And in my state murder charges can also be brought if you are involved in another crime (such as robbery) during which a murder is committed. I think the same is true in at least some other states.
As repugnant as this case is, I was most sickened by the lack of reactions by students who saw this…somehow, this kind of scene has become normalized and my guess is that the students felt it was none of their business. Truthfully, as a parent, it freaks me out.
If I had a budget to spend, I would put it toward those programs that teach kids how to intervene when friends are on the brink of trouble or on the brink of perpetrating trouble. Bystanders don’t have to just let things happen, but they do need to believe that it’s OK to step in and take action.
How many times did we watch TV announcements that say, “Friends don’t let friends drive drunk” before (1) the message really started to take hold and (2) we had a vocabulary for uttering our concerns? I suspect the same thing applies here.
“Friends don’t let friends commit rape.” Hang that poster in every train, bus, and elevator. Expect a 20-year lag time before you begin to see significant results. Don’t shut down the program in the meantime.
How about raising our boys to respect women and to know the many ways girls/women say “no”? Its not just verbally, body language is key. How about raising our children to treat others as they’d like to be treated. How about setting good examples for children. How about raising our daughters to learn how to say NO verbally and every other way, instead of condoning a culture where experimenting with anyone and everyone is acceptable? How about teaching our children to respect THEMSELVES? My point: lets parent our children and not expect society to do it for us.
@southernhope ~ I agree. Freaks me out as well. We had a case locally where four young teenagers (14) were drinking on the beach and they left one of the young girls there because she had passed out and they didn’t want to get in trouble. She nearly died…fortunately someone walking the beach early morning found her passed out in her own vomit and called 911. Boy, that was a conversation at our dinner table! Who does that? Wow.
Vandenburg’s roommate was asleep in the room when the victim was carried in. They turned the lights on so it woke him up. He was subpoenaed to testify at trial and was grilled by the prosecution. Apparently, he was tired, not interested in participating and at first just rolled over in the top bunk and tried to go back to sleep. When he could not, he left the room allegedly in the middle of the attack to “go find some place else to sleep.” He really gave no reason for his inaction. Guess the old “bro code” is alive and well.
I concur that this is very disturbing and agree with SouthernHope that this type of behavior must be so common place that it just does not faze these kids anymore.
At least some schools are ramping up the bystander education that is aimed at this issue. I was surprised to read about a similar situation yesterday with a Stanford swimmer raping an unconscious woman. This time, two men did get involved and he is now facing 5 felony counts.
http://www.stanforddaily.com/2015/01/27/freshman-male-athlete-arrested-for-attempted-rape-on-jan-18/
“He was subpoenaed to testify at trial and was grilled by the prosecution. Apparently, he was tired, not interested in participating and at first just rolled over in the top bunk and tried to go back to sleep. When he could not, he left the room allegedly in the middle of the attack to “go find some place else to sleep.” He really gave no reason for his inaction.”
Disgusting. Without sounding like an old fuddy-dud, what IS with this new trend where people have their romantic partners in bed, in the same room as their roommate? Ew. Gross. Tacky. Classless. At least in our day, when we fooled around in dorm rooms, we had the decency to do it when we were alone!
Pizzagirl, I couldn’t agree more. Even when I see movies of the 60s with two couples making out at the drive-in I think “eww”, get a room LOL. Some modesty and class go a long way.
This was not a normal “sexile” incident. It was gang rape.
Not a new trend. Happened all the time at my well-known LAC in the early 80s.
Interesting perspective in a letter to the NY Times editor, from a father of a female college student.
"Part of this problem, an important part, came with the abandonment of the concept of “in loco parentis” by colleges. When voting was moved to 18 and full adulthood established at the same age, most colleges more or less washed their hands of supervision of student behavior. This simultaneously relieved the college of some of the legal responsibilities for what happens on campus and set off an era of unsupervised mayhem.
