<p>I'm absolutely thrilled to be accepted to Swarthmore this year but I was a little concerned about a few things.</p>
<p>As an aspiring consultant, the individual attention and the strong undergraduate economics focus really attracted me. I really feel like I resonate with the campus culture because I love learning about strategy/history and linguistics, but I am pretty sure that I want to explore consulting after undergrad. I read somewhere that the Swarthmore culture does not look upon jobs like banking/accounting/consulting with great enthusiasm. Despite having a really high average GMAT score (<a href="http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2013-02-25/liberal-arts-college-boasts-best-gmat-scores">http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2013-02-25/liberal-arts-college-boasts-best-gmat-scores</a>), I'm also unsure about whether or not I can place into a good MBA program. For the students on campus right now, are there good consulting/business internships offered on campus? And can anyone comment on the alumni network in relation to large consulting firms (Bain/McKinsey/etc.?)</p>
<p>I love the campus and the people there, but I'm just unsure if I will fit in, which makes me very sadface. My other option is Berkeley and Amherst. I am not a huge fan of Amherst but I got regents at Berkeley. (and Rice/Emory/other UCs, but this is what I have so far)</p>
<p>There is a significant contingent of swatties who go the McKinsey/ HBS route. I think by 10 years after graduation they have usually left consulting but there are many swatties in their 20s and early 30s in that world. </p>
<p>Virtually all top MBA programs expect or essentially require 2+ years of work experience after your undergraduate degree before they will even consider you for admission. So you won’t see many business programs listed in the post graduation plans by major document. Swarthmore does not get the big recruiting visits from the management consulting firms to the extent that the Ivys do, but that is partly due to its size as a LAC. The Swarthmore culture is more oriented towards academia / non-profit / med school types of things than many other colleges, but you won’t be ostracized or anything for wanting to go into business. There are plenty of Swatties in the business world and quite a few do find their way into management consulting.</p>
<p>Ok. I have two responses: (i) Consulting is crappy and (ii) Swarthmore is great. </p>
<p>Consider (i). I humbly ask you to please spend some time evaluating why you want to become a consultant. If it’s the money and culture, let me emphasize that many consultants these days are doing consulting so that they can jump to startups. The intelligent and self-directed Swarthmore student can skip B-school and consulting and just move directly to the startup space either via engineering / computer science or just starting a company on her own. Further, I have the sense from talking to some guys at HBS that consulting post-MBA, though very popular, can be kind of sad because traveling is so high for the late twenty year old. There are much more highly paying jobs – calculated by hourly wage, say (e.g., P/E, quant modeling, software engineer / project manager) that the consulting abled student can do. </p>
<p>Let me criticize consulting some more from a different framework. In engineering / math courses, business-oriented professors often joke that the kids who get A’s are set for jobs in quant finance, the kids who get B’s are set for back office in quant finance, and the kids who get C’s… well they can go into consulting. The cliche that the Yale English major graduate who doesn’t know what she wants to do goes into consulting IS ACTUALLY TRUE. If you’re quantitatively oriented, use your people skills and quant chops in a way where you’re actually compensated well for this legitimately unique combination. </p>
<p>Bottom line: though apparently sexy, consulting can be really crappy. You can get that culture and pay elsewhere. </p>
<p>Consider (ii). First, Swarthmore has incredible placement into business school. The record of Swarthmore is a little bit sparse, though, because so few students from Swat actually choose to go. Swarthmore is probably more prestigious that Berkeley, and the college experience is pretty awesome. Don’t do Amherst –– they’re the worst. [I’m kind of kidding but not really.]</p>
<p>Fhimas, i’m surprised to see someone so intelligent reveal such limited consideration. Consulting isn’t all bad.</p>
<p>All of the travel you reference results in you experiencing an awful lot of the world from the inside. Whether its KC or KL, you get to work with people who see things differently; experience regional bias and cultural norms. As a person, the experiences can be incredibly diverse and informative. Seeing the world on someone else’s nickel while in your 20’s is awesome!</p>
