<p>Are they even comparable?</p>
<p>On an academic level, not really, though NYU is improving in that arena. Some of its departments are superior to Columbia's, notably French and Philosophy. It also lavishes more money on student activities and housing, though it's more expensive overall as a result. My girlfriend transferred from NYU to Columbia and said that the workload and classroom atmosphere at Columbia are much more demanding. Apparently, classroom discussion at NYU is far less active/intense. </p>
<p>There's also the location factor. NYU is located in a far busier, probably (depending on your interests) more interesting part of the city. It's within walking distance of many of Manhattan's chicest shopping and nightlife neighborhoods. Morningside Heights is filled with academic institutions and more befitted to scholarly repose...people find that having a campus and a school-oriented neighborhood creates somewhat of a "cocoon" from which to retreat from the wider city when desired. This isn't so much the case with NYU, where Washington Square's open air drug market barely simulates a campus, despite the assurances of NYU boosters. Nevertheless, for Columbia students, going out to neighborhoods NYU students can walk to will involve a subway trip of a half hour at least. Still, Columbia is closer to Central Park and the uptown musea, and tends to take greater advantage of those.</p>
<p>Add to that:</p>
<ul>
<li><p>Columbia has a real campus, which can feel like your own little bubble of "home". You're surrounded by students, by academic buildings, in what really is a community. NYU has no such thing, unless you count hanging out with the junkies in washington square park.</p></li>
<li><p>NYU has real strength in their theater / performing arts departments. Columbia doesn't even have one (you take the classes at Barnard), and what it has available is poor. Miller theater runs a pretty good schedule of non-student performances, but it's nowhere near Tisch.</p></li>
</ul>
<p>Columbia is the better school overall but if you're considering the two schools with a major factor being NYC, then visit. Columbia2007 made a good point - NYU is located more towards the center of Manhattan and spread throughout the downtown/midtown area, so you will step out of your residence hall and be in the city with people everywhere. When I went to Columbia, I realized just how far uptown it is and while there is activity, it doesn't really feel like the NYC most people have in mind when you step out into Morningside Heights. It's very laid-back, so it all depends on your personality. For academics, NYU is only really comparable to Columbia if you go to Stern/Tisch/or the majors listed above. Columbia is by and far the better school for academics because it is an ivy league college with a much smaller student body, but there are certain areas of NYU (mentioned) that can make NYU better than Columbia for some people.</p>
<p>Ultimately, my decision of which one I would want to attend boiled down to visiting the two. I am someone who wants New York City and to be immersed in the culture, so I would choose NYU Stern over Columbia. People that attend Columbia for Econ (the general pre-business plan for schools without an undergrad business school) will usually be competing with Stern graduates for the same quality jobs, so they are about equal in that consideration.</p>
<p>And one last thing - my parents kept telling me you can just take the subway, which is true. It only took us about 10 minutes to get from Times Square to Columbia, but you have to remember that if you go out at night (which you'll probably do a lot) you'll have to ride the subway all the way back to 116th street at night...which could make some people uneasy.</p>
<p>Times Square to 116th in 10 minutes? That's pretty rare; usually it's much busier and consequently (due to more time spent at stops) a longer ride. Plus there's always some kind of service disruption taking the express trains offline, or moving them to different tracks...New York can just be difficult to move around at times. I recall reading about a race in which some people managed to drive from Columbia to Yale in a shorter period of time than one could make it from Columbia to NYU on a busy weekend...</p>
<p>I wouldn't worry about taking the subway at night though. It's usually fairly busy and even crowded all the way up to 116th until 2am on weekend nights. It's only really 2-5am that one should be more cautious, riding with the conductor or in cars with the most people, etc. And to the extent that subway crimes do happen, they're usually during rush hour...</p>
<p>Yeah, I wouldn't go acting like NYU students don't take the subway anywhere. It's a fact of NYC life, and since the 1990s it's been very, very safe.</p>
<p>With express trains, 116th to times square takes 15 minutes. Without, it takes 20 minutes. NYU to times square is comparable, but there's a greater range of stuff in their neighborhood.</p>
<p>Morningside Heights isn't a bad neighborhood to be in, mind you. Crime rates are the second-lowest in the city (after the upper east side), it's very residential, there's a lot of services like 24-hour supermarkets, bars, good restaurants, etc. It's much more of a "safety zone" than NYU's quasi-campus is. That has some benefits to it, I think - you can easily access anything in manhattan, but when you come home, you can also go to sleep at night.</p>
