Considering majoring in chemistry...help lol

In order to understand the more advanced math of pre-calculus, you will first need to study trigonometric functions.

Okay…so like sine/cosine/etc? That’s what I had been trying to understand and couldn’t

Does your math teacher have office/tutoring hours? You could try talking to the precalc teacher, too. Why is there only honors precalc? Do most of the students from your school go to college?

@CCtoAlaska many go to college, yes. She does, and I do ask for help often, but when I come back from break I am going to start using a mix of staying for help and studying at home because school’s often not enough (and sometimes, this happens in chemistry too, if they ask me the answer to a question, I freak out inside and just freeze up- I can’t think of the answer or speak a word). I think she is also the pre calc teacher. I do not know why there is only honors, honestly I had never considered the possibility of taking more advanced math because my confidence level is so low. A couple minutes ago I had looked over trig (from the beginning) and just shut down, even though I was understanding a bit (not pre-calc level as I talked about in the other comment) because I thought “there’s no way I am good enough to major in/do well in chemistry or to do well in math I need to humble myself” it’s making it near impossible to do anything, really. I hate making excuses, I work through it but it is miserable.
Sorry for the rant…a little off topic but it just hurts ya know

@edgeoftheworld it sounds like you need some intervention to help you manage your anxiety, some tools.

Honestly yeah. Sometimes even the thought of studying scares me so much all I can do when I get home from school is nap…I can’t go anywhere in life if I can’t change that

“College algebra” may describe a course approximating high school precalculus, but without trigonometry, and may be accepted as a prerequisite for calculus for business majors (but not calculus for physical sciences majors). Colleges offering such a college algebra course may also offer a precalculus course (with trigonometry) or a separate trigonometry course that students take to prepare for calculus for physical sciences majors.

@ucbalumnus wait…I’m confused, there are different types of precalc for different majors? Would I have to take a harder one? Maybe I’m not reading your comment right

There’s probably only one true type of pre-calculus, at least by traditional standards, and it includes trigonometry. “College algebra” may, it appears, serve as somewhat of a remedial course for students who did not progress on a standard college-prep math curriculum while in high school.

Just like there are regular and honors versions of HS classes (and, sometimes, AP) reflecting different levels of depth, breadth, autonomy, there are different levels of courses in college, which cover more or different content.
For instance, there’ll be physics for engineers, physics for pre-meds, physics for non majors. Getting into the wrong type of class can sink you because they’re really different and have different expectations, pre-requisites, and workloads. Not to mention they don’t work for all majors.
Colleges may have remedial math of two sorts, college algebra with trigonometry (leading to calculus for stem majors).

It’s NORMAL if you don’t understand trigonometry! Math is sequential. You need geometry completed to have a shot at understanding trigonometry. Don’t go all over the place - it’s not like history w where you can learn about America in the 1760s, Europe in the 1760s, China in the 1760s, The Gold Coast in the 1760s and although those would likely be part of three different classes you’d still be able to understand. Here, you need to know 1 then 2 then 3…
So, your first job for now is to see whether you can study geometry on your own, see your teacher for tutoring, and perhaps try and take geometry over the summer so that you can end your math sequence in precalculus. But for now, watch the khan Academy videos, do the exercises, do them slowly to make sure you understand. If you switch some elements are you still able to solve the problem?
Also, it sounds like you have anxiety - there are ways to help (just like if you were near-sighted, you’d have to wear glasses at some point…)

It’s not as complicated as the other posters make it out to be. The college will tell you exactly which classes to take. At big public colleges there are remedial courses for those who do not test into college-level math and the first college level math class is usually Intermediate Algebra, then you take Precalc 1 + Precalc 2 if they separate it out into two classes instead of having one, then Calc 1 in that sequence. There will be other classes for non STEM majors but the school will make it pretty clear which ones you are supposed to take.

It might be helpful to know - if you don’t mind sharing - how you did on the math portion of the SAT. That will be a good indicator of how ready you would be to enter a college-level math class.

SOOO, If you tested into Intermediate Algebra/college algebra (which is what happened to my chemistry major relative and, no, he did not intentionally get a low score!), you would have two or three classes to meet the prerequisites for Calc 1. So, it’s extra classes but it’s not a crazy number of extra classes and lots of students have to do all or a portion of this sequence and all those classes are college-level so they would count towards your degree although it won’t count as classes in your major. I think you would be able to start taking some physical science classes without having completed the math prerequisites - Intro Chem, etc. The really big issue would be if you didn’t test into college level Algebra and had to take remedial classes. Then I would worry.

Lower level / remedial college math and their approximate high school equivalents:

Elementary algebra = high school algebra 1
Intermediate algebra = high school algebra 2
Plane geometry = high school geometry
Trigonometry = trigonometry (part of high school precalculus)
College algebra = high school precalculus without trigonometry
Precalculus = college algebra + trigonometry = high school precalculus (with trigonometry)

Note: to add to the confusion, some colleges use “precalculus” to describe a course that other colleges describe as “college algebra” (i.e. like high school precalculus without trigonometry).

