This analogy doesn’t quite work. The fact that Wellesley has no male students is just that, a fact, something straightforward that is easily determined by 30 seconds on their website. The fact that BC is affiliated with the Catholic church is likewise no mystery, and I agree that nobody should get as far as a visit without knowing it. But the degree to which this affiliation informs the school’s atmosphere and “vibe”–this is something subjective and, I would argue, extremely difficult to get a read on by any other way than going there and seeing the place and the people for yourself. It is completely understandable and unsurprising that a prospect might arrive for a visit thinking the religious affiliation would not be a deal-breaker, and depart thinking otherwise.</p>
<p>I agree. But I just don’t understand why people wouldn’t, say, expect the “most Catholic” instead of expecting the “least Catholic” (or at least be open mentally to the entire spectrum). So although “Catholic” is a broader descriptor, it does not need to be treated as such.</p>
<p>^Because people constantly talk (rightly) about how open Jesuit Catholic universities like Georgetown and BC are to non-Catholics and non-Christians. But the latter group, especially, may arrive on campus, see the ubiquitous iconography, and decide that they really aren’t that comfortable, thanks. No harm done–a Catholic school is a Catholic school, and if someone is uncomfortable with publicly displayed Catholic iconography, then they probably wouldn’t fit in at that school.</p>
<p>Let’s say that people are mentally open to the entire spectrum of “Catholic-ness.” Doesn’t that still merit a visit, to determine “how Catholic” the school is?</p>
Because that may not be the only thing about the school that interests you, and you don’t want to foreclose prematurely on a potentially good option. A Catholic university might be very strong in several areas that matter to you–so you might keep it on your list, hoping that the religious atmosphere will not turn out to be so pronounced as to make you feel like you don’t belong there. You visit to find out if the reality answers your hopes. If so, great; if not, you cross it off your list. Why is this a problem?</p>
<p>Yes, Keilexandra, that would merit a visit. And I’m not saying that people are not allowed to find a particular atmosphere too religious or not religious enough. It’s just that surprise at the situation is (IMO) always unwarranted. Furthermore, I still don’t understand the idea of looking into a religious school but not being okay with a particular level of religion, given the enormous number of universities out there.</p>
<p>So, I can comprehend the situation, I just cannot really understand why it would ever come up.</p>
<p>But this is an interesting topic for a thread just on it. So, .</p>
<p>I looked into Macalester, which has a technical religious affiliation, after numerous people told me that the religious atmosphere was nonexistent. I haven’t actually visited, but after doing extensive research, I have no reason to doubt that particular aspect of the school. And since it is one of very few LACs that offer a major in linguistics, I’m glad that I didn’t dismiss the school out of hand due to its (meaningless) religious affiliation.</p>
<p>Catholic colleges: between my two kids, we visited 4 of them - Holy Cross, Providence, Stonehill and Fairfield - and came away with a feeling that each of them had a different level of “religiousness” if that’s a word. Holy Cross was almost apologetic about being Catholic. Providence was the most proud of their Catholic identity and seemed to take it the most seriously, while still welcoming students of all faiths. Stonehill seemed to embrace the loving/caring side of Catholicism, in their concern for the well-being of the entire student, without pushing specific Catholic theology too much. At Fairfield, it seemed to be a minor, background part of the school. </p>
<p>All of those were impressions just picked up in a day of touring, though, and might be inaccurate. My point is that just because a school is “Catholic,” the amount that their religious identity informs their culture can vary widely. I don’t think you’d really get a feel for it without a visit.</p>
<p>D’s school, Elon, and S’s school, Lafayette, have historic affiliations with Protestant churches, but at this point the affiliations are just that - historic. Neither has any strong ties to their churches or any requirement to take any theology classes. In fact, the most common religion among both student bodies is Catholic.</p>
<p>Re: Elon, D thought it OK, but too small for her and had small size marching band which she wanted to continue after hs. I didn’t see any overt religious icons such as described at Gtown, but check out their history:
Up until 1999, the mascot of Elon was the Fightin’ Christians. The moniker is said to have been coined by a sportswriter covering a contest in the 1930s between Elon and nearby Guilford College, a Quaker school. Prior to the 1930s, Elon was known by several nicknames. The nickname was chosen due to Elon’s proximity to the Wake Forest Demon Deacons, and the Duke Blue Devils. However, many did not feel that the nickname was universal enough for a team making the transition to Division I athletics, so a new mascot was adopted, the Phoenix. The choice came from the 1923 fire that destroyed almost the entire campus. Soon after the fire, the university trustees began planning to make Elon “rise from the ashes”. The Phoenix was a mythical creature that rose from the ashes of its predecessors.</p>
