will concede your point on Colgate’s lax as I know they played very well in 2008 (as that’s the year we paid the MOST attention). As for their game v syracuse - face offs win games, this is certain. Still, my point was mostly that the distinction of DIII and DI is not “seriousness” as much as there are not mandatory team practices/work outs (and in the case of lax - fallball) at DIII schools but that the athletes themselves are very dedicated and talented.</p>

<p>I said it before and I’ll say it again… There were three schools on the final table and all of them were excellent. Kid would could see himself being very happy at any of them and personally, I think that was the right attitude vs. falling in love with one school and hoping beyond hope to get in. Of the kids who attend Colgate from our HS, all are really really happy with being there. That there is no application fee is a real bonus.</p>

<p>list of full need colleges:</p>

<p>[Need-blind</a> admission - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia](<a href=“http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Need-blind_admission]Need-blind”>Need-blind admission - Wikipedia)</p>