<p>As for the work, you get to work on problem after problem…all with different parameters, Eco-systems and politics. You might consider that the reason the A and B students “do important work” is that they often lack the social skills and emotional intelligence to succeed with so many other personalities simultaneously. Consultants make a lot of money…because being good at that isn’t easy. You might have a point that SWAT students are too smart to lower themselves to such menial labor, but is it possible the kids who had fun in college have also figured out how to make a nice living too?</p>
<p>I don’t know any successful consulting firm that hires C students as a rule. Top consulting firms are very focused on GPA and they are typically looking for 3.5+ at a minimum. No offense Fhimas, but your analysis of the consulting profession is about as deep as your analysis oft Amherst (“they’re the worst”).</p>
<p>If you are in state Cal and you got Regents, go to Berkley, Great great school, tons of prestige, great 4 years, forget Swarthmore if you have any reservations, I assume you have already dropped Amherst. Berkley would be the best choice for you I think, great cache with ifirms/consult, I have worked with them and Cal has a great rep.</p>
<p>omg people are so serious here. Let’s be real guys – no post on CC can sum up an entire profession or an entire school. Even a long one couldn’t do that. Moreover, I put forth that all “facts” (perhaps given by not “limited considerations”) we have about the world are really just collections (perhaps those sorted methodically) of anecdotes (e.g., see frequentist statistics). So I share some of mine here. Calm down. </p>
<p>Let’s recount what I offered –– I offered several anecdotes I’ve collected from my time at Swat and top Ivies. That joke about consulting is one I hear everywhere. It’s a common joke, and one that seems to be true for guys taking technical courses who maybe don’t do so well and realize they need to stick with the social sciences or humanities lol.</p>
<p>Of course, intelligence is not uniquely given by technical ability – there are lots of things that consultants do that technical guys are probably not very good at. But I’d put forth that for the soon-to-be Swattie (given who self selects into Swarthmore!) probably likes better other things. </p>
<p>Thank you for all your responses! For reference, though I did mention some really competitive consulting firms, my ultimate goal is to work either with impoverished nations on economic re-stabilization or to work in the IMF in the UN. I just wanted to make sure that I got some real world experience with the toughest situations available. I also like Swarthmore because its a nice change of pace as a Californian. fhimas, thank you for your brutal honesty and I have read some of your past posts. Swat does sound like a really great fit for me, as I definitely want to do other things on top of Econ also (psychology, english, poly sci, cs just to name a few). I know that both Cal and Swat are good at both of them, but I feel like my natural talent (I guess you can make fun of me for being shallow/narrow minded) is to plan/create strategy/optimize etc. Sorry this is probably a word jumble, but I’m still confused and decision day is literally a week away. (I’m also waitlisted at Dartmouth, but I don’t think I will pursue my waitlist there)</p>
<p>No problem. It’s a very exciting time indeed. For IMF, UN stuff Swatties place very well into that. Swat is an awesome place to do the interdisciplinary stuff you seem to want to do. </p>
<p>Don’t worry about Dartmouth. Dartmouth is like a sad college for kids who want to work on wall street but didn’t get into Princeton. ;-p [I have many more anecdotes about Dartmouth if you like ]</p>
<p>If you are able to attend Ride the Tide the next two days, I think it will be helpful in making your decision. If not, here’s a bit of info. My son is an honors econ major. At Swat the personalized attention from professors is amazing as are the opportunities for fellowships and internships. With the honors program you can really focus on an area that interests you. My son’s conversations with students and professors at Ride the Tide, led him to Swat. When he returned as a first year in the fall, the professors remembered him! You have some great options, best wishes on finding the right match…</p>
<p>Thanks for all the advice and tips I talked with a Berkeley professor who went to Haverford and he encouraged me to go. This forum has been extremely helpful!</p>
Also, as far as I know, well-regarded MBA programs expect to receive applications from students who have been in the work force for a while, not from those just graduating from college. <a href=“
[I’m kind of kidding but not really.]</p>
I talked with a Berkeley professor who went to Haverford and he encouraged me to go. This forum has been extremely helpful!</p>