<p>My son was attracted to Georgetown’s stellar School of Foreign Service, but for him (confirmed atheist) he was very worried about the religious aspect. Although he applied, had he been accepted he would certainly have scheduled another longer visit to see if he could really see himself there.</p>
<p>My son is also considering Gtown’s SFS and none of us saw any problem with any Catholic iconography there. It is what it is and we saw absolutely no sign that my Jewish son would have any problem there whatsoever.</p>
<p>Georgetown grad. I was a confirmed atheist and I thought the religious overtones really added to my education. Jesuits are very open and questioning themselves. Our religious intro class that all freshman took was “Problem of God.”</p>
<p>The religious classes looked great - very interesting. Religion is so important to the way the world works I think there could be a great benefit to a school like Georgetown. It was clear that Georgetown was very open to other religions, still it was a question in his mind. In the end Georgetown made the decision for him though.</p>
<p>We got mooned by a student while on a tour at Oberlin…very funny. Nice students.</p>
<p>Fascinating guide at Swarthmore…great tour.</p>
<p>WashU - incredibly friendly campus all around…students asking if they can help, smiling, talking to us in line at Subway. Lovely place.</p>
<p>MIT - very interesting. Student painting on hallways of dorms was very cool.</p>
<p>FSU - very pretty…very good tour and question answer session.</p>
<p>UF - good tour and guide later recognized my D eating lunch and came up and asked if she had any other questions which was cool as she was in the major my D is interested in. </p>
<p>Harvard - very full of themselves…couldn’t lower themselves to put up signs on buildings and answer questions about undergrad. Ugh!</p>
<p>Brown - spent a month there and couldnt stand the campus. It probably had to do with me living in the furthest dorm from campus (15 or so minute walk to get to anything!). Decided I wanted a more centralized campus
Colby - just didn’t like it, felt too small, didn’t like the town
Boston College - thought I would like it because I like Notre Dame, but turned out to not care for it at all!</p>
<p>But besides that, almost every other college I visited (like 20 or so) I LOVED. They were all amazing in their own way, and there are some (like Rice and Middlebury) that I’ll be encouraging juniors to apply to, even though I ended up not choosing them :)</p>
<p>I didn’t realize how large of a role campus would play in my decision!</p>
<p>“I was surprised to learn during the BC crucifix controversy that 70% of the student body is Catholic.”</p>
<p>There are Catholics and there are CATHOLICS. When I was at BC, I was technically Catholic (brought up Catholic). But I was in my rebel period, and never once went to mass the entire time I was there. I wasn’t even aware of any other student going to mass. And never did anybody question me about my faith or lack of faith. In dorms, some students were Lutheran, Jewish, Greek Orthodox, atheist, etc. I can’t ever recall one’s religion being an issue, pro or con. Being a Red Sox fan vs. being a Yankees fan was a FAR FAR FAR FAR bigger issue than religion. </p>
<p>Also, Jesuits who are professors can surface in all sorts of departments, not just Theology. They are an amazingly diverse and questioning group who have advanced degrees from top colleges of all types (not just Catholic ones), with forced dogma being what they hate, rather than what they are in favor of. And correct me if I’m wrong, but if you ask a Jesuit what he studied at the school where he becomes a Jesuit, he’s more likely to say “philosophy” than “theology.” </p>
<p>As for a crucifix in a classroom being indoctrination, all I can say is I got an M.A. at the U of Toronto, and there were Canadian flags all over the place. Not once did I feel like anyone was trying to make me a Canadian. When you go to a Chinese restaurant, do you think they want you to be Chinese? When you drink a Guinness, do you feel more Irish? I eat “Ma Cohen’s” pickled herring all the time, and don’t feel the pull to wear a yarmulke.</p>
<p>Subtle difference, but when I said “Catholics,” I meant those who were raised Catholic, and for statistical purposes might report themselves as Catholic, but who aren’t in fact practicing. By “CATHOLICS” I meant those who practice Catholicism, whether it be in a subtle or private manner or in a more obvious manner. I have yet to meet any CATHOLICS (including my sister-in-law who is a nun) who would pose any sort of problem for a non-CATHOLIC in a university setting.</p>
<p>I think Baelor would say the more subtle CATHOLICS are not really different from [non-practicing] Catholics. Which is certainly one way of looking at it, but I think he’s in a tiny minority when he does so.</p>