I visited a quiet, rather staid campus in Pennsylvania where our daughter went for a summer camp while in high school. The new dorm she stayed in had an innovation many now employ: a separate, isolation room at the ends on each floor where people can study, because the dorm rooms themselves can no longer used as quiet zones. During the academic year, music, loud, plays at all hours, talking and yelling, too, as well as random comings and goings of both sexes. Boyfriend wants to stay over in the dorm room? No problem, just ask the roommate to vacate or to put up with it.
When discipline breaks down, it keeps heading in that way, it doesn’t stop at social norms.
Fathers can do a great deal with their sons growing up be teaching them to respect women and how horrible it is for anyone to take advantage, by rape or any other means. Families can teach moral values about the responsibility to stop crimes when possible or report them immediately. People can be taught to be alert, aware and responsible.
This needs to be a national, sustained effort."
I read that article, but I’m not sure what the Vandy students “should” be doing about the rape trial. They obviously knew it was a horrible thing, and they should be proud that the university acted decisively and promptly (and of course disgusted by those who saw something but didn’t intervene), but what should they do, wear sackcloth and ashes over it? Of course it’s awful and I’m very glad these monsters will be behind bars for years, but the writer of the article seemed to want the Vandy students to give a pound of flesh too in some manner.
“Unsupervised mayhem” - that about sums it up.
“He was subpoenaed to testify at trial and was grilled by the prosecution. Apparently, he was tired, not interested in participating and at first just rolled over in the top bunk and tried to go back to sleep. When he could not, he left the room allegedly in the middle of the attack to “go find some place else to sleep.” He really gave no reason for his inaction.”
ugh…if I were that child’s parent, I would be so ashamed that my child did nothing to come to this girl’s rescue. Sick.
And it speaks volumes that the rapists knew that this roomie wouldn’t come to her rescue. They all are @#$%^&
And, yes, it is gross that people bring partners into dorm beds while others are in the same room. But, this was rape.
When I was in high school, one of my friends told me she lost her virginity in the back seat of a car while on a double date, and that she kept telling the other couple not to watch them. I remember being absolutely astounded that anyone would want to do something so meaningful (or at least something supposedly so memorable) in the presence of other people! I just could hardly believe she did that. I never ever heard again of anyone having sex around others while I was in college.
As to the defendant’s family being so surprised at his verdict, I wonder how they have categorized his behavior in their own minds, particularly after seeing the video.
<<<<
When I was in high school, one of my friends told me she lost her virginity in the back seat of a car while on a double date, and that she kept telling the other couple not to watch them.
[QUOTE=""]
[/QUOTE]
oh my!
I’m 59. I know age peers who did it for the first time in the back seat of a car on a double date in high school. Probably the only reason I don’t know more is because so many did it for the first time before they were old enough for driver’s licenses. We got our licenses at age 15.
I was allowed to car date when I was 13, but required to double date until I was 15. I kept trying to explain to my parents it didn’t impact whether I had sex or not. Sometimes the other couple might be. In retrospect, it probably did keep me out of situations where something could have happened I didn’t want to happen. There may have been less risk of assault. I don’t know. My father was pretty scary. All my high school boyfriends told me that. He had guns. (allusion to Yale incident thread)
@ Nrdsb4 “As to the defendant’s family being so surprised at his verdict, I wonder how they have categorized his behavior in their own minds, particularly after seeing the video.”
I think all they saw was they their son did not actually rape her. And because they did not understand the law (and the attorney did not explain it to them) they could not understand how a jury could find him guilty of an aggravated rape performed by someone else
.
Here’s exactly what the jury found, count by count, as to Vanderburg:
Count 1: aggravated rape, criminal responsibility for Batey’s anal penetration with fingers
Count 2: aggravated rape, criminal responsibility for Batey’s vaginal penetration with fingers
Count 3: aggravated rape, criminal responsibility for Batey’s mouth penetration with penis
Count 4: aggravated rape, criminal responsibility for Batey’s vaginal penetration with penis
Count 5: aggravated rape, criminal responsibility for anal penetration with water bottle by Brandon Banks
Count 6: aggravated sexual battery, criminal responsibility for contact with private areas
Count 7: aggravated sexual battery, slapping of buttocks
Count 8: tampering with evidence by destruction of condoms after rape
Count 9: unlawful photography, by sending images to other men