<p>From what I've read, I've seen that Columbia's students are a lot more competitive and much less relaxed than NYU students. And there isn't even an undergraduate journalism program at Columbia, is there (I think)? So I think that in that respect NYU is a lot better than Columbia.</p>
<p>If you don't care as much about academic excellence and want to skip ahead to a narrowly focused trade-school education, yes. </p>
<p>Perhaps that distinction should have been pointed out earlier- NYU is a lot more preprofessionally focused. Columbia is more liberal arts oriented, preferring to develop well-rounded individuals. Even our engineers take a good deal of the Core. NYU is perfect if all you want is four years of urban playground outside your front door with a high paying job waiting at the end- with no stopping in between to, well, become intellectually enriched. </p>
<p>Of course one can enter the arts and sciences program at NYU, but it's neither as competitive with Columbia post-graduation as NYU's preprofessional schools nor as high quality academically.</p>
<p>We went up to Columbia on a Saturday while I was visiting, and it took 10 to 15 minutes to get there. The subways were also not packed on that trip, but on the way back they were packed. My point a/b taking the subway at night is that Columbia students are probably going to want to head downtown/midtown for entertainment, which is a pretty good distance. NYU is kind of in the middle of the entertainment, so if you are riding the subway it won't be for as long. Also, I'm sure Morningside Heights is safe at night, but we were walking through Greenwich Village at around 10:30 at night and there were still a ton of people on the sidewalks. We also went by several restaraunts that had tables set up outside so the area felt extremely safe. The same goes for the rest of the midtown area and down towards Times Square...people are always up...except in Chinatown. We got the hell out of there. lol</p>
<p>I heard business leaders in Chinatown were planning to make efforts to open the neighborhood up more at night; I agree it's a bit creepily empty there given the activity during the day. </p>
<p>As for M. Heights- it seemed like the nightlife was better there when I was a freshman. Am Caf was still an affordable student bar rather than an upscale tapas place...now the West End seems to be going the same route. The Heights is still fine but was always too small, Casbah Rouge (the new Moroccan hookah place) is somewhat pricey and seems to attract a lot of creepy guys...1020 is probably the only decent place left to go out to in M. Heights proper. More people have started to head south to Mona, Lion's Head, O'Connell's, and the Abbey, sapping even the local nightlife. One would think more stores and restaurants would stay open in the Heights past midnight given Columbia students' sleep schedules...</p>
<p>I hope the effect of all this is not that local nightlife gravitates to the fraternities (though I suppose it's more likely that it would cease to exist altogether)...the neighborhood bar culture is a seminal aspect of the Columbia experience.</p>
<p>In response to Denzera comment about Miller Theatre....you can't compare it to Tisch. It's like comparing apples to oranges. Tisch is a school within NYU while Miller is just a venue. Furthermore, most of the performances at Miller are of music- classical and some experimental, while one associates Tisch with drama and musical theatre. So saying performances at Tisch are 'better' than Miller just doesn't make any sense.</p>
<p>Brand,
Your following comment is ridiculous on two levels:
"Ultimately, my decision of which one I would want to attend boiled down to visiting the two. I am someone who wants New York City and to be immersed in the culture, so I would choose NYU Stern over Columbia. People that attend Columbia for Econ (the general pre-business plan for schools without an undergrad business school) will usually be competing with Stern graduates for the same quality jobs, so they are about equal in that consideration."</p>
<p>1) How would not going to Columbia allow you to be immersed in the culture of NY??? Last I checked, it was in Manhattan. I graduated Columbia and the university has numerous programs with cultural institutions, including the Met, where students can supplement their education in the classroom.<br>
2) Columbia is not competing with Stern when it comes to quality jobs. Rather, the school competes with the other ivies. Not to knock Stern, I know plenty of people who attended that school, but I don't think there is really a comparison. I would consider Wharton more of a comparison since Columbia doesn't offer a Bachelors in business. </p>
<p>BTW, my wife attended NYU and she had problems with the school when it came to housing and getting the right classes to graduate. She personally preferred the Columbia campus, but I would suspect some kids might like the look and feel of NYU's more urban experience by not having a traditional campus.</p>
<p>I love it when people consider their opinion to be the end of the discussion.</p>