For students placed into lower level math in college, college algebra may be suitable for business majors who are allowed to take a calculus for business majors course that does not do anything with trigonometric functions. However, chemistry and other physical science majors need to complete trigonometry in order to prepare for calculus that does deal with trigonometric functions.

Note also that some students who completed high school precalculus and then take a college’s math placement test could do well enough in the precalculus material except trigonometry. In this case, they could take calculus for business majors if they are business majors, but would have to take trigonometry before taking calculus for physical science majors.

Ideally, a student who completed precalculus in high school should be ready for any kind of calculus in college, but many high schools’ precalculus courses are not that high quality, and many students slack off in 12th grade or forget material as soon as they finish the final exam. Hence colleges use placement tests to check students’ actual math knowledge.

Here is an example prerequisite math chart:
https://www.smc.edu/AcademicPrograms/Mathematics/Documents/Math-Chart.pdf

Note that there may be some differences (particularly in the names of the precalculus-level math courses) at different colleges.

The content of high school precalculus would be equivalent to Math 2 (precalculus), or Math 3 (trigonometry with applications) and Math 4 (college algebra for STEM majors). Note that this college has a separate precalculus / college algebra course for business majors (Math 26).

As a chemistry major, you would need to get to the equivalent of Math 7 (calculus 1) and Math 8 (calculus 2) at least; at many schools, you may have to complete through one or more of Math 11 (multivariable calculus), Math 13 (linear algebra), and/or Math 15 (differential equations).

As a former chemistry major, math is not a heavy issue. Everything you do is through dimensional analysis. Dimensional analysis is taught a that the beginning of the unit as soon you learn sig figs. Now, the hard part is trying to get the prerequisites to take the dreaded course in chemistry curriculum “Physical Chemistry.” The course takes everything you learned in General Chemistry 1,2 and makes you understand why certain reactions happen. In Gen Chem 1 you ask why this happened and what it was its purpose. Physical chemistry is mostly thermodynamics and quantum mechanics. Usually, PCHEM prerequisites are as following:
Calculus 1
Calculus 2
Calculus 3: Recommend but not required in all colleges. At my college, it was required
Differential equations: Not recommend but still useful
Linear Algebra: The most useful math course in any science major. Almost every science course you take always leads back to linear algebra. Helps break down system of equations of multiple variables to helping to find the unknown variable.
Calculus-Based Physics 1
Calculus-Based Physics 2
Algebra-Based physics 1and 2: You can get away with just taking the Algebra- Based sequence just have to find ways of telling your advisor. I did it and some of my friends did too.

The dreaded course in chemistry curriculum is “Organic Chemistry.” This course is known as the endpoint of many students like me who don’t understand the concepts very well but excel in the math portion. Gen Chem 1 and 2 was a breeze for me because it had math, however, I didn’t quite understand the concept good enough to the point I could tell my peers why this reaction happens without the math behind it.

I’m not here to discourage you, but Chemistry, in general, is hard. I thought I would get away with it, but in the end, I ended switching to math. Since you are a junior in high school, I encourage you to take AP credits like Calculus and physics. Don’t take AP chemistry is useless and won’t prepare you for college chemistry.

@NASA2014 I wouldn’t be able to take Honors Pre-Calc (closest to AP calculus at my school) as I do not meet pre-requisites for the class. The farthest I would be able to get, as far as I currently know, would be Academic Geometry my senior year. I can’t take AP physics- I can only take Academic Physics next year (senior year).
Oh, I don’t think chemistry is easy, I just think it is very interesting and I would like to pursue a career in it (I began to consider it after doing a job shadow, I shadowed someone working in quality control). Nothing I study comes easy to me, honestly, but when I’m not full of anxiety that’s what makes me appreciate whatever I am learning even more.

So, in general for math, is it going to take longer for me to earn a degree in chemistry if I would have to complete various math courses first? Or am I just going to have to take multiple classes in a semester?

@edgeoftheworld It depends after you take the placement. If you are placed in Precalc you would still take Gen Chem 1 and other gen eds.

@NASA2014 I meant if I did not place into a math course that was required for a chem major, would it delay my graduation

If you place into a math course below calculus 1, then you have a higher risk of needing extra semesters, particularly if your college’s chemistry major requires math higher than single variable calculus or requires calculus-based physics.

However, since you mentioned Clarion, it appears that they do not have as heavy math and physics requirements as some other schools, so that students can start in precalculus and still finish in 8 semesters: http://www.clarion.edu/academics/degrees-programs/course-map/bs-chemistry.pdf . So if you attend Clarion, you should be able to finish in 8 semesters if you place into precalculus or higher.

Beside Clarion, look into Slippery Rock, Lock Haven, Millersville, Penn State Greater Allegheny, Lycoming, Lebanon Valley, Susquehanna.