<p>In regards to my ridiculous comment, I'll admit that I don't attend either university yet. From my visit, it was clear to me than NYU is in a far more active part of NYC than Columbia. No, I never said one at Columbia couldn't immerse themselves in the culture. You can always hop on the subway and go midtown/downtown, but that is my point. With NYU, you step outside and you're there. With Columbia, you step outside of the gates and you are in a far quieter area of NYC. Which is exactly why I suggested people visit the universities. </p>
<p>As far as competing for jobs, I've heard that they do compete, but hey I don't have evidence for that other than from this website (and I guess you don't either). I would think that in the area of finance, where Stern is considered the 2nd best in the nation after Wharton, graduates of that school are competing with Columbia for similar jobs on Wall Street. But hey, if you honestly think Columbia is that much better, that's fine. I disagree. I think you are underestimating just how far an education at the second best school for finance can take you compared to an ivy league.</p>
<p>As far as Wharton versus Columbia, I would presume that most people interested in business would consider an undergraduate education at Wharton quite a bit better than a liberal arts education at Columbia. It is difficult to compare them as you are considering two different methods of education, but someone on the business track would probably be making the wrong career move if they chose Columbia over Wharton (unless they were just in love with the Core). I don't think Columbia students are on the same level IN THE BUSINESS FIELD as those from Wharton, given the profound advantages Wharton gives its students.</p>
<p>I would like to think I have evidence of this since I am on the recruiting committee of my division at Goldman Sachs and I graduated from COLUMBIA. </p>
<p>Anyway, as far as Wharton, there are recruiters here, and at all the top banks, who prefer liberal arts graduates over business administration grads. I majored in Political Science because at one point I thought I wanted to attend law school and not be limited to a school with just a business focus. As a result, I turned Wharton down. I am sure there are folks who chose instead to study in Philly. </p>
<p>Also, someone on this site indicated that Columbia was competitive. That is absurd in my opinion. At any university one should expect to find some students to be ultra-competive but I suspect that in most cases that is usually not the norm. I found my experience to be not at all cutthroat and non-competitive. I keep in contact with many friends from college and they agree. </p>
<p>I will be in St.Barts for a week starting tomorrow, so I will not be able to respond to any follow-ups. Have a great labor day weekend!</p>
<p>Well that is some strong evidence then. :) I still highly doubt Columbia graduates have a huge advantage over Stern Finance graduates on Wall Street.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I don't think Columbia students are on the same level IN THE BUSINESS FIELD as those from Wharton, given the profound advantages Wharton gives its students.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>So says the expert. Yep, Wharton prepares you oh better than Columbia to make pitch books.</p>
<p>So we have a difference in opinions. No reason for everyone to start acting immature as they've been doing (and always seem to do). </p>
<p>My reasoning is that students that attend Wharton have many more business opportunities while they're in school than Columbia students. After hearing of Wharton students that have gotten to go to the houses of fortune 500 CEOs, on top of many other things, I would say someone wanting to launch into the business world would make better contacts if they went to Wharton.</p>
<p>Brand - you don't go to the school. Your continued posts really aren't telling the OP (or any reader) anything they wouldn't already know.</p>
<p>And in highly competitive fields such as Finance, Consulting, and media, Columbia places its students a lot better than schools like NYU. That's the reality, and College Grad is just more evidence for it. There are many reasons to prefer NYU over Columbia, most have been listed in this thread (and WindCloud's response to my post is spot on, as well). But let's stop kidding ourselves.</p>
<p>This isn't a Columbia vs Wharton thread, either. Those two are probably comparable in terms of placement in high-paying fields.</p>
<p>Denzera - I'm just responding to what College Grad said about my "ridiculous comment." Granted I don't attend either school, but I did visit both so I thought the actual location of Columbia vs. NYU is something for interested students to consider. </p>
<p>As far as the Columbia vs. Wharton, I stand by it. I am not advocating that Wharton is a better college than Columbia College, but for someone intending to go straight into business, I stand by my statement that Wharton would be the better choice for job placement.</p>
<p>Again, we're not talking about Wharton. We've been discussing Columbia vs NYU in terms of job placement, as with post #8 and #12.</p>
<p>If anyone has any other questions about distinctions between Columbia and NYU, I'm happy to respond, as I'm sure C07 and all the others